Now is the Time To Act! I am Serious! **updated**

[LaceyUnderall]

Symmetric -

Your not a naysayer. This is a side of the argument that can't go ignored. However, there are a few things to take into account when it comes to these clinical trials they are "demanding".

First, why should the ecig have to go through clinical trials to prove itself an alternative to tobacco cigarettes? Tobacco cigarettes are not held to such standards. The only reason one would need to have a clinical trial is to prove that the product in fact does help aid or treat or mitigate a disease. In effect, the trials would only prove that the electronic cigarette is a quit smoking device. Is it? Does it really get you to quit smoking?

Secondly, it doesn't matter what testing is done, or who proves what, as long as it isn't a pharmaceutical NRT it will not, and I cannot stress will not enough, ever be accepted by the American Cancer Society, nor Tobacco Free Kids, nor American Legacy, nor American Lung Association. Why? Most of their funding comes from Pharmaceutical companies. Call and ask to speak to any of these groups. Two of them is an eye opening experience. They do not mention once quitting cold turkey. All of them offer you one option: Try one of the approved NRT's.

In one article, they demand for scientific studies to be done. So Ruyan did those. Then they said those weren't sufficient because they were paid for by the manufacturer (which 90% of all pharm trials are paid for by the manufacturer). Then, they said those won't work and they want "real world statistics". They have ECF but they won't acknowledge any of us.

The bottom line is, they do not want the ecig to succeed UNLESS it is funded and backed by a pharmaceutical company who offers large donations to their particular groups. That's why many of these Dr's like Nitzkin and Siegel are getting flogged by their anti-smoking comrades because they stopped taking the payoff and decided that public health should be the concern, not profits.

While I completely agree that more testing is 100% necessary because I personally would like to know more about what I am smoking , I still firmly believe that until they force the tobacco cigarette to go through the strenuous tasks they are wanting the ecig to go through, they have absolutely no right to scream "it's in the public health interest" to demand these tests.

I mentioned in another post a few days ago that we must prove, as an industry, to the FDA, that we in fact are a cash cow and that will level the playing field for us with tobacco and pharmaceuticals. We are absolutely naive to believe that these will continue to go untaxed. We all figured they would tax us out of smoking, which they have done, but millions of people continue to smoke every day, regardless of the price of their cigarettes. In Canada, smokers still smoke even though their cigarettes are equivalent to $10 or more a pack. It doesn't stop them.

This quit or die society that we think we live in must seriously be turned on it's a$$. We have become complacent to allowing people to believe that it is ok to hate your neighbor and we have become permissive in thinking that it is ok to tell your neighbor what to do.

[LuckyCharm]

Every article/website I've seen that go against (or don't support) e cigs and vaping state that there have been no clinical trials on humans to cite when it comes to safety.

How hard would it be to get all of us who are already vaping on record as test subjects? Or do I misunderstand what constitutes a "clinical trial"? I'll go vape in a laboratory somewhere if that's what it takes.

~~Cheryl

[Bones]

Well said Lacey! - - - There is a dose of truth for ya!

Have to keep a time frame in mind when fearing bans - I think any ban that may arise would be more properly described as "temporary down-time" - time to allow the big players to make all the deals that will set the stage for the profit sharing - IF they do get pulled for any amount of time - It should be brief and only a precursor to an official relaunching under the new rules -Canada and the FDA have not said that they want the juice to go away forever - They have said they want it to go through proper approval procedures (a process that allows them to make the rules and get their cut - that is their job and function) - It was pretty ballsy and a slap in the face to these agencies for the industry to try to circumnavigate them - They have to do something - It would be like me opening a restaurant without permits and inspection and then being shocked that the Health Department shut me down for inspection and demanded I pay fees and fines before allowing me to reopen - 6 months - 5 years - Who knows - I think closer to 6 months or not at all - It is just silly to think that they will be taken away for good in all forms - Just as silly as it is to think that they would have been left to go on as is without being challenged or at the very least - taxed - SE and Njoy KNEW that they were breaking the rules - If they didn't - well - that's just poor managment - Look at JC and others like them who have submitted to the FDA and seek to cooperate with the rules - Not disregarding them and arguing about them - I don't see any of their business or shipments being interrupted - Like Lacey said - If we do see that - Then I will worry - There is a lot of speculation that the case going on now will be the final decision on the matter - Why is that? This is just one case over 2 specific companies - We do have an appeals process and many other legal roads to go down before we get to the end-game decision - And I doubt there ever will be one final decision - More likely a lot of different little decisions that all add up the path forward -

[Nix]

Well said Bones! We just need to play by the rules and avoid creating negative PR while the process happens.

[Symmetric]

Thanks, Lacey!

I agree with just about everything you said, especially that the vaping community is a CASH COW... I can't tell you how much money I've spent in the last 2 weeks trying out different products, flavors and nicotine densities (will probably end up refilling my own, but you gotta try what's out there).

[undertow911]

done. also reposted this on myspace. hope everyone else does the same on their myspace and facebooks.

will print and post it at work tommorow.

[LaceyUnderall]

Thanks, Lacey!

I agree with just about everything you said, especially that the vaping community is a CASH COW... I can't tell you how much money I've spent in the last 2 weeks trying out different products, flavors and nicotine densities (will probably end up refilling my own, but you gotta try what's out there).

Refilling as in dripping? Definitely the way to go. I don't suggest anything other. Best vapor each time. If you are going to make your own liquid... definitely visit the DIY section and read. Read lots before starting.

[CheeMiss]

The e cigarette industry has sponsored three known studies on the products to prove that they are safe and the studies are public.
Posted on June 2nd, 2009

CLICK ON LINK FOR FULL STORY!

E-Cigarettes Will Revolutionize The Face Of Tobacco Smoking And Could Pose A Threat To the Smoking Cessation Market

[CheeMiss]

- There is a lot of speculation that the case going on now will be the final decision on the matter - Why is that? This is just one case over 2 specific companies - We do have an appeals process and many other legal roads to go down before we get to the end-game decision - And I doubt there ever will be one final decision - More likely a lot of different little decisions that all add up the path forward -

Your entire post is very logical & well written!
Short, Sweet & TO THE POINT.

Way to many influential people are NOW aware of the e-cig. Gov't just can't sweep it under the rug.
Since most of us are leery of juice from China, watch the USA & Canadian powers of be get in on the act by offering venues of their own for the e-cig! Competition is great! Maybe prices will come down too?!

[marlin]

I think that most everyone here is missing the main point and agenda of the anti smoking nazis and the ones against e cigs, and that is to sway public opinion against the e cigarette so that it will be easy to gain public support to ban them, just as they did in Canada.

This is more of an information war than a legal battle, if this were not so, then they would already be off of the shelves and internet here in the US already.

I know that most here have used their in public, and got some attention real fast, but once you educated them, they were ok with it, and most think it is a great idea.

The special interest, that are funded by the big pharma and tobacco companies first started off stating that we could not say they are to help quitting, or it is a pharma product, so the industry stopped, now they claim that it is"not even used to stop smoking".

They are not using facts, but perceptions with their wording to scare the public into thinking that it is more dangerous that analogs, when the facts and basic science tells us that they are indeed safer just by the reduction of the amount of chemicals and elimination of cancer causing contents.

These attacks are to protect the incomes of the pharma and tobacco industries, not the health or safety of the people, and we all know that, but the general population does not know it, so they paint the picture for them as they want it to be.

No matter what happens, I will continue to expose the FDA, special interest groups, paid pundits and political sellouts.

If they sway public opinion, we lose. Don't believe it? Look at ........., they ran a massive propaganda campaign on that to outlaw it and still do it to this very day.

We have to keep educating the public about the studies completed, compare them to the results of chantx and zyban which are approved, and causing serious psychological problems to the tune of over 100 suicides, over 200 attempted suicides, hundreds of car wrecks and God knows what else.

Yet, even with this track record a spokesman for the FDA stated "The risk of serious adverse events while taking these products must be weighed against the significant health benefits of quitting smoking," said Dr. Janet Woodcock, director of the FDA's Center for Drug Evaluation and Research. "Smoking is the leading cause of preventable disease, disability, and death in the United States and we know these products are effective aids in helping people quit."

So, I guess quitting by "suicides" is acceptable for pharma companies and the FDA, but the e cig is just way too dangerous to profit...uh..er...let the public get their hands on.

I am sick of their criminal activities and will fight to the end to preserve my right to live a full life tobacco free.