Products and suppliers reported as unreliable

[fanofwalt]

Good golly, that's 41 pages of reading I just completed, but I've now gone through this entire thread. See, I'm a bright person who knows it's wise to do research before investing in relatively expensive items. In the meantime, bright person that I am, I ordered an inexpensive "free" trial e-cig (the only charge would be $9.95 s/h), so I could personally experience this new world of vaping somewhat while I take my time perusing the threads here for pros and cons of pricey kits and products from various manufacturers.

Ha ha! The joke was on me, wasn't it!?!

Had I read through this whole forum before ordering my free [*guffaw!!*] trial from SmokeAssassin, I would have seen a comment posted in July of 2009 that describes the very predicament I currently find myself in.

I learned about SmokeAssassin from my mom (non-vaper) who heard a "get a free e-cig trial" ad on the radio (I think she heard it on Rush Limbaugh's show); knowing that I was curious about e-cigs, she gave me the phone number to call. That was all the info I had going in, but hey, it's a free trial...what was there for me to lose? (And Fate cackled, "Bwah ha ha ha!!!")

SmokeAssassin's scam is: we tell you over and over on the phone that you'll only be charged $9.95 at this time; in 30 days you'll get charged a monthly fee unless you cancel the recurring monthly order before then. Okay, I can live with that concept. They even went so far as to say that I could *keep the starter kit and all its components* as long as I cancelled w/in that 30 day time frame...this sounded a bit odd, so I confirmed with the rep three times, and she assured me this was the case. Oh-kaaay....

It was only after the entire deal was completed -- and there was more to the deal than just the cigs; it included a "free trial" (uh oh!) to a couple of "discount merchants", that I fear I'll now be getting majorly billed for as well -- as I say, it was only after the deal was completed that I looked on their website, and discovered that their product contains zero nicotine. Ah. Newbie that I am, I didn't realize they came in zero strength; this was not what I was after.

Hoping to nip this in the bud, I checked to see whether my card had already been charged the s/h, so I could cancel before they even sent out the "free trial." (You know what's coming next, don't you...) My card had been charged not $9.95, but $79.99 despite their repeated declarations that the total would be no more than $9.95.

Optimistically (and not knowing beans about shady e-cig dealers), I figure it's merely an oversight and call back to alert them to their mistake, and to cancel the product since it's not what I want. They were shocked -- SHOCKED, I say! -- to discover this error (the same "error" posted by another ECF forum member back in July), but sadly, there was "nothing they could do" to refund my charge card, at least not for ten business days. I told them not to ship the item, but it had already been shipped (uh, say what?) or marked for shipping or otherwise set up such that they "couldn't" stop shipment of it. So it's on its way, allegedly, but they assure me I can return it to them once I receive it (but their assurances are now less than assuring).

The package should have been here by now, but hasn't yet arrived. No refund to my charge card yet. I am *very grateful* for gep's post in this thread, dated 9/18/2009, as I expect I'll be needing to make use of those links to address supplier ripoffs.

I'll update here with further developments in my adventure. Fully recognizing I'm a complete newbie here, and that my newbie status may automatically put my recommendation/review in the "take with a grain of salt" column, I nevertheless strongly urge you to run away with wings on your heels from SmokeAssassin. There seem to be several far better, much more reputable choices available.

If I walked into a store and took $70 out of the cash register without permission, I suspect the store owner would not be nearly as patient as many of us seem to be in awaiting our refunds of stolen money.

[Luv2CUSmile]

I know you said a lot more, but that's the part I want to reference. My query is horribly off-topic (but you started it).

"Smile" I get: it's a deliberately silly screen name (spelled out it makes sense - Don, the Boomer who Vapes). But "blush?" Maybe it's a generational thing.

Anyway, glad you have identified several suppliers you are comfortable with.

Don....
It makes me think of "The Boom Boom Room"!!! LOL
& there is still a few Boom Boom Rooms today>> not that they operate exactly the same as the 40's & 50's...60's or 70's... Oh My, Why do I know about Boom Boom rooms!?? LMAO- I guess it is a generational thing! Not telling my age though... am I?
Sry, I think it is a cute name... With your smoking jacket (in your avatar), you would fit in quite nicely... LOL

[acezzz]

As a rule, I check the location of a supplier before I purchase anything and make sure they have a phone# and physical address before I purchase anything from them. Also, the closer they are to me, the more likely I am to buy from them. That way if I have a problem with them and all else fails I can just get in my car and drive there and confront them in person. I know chinese suppliers usually have good prices but if they try to screw you what are your chances of getting any recourse? Im sure as hell not going to be able to get to china.

[radchronic]

Do not go for any deal which charges your credit card in the future unless you are dealing with reputable company and are fully aware of the terms. If you sign up to something and wish to get out, phone your credit card company right away and get the charges blocked, which sometimes they cannot do if it is an electronic transfer, in that case request a new card and cancel the old one. Most credit card issuers will do this, if they will not, find another issuer and cancel the old card right away. Use PayPal, if product is not received within 2 weeks notify PayPal and they will request a tracking # from the supplier, if the supplier cannot give a tracking #, PayPal will pull the $ from the suppliers acc. and refund to you. This will not stop a scammer from opening a phoney PayPal acc. but it has a little more protection for the buyer and the scammer cannot get funds from PayPal acc. unless you send them or your acc. password is compromised. As with all online accounts, keep your virus, phishing, etc. protection up to date, also do not let Windows or any software remember your passwords.

[Karma]

Hi, I'm a newbie, but I wanted to say... BestEcig.com is great as far as customer service, shipping speed and quality juice. (Probably not the best but I am enjoying the heck out of my coffee and Marlboro and my dad loves their menthol) But I wanted to note that I got a crapped USB passthru battery that killed one of my atomizers. Luckily I had bought a few dse 901 starter kits to pass on the cheap prices to friends who are absolutely mobbing me =P

I am using a dse901 from there and I think it might even be better than the original I had paid way way way too much for locally. I'm not sure it is an "authentic" dse901 but it works very well.

Also, the Super High juice from here is very satisfying for me. I don't have a lot to compare it to, but it kicks the bum of the stuff i bought locally.

As I mentioned, cheap prices. Shipping can be a little heavy, but go ahead and try lots of juices. You have to buy a LOT before it goes past $16.50 shipping. I am a happy newbie!

[ramblingrose]

...I ordered an inexpensive "free" trial e-cig (the only charge would be $9.95 s/h), so I could personally experience this new world of vaping somewhat while I take my time perusing the threads here for pros and cons of pricey kits and products from various manufacturers.

Ha ha! The joke was on me, wasn't it!?!

Had I read through this whole forum before ordering my free [*guffaw!!*] trial from SmokeAssassin, I would have seen a comment posted in July of 2009 that describes the very predicament I currently find myself in.

I learned about SmokeAssassin from my mom (non-vaper) who heard a "get a free e-cig trial" ad on the radio (I think she heard it on Rush Limbaugh's show); knowing that I was curious about e-cigs, she gave me the phone number to call. That was all the info I had going in, but hey, it's a free trial...what was there for me to lose? (And Fate cackled, "Bwah ha ha ha!!!")

SmokeAssassin's scam is: we tell you over and over on the phone that you'll only be charged $9.95 at this time; in 30 days you'll get charged a monthly fee unless you cancel the recurring monthly order before then. Okay, I can live with that concept. They even went so far as to say that I could *keep the starter kit and all its components* as long as I cancelled w/in that 30 day time frame...this sounded a bit odd, so I confirmed with the rep three times, and she assured me this was the case. Oh-kaaay....

It was only after the entire deal was completed -- and there was more to the deal than just the cigs; it included a "free trial" (uh oh!) to a couple of "discount merchants", that I fear I'll now be getting majorly billed for as well -- as I say, it was only after the deal was completed that I looked on their website, and discovered that their product contains zero nicotine. Ah. Newbie that I am, I didn't realize they came in zero strength; this was not what I was after.

Hoping to nip this in the bud, I checked to see whether my card had already been charged the s/h, so I could cancel before they even sent out the "free trial." (You know what's coming next, don't you...) My card had been charged not $9.95, but $79.99 despite their repeated declarations that the total would be no more than $9.95.

Optimistically (and not knowing beans about shady e-cig dealers), I figure it's merely an oversight and call back to alert them to their mistake, and to cancel the product since it's not what I want. They were shocked -- SHOCKED, I say! -- to discover this error (the same "error" posted by another ECF forum member back in July), but sadly, there was "nothing they could do" to refund my charge card, at least not for ten business days. I told them not to ship the item, but it had already been shipped (uh, say what?) or marked for shipping or otherwise set up such that they "couldn't" stop shipment of it. So it's on its way, allegedly, but they assure me I can return it to them once I receive it (but their assurances are now less than assuring).

The package should have been here by now, but hasn't yet arrived. No refund to my charge card yet. I am *very grateful* for gep's post in this thread, dated 9/18/2009, as I expect I'll be needing to make use of those links to address supplier ripoffs....

I nevertheless strongly urge you to run away with wings on your heels from SmokeAssassin. There seem to be several far better, much more reputable choices available.

If I walked into a store and took $70 out of the cash register without permission, I suspect the store owner would not be nearly as patient as many of us seem to be in awaiting our refunds of stolen money.

You need to cover your butt with a couple of easy things...

- print the free trial offer to PDF and save it.
- officially cancel within 30 days in writing and save the sent copy. request a confirmation that cancellation notice was received; save it.
- if they don't acknowledge confirmation in 24 hours, do it again.
- call your credit card company and file a dispute if (a) they don't acknowledge cancellation or (b) charge is not reversed within 10 days of cancellation.

If they ship, the only charge you should be liable for is the shipping. Credit card companies see a lot of this, and they side with the consumer as long as you cancel in the specified time frame, and vendors are penalized for this sort of crap.

Good luck!

[fanofwalt]

@Rambling Rose: thanks!

I'm getting ready to call my dear friends at Smoke Assassin (never received anything from them, natch, but my card has indeed been charged for the full kit and, yes, as I feared, also for the two "free" discount shopping cards I haven't received or even wanted in the first place). But first, I thought I'd perform a little "whois" on their url, and am glad to share this info with y'all. Enjoy as you wish. I'll update after my phone conversation with Smoke AssAssin (perfect name for 'em, eh?). Why do I get the feeling I should have a strong drink ready before I place my call to them?

whois for smokeassassin.com

Domain Name: SMOKEASSASSIN.COM
Registrar: GODADDY.COM, INC.
Whois Server: whois.godaddy.com
Referral URL: Browser Update Page
Name Server: NS1.MEGANAMESERVERS.COM
Name Server: NS2.MEGANAMESERVERS.COM
Name Server: NS3.MEGANAMESERVERS.COM
Status: clientDeleteProhibited
Status: clientRenewProhibited
Status: clientTransferProhibited
Status: clientUpdateProhibited
Updated Date: 05-jun-2009
Creation Date: 29-may-2009
Expiration Date: 29-may-2010

>>> Last update of whois database: Mon, 19 Oct 2009 18:50:44 UTC <<<

Please note: the registrant of the domain name is specified
in the "registrant" field. In most cases, GoDaddy.com, Inc.
is not the registrant of domain names listed in this database.


Registrant:
Mark Sawyer
134 Main St
Lewiston, Maine 04240
United States

Registered through: GoDaddy.com, Inc. (Browser Update Page)
Domain Name: SMOKEASSASSIN.COM
Created on: 29-May-09
Expires on: 29-May-10
Last Updated on: 05-Jun-09

Administrative Contact:
Sawyer, Mark msawyer@pinetreeme.com
134 Main St
Lewiston, Maine 04240
United States
(207) 753-0333 Fax --

Technical Contact:
Sawyer, Mark msawyer@pinetreeme.com
134 Main St
Lewiston, Maine 04240
United States
(207) 753-0333 Fax --

Domain servers in listed order:
NS1.MEGANAMESERVERS.COM
NS2.MEGANAMESERVERS.COM
NS3.MEGANAMESERVERS.COM

[fanofwalt]

So now that it's been a more-than-generous two full weeks since I placed my order, I have again called Smoke Assassin to find out about my refund.

After a nice looooong wait on hold, I finally was connected with Helpful Customer Service Representative Jim. Giving him my order number, and explaining that I haven't seen my refund yet, his first reply was that my money has been refunded. I assured him that I was looking directly at my account that very moment, and no, it hadn't been refunded. He again said, yes, it *has* been refunded. It got to be a "way!" / "no way!" kind of conversation, which was rather ridiculous. He then said, "But you haven't returned the kit." I informed him that I ordered two weeks ago and never received the kit; that, in fact, I had cancelled it three days after placing my order, but was told it was already being shipped, and that I should return it once I got it. However, I can't return what I don't have.

"Ohh," he said, "Well, I'll put in for a refund now instead of 'pending return;' it should show up in a couple of days." (uh huh.) So, you see, it wasn't already refunded, Jim. It was "refund pending return." Silly Jim; he must have accidentally mis-read his screen! Surely I'll see the refund posted to my account in just a few days. (Are pigs flying that day?)

I also asked him to remove the charges from "Easy Saver" and "American Leisure," the two discount shopping cards they included in Smoke Assassin's "free trial" deal; cards I never received, and am being charged for. Jim said I have to contact those companies separately and that he could not do anything about their charges (natch).

He then tried to convince me to keep Easy Saver because it has "good discounts" - I told him I didn't want anything that I got through my order with SA because they are untrustworthy, and I've found that I'm not the only person to have been defrauded by them; he interrupted me by saying, "Oh, that's that tobacco lobbies; you can't believe what they say." I countered that there are dozens, if not hundreds of people who have had the same experience as me, being told one thing at order time and discovering another thing when they check their billing -- but ol' Jim hung up on me mid-sentence.

Ohhh kay, so I called back, hoping to get a different Customer Service (hawr!) representative. I listened for a good while again to their hold music, until finally, at seven minutes and 53 seconds into the call, the music suddenly stopped; I readied myself to speak with whoever answered, and I got: *click* Yep, they simply disconnected me, without a word.

I'm guessing my home phone number is now on some sort of a We Won't Answer It blacklist. Guess I'll try again with my mobile and see what happens.

In the meantime, here are the Customer Service numbers for those discount cards, in case any unfortunate Smoke Assassin sap victim needs these:
877 844-9554 Easy Saver
877 564-8538 American Leisure

I haven't called those yet, but I get the sense I should expect the same level of courtesy and service as I got with SA.

Additionally, I am sending an email to GoDaddy, who hosts the SmokeAssassin.com website, to inform them that a client is using their hosting service to run fraudulent operations. Perhaps you'd like to send your thoughts to them as well:

abuse@GoDaddy.com

About the Cust. Svc reps hanging up on people, like Jim did with me -- of course, that's plain wrong to do; and yet, part of me understands: how would you like to have his job, Customer Service Representative for Smoke Assassin? Poor slob must desperately need that minimum wage gig in the boiler room.

[angjen0816]

I heard their commerical a few nights ago on the radio. I have been researching e-cigs for about a week now and I thought it might be a good deal. So I call and yeah....somehow I was number 198 of 200 callers to get the "free trial". Unfortunately for the rep, I could hear another rep in the background telling that caller they were also caller 198. Then he told me to get the free starter kit I also had to buy the carts for 79.99. Now, I maybe new to this but I know I can find carts for way less than 5 for 79.99.
BTW, I am a call center rep whos company formerly was partnered with Budget Saver, one of the products they also sign you up for so I at least knew the questions to ask and quickly discovered the reoccurring charge of 79.95 each month. I politely declined the offer and had to actually hang up on the guy as he fumbled trying to rebuttal with "easy to cancel" and "money back guarantee". I know a scam when I see one. I'm glad others have posted on this.

[JohnK]

Additionally, I am sending an email to GoDaddy, who hosts the SmokeAssassin.com website, to inform them that a client is using their hosting service to run fraudulent operations. Perhaps you'd like to send your thoughts to them as well:

abuse@GoDaddy.com

About the Cust. Svc reps hanging up on people, like Jim did with me -- of course, that's plain wrong to do; and yet, part of me understands: how would you like to have his job, Customer Service Representative for Smoke Assassin? Poor slob must desperately need that minimum wage gig in the boiler room.

Actually GoDaddy is only the domain registrar, and likely is not going to do diddly because the website is not being hosted on their servers.

These are the guys you want to complain to:

Internet Names for Business

The domain is using their NameServers and being hosted on their web servers:

Network Whois record

Queried whois.arin.net with "216.251.43.17"...
OrgName: InternetNamesForBusiness.com OrgID: INFBAddress: 500 East Broward BoulevardAddress: Suite 1700City: Fort LauderdaleStateProv: FLPostalCode: 33394Country: USNetRange: 216.251.32.0 - 216.251.47.255 CIDR: 216.251.32.0/20 NetName: MEGA-1NetHandle: NET-216-251-32-0-1Parent: NET-216-0-0-0-0NetType: Direct AllocationNameServer: NS1.MEGANAMESERVERS.COMNameServer: NS2.MEGANAMESERVERS.COMNameServer: NS3.MEGANAMESERVERS.COMComment: RegDate: 1999-11-16Updated: 2009-06-22RTechHandle: ZI51-ARINRTechName: InternetNamesForBusiness RTechPhone: +1-800-322-9438RTechEmail: admin@internetnamesforbusiness.com OrgTechHandle: ZI51-ARINOrgTechName: InternetNamesForBusiness OrgTechPhone: +1-800-322-9438OrgTechEmail: admin@internetnamesforbusiness.com# ARIN WHOIS database, last updated 2009-10-20 20:00