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Thread: Vinegar?

  1. #21
    Super Member ECF Veteran pinellaspete's Avatar
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    Str8V8ping,

    I did a bit of research on the caramel color and this is what I found:

    Carmel color is bitter, tastes like burnt sugar and is acidic. It is actually so acidic that bacteria won't grow in it. It is the world's most used food coloring. Food and beverage manufacturers use it to protect their flavorings from oxidation and color their food or beverage.

    Here is an interesting video: Secrets of Caramel Color - YouTube

    Here is a Wikipedia article: Caramel color - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    Perhaps our juice vendors are using caramel coloring in place of or in addition to lemon or vinegar to lower their juices PH?

    Anybody have ideas?

    Pete
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    Quote Originally Posted by pinellaspete View Post
    Str8V8ping,

    I did a bit of research on the caramel color and this is what I found:

    Carmel color is bitter, tastes like burnt sugar and is acidic. It is actually so acidic that bacteria won't grow in it. It is the world's most used food coloring. Food and beverage manufacturers use it to protect their flavorings from oxidation and color their food or beverage.

    Here is an interesting video: Secrets of Caramel Color - YouTube

    Here is a Wikipedia article: Caramel color - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    Perhaps our juice vendors are using caramel coloring in place of or in addition to lemon or vinegar to lower their juices PH?

    Anybody have ideas?

    Pete
    Wow. What type/class to use though ? Loranns sells caramel color but not sure if its the right one .

    Lorann Food Coloring 4 oz bottle, 13 colors available | eBay
    Last edited by Str8V8ping; 12-30-2011 at 09:02 PM.

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    Super Member ECF Veteran pinellaspete's Avatar
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    I went to the DD Williamson website and I think it would be either a class 3 or 4. I tried signing up for a free sample of a Class 4 liquid but for some reason the page would lock-up when I pressed submit. I'll try it again maybe tomorrow.

    While I was on that site it dawned on me that one of my friends who vapes nothing but top shelf RY4s, has a favorite. I can't remember who makes it but I'll find out next Tuesday when I go back to work. Anyway, that RY4 has a very distinct flavor of burnt sugar! It is actually rather pleasant and smooth IMHO.

    We may be on to something!

    Note to self: Buy some Caramel Color.

    Pete

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    Quote Originally Posted by pinellaspete View Post
    I went to the DD Williamson website and I think it would be either a class 3 or 4. I tried signing up for a free sample of a Class 4 liquid but for some reason the page would lock-up when I pressed submit. I'll try it again maybe tomorrow.

    While I was on that site it dawned on me that one of my friends who vapes nothing but top shelf RY4s, has a favorite. I can't remember who makes it but I'll find out next Tuesday when I go back to work. Anyway, that RY4 has a very distinct flavor of burnt sugar! It is actually rather pleasant and smooth IMHO.

    We may be on to something!

    Note to self: Buy some Caramel Color.

    Pete
    That burnt sugar is in most Ry4's . Its actually Ethyl Maltol . I found a actual flavoring that is the same as EM though which is HC caramel .Burnt sugar/toasted caramel/cotton candy
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    Quote Originally Posted by pinellaspete View Post
    I went to the DD Williamson website and I think it would be either a class 3 or 4. I tried signing up for a free sample of a Class 4 liquid but for some reason the page would lock-up when I pressed submit. I'll try it again maybe tomorrow.

    While I was on that site it dawned on me that one of my friends who vapes nothing but top shelf RY4s, has a favorite. I can't remember who makes it but I'll find out next Tuesday when I go back to work. Anyway, that RY4 has a very distinct flavor of burnt sugar! It is actually rather pleasant and smooth IMHO.

    We may be on to something!

    Note to self: Buy some Caramel Color.

    Pete
    Sounds like the description of Prime Vaping RY4. That stuff is fantastic! A light burnt sugar/caramel taste, not overpowering and blends so well with the natural tobacco flavor Jon uses. Great stuff and the best RY4 I've tasted thus far.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lyndagayle View Post
    Sounds like the description of Prime Vaping RY4. That stuff is fantastic! A light burnt sugar/caramel taste, not overpowering and blends so well with the natural tobacco flavor Jon uses. Great stuff and the best RY4 I've tasted thus far.
    If you like PV ry4 you need to try GreenHouseOne RY4 .Its even more amazing .


    Back on topic though , Iv been trying to find what coloring are used in ejuice and flavorings like capellas and cant find much . I have found hints that point to class 5 color . It seems class 5 is also the most widely used .We are def. on to something here .Iv also read a thread about different PH in different flavors and they range in PH for 6 - 8
    Last edited by Str8V8ping; 12-31-2011 at 04:22 AM.

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    Just a quick thought. I use regular vinegar all the time in cooking. If a food is overly seasoned hot such as one who put to much chili pepper in a chili I will use either a touch of vinegar or lemon.

    I do know vendors do use citric acid in the mix. (Not all). I am assuming it is more of a preservative than anything else.
    I decided to try science and placed a few drops in a new black n mild recipe. I cannot detect a vinegar taste. I would also assume citric or vinegar may tone down a cinnamon flavor as well. The small sample I have now I cannot say its better or worse....I can usually tell when I first vape in the morning. The palate has rested...LOL

    I will try to remember and post my finding after one bottle has cured for a week. I am using regular white vinegar.
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    This thread gets more and more interesting,I cant wait to see what you guys figure out.
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    I also tried some apple cider vinegar in a rice crispy treat juice i made . I only put 3 drops in a 5ml bottle of it but i cant taste the vinegar but it does seem to make the marshmallow come out a little more . Not a major difference but it is a bit more tasty . I split a 10ml bottle up to test between the two .
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    Super Member ECF Veteran pinellaspete's Avatar
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    Wow guys this is going great!

    And Lynda you are right again! My friend's favorite is Prime Vaping RY4 now that you mentioned it!

    Okay...I did some more research. Found some more interesting stuff...

    From Wikipedia about Vegetable Glycerin:

    In foods and beverages, glycerol serves as a humectant, solvent, and sweetener, and may help preserve foods. It is also used as filler in commercially prepared low-fat foods (e.g., cookies), and as a thickening agent in liqueurs. Glycerol and water are used to preserve certain types of leaves. As a sugar substitute, it has approximately 27 calories per teaspoon (sugar has 20) and is 60% as sweet as sucrose.


    The juices we are making are pretty sweet. 30% VG mix = 30% sugar, well times 60% = 18% sugar(sweetness). Now if you are talking a 50%, mix that would be 50% sugar, okay....times 60% still equals 30% sugar(sweetness)! Perhaps the vinegar or lemon juice is used to CUT the sweetness level and allow the flavors to come through? They are also saying VG is a preservative.

    Okay...Something else that is interesting and concerns us in the Wikipedia article:

    When used as a primary true alcohol-free (e.g. no alcohol (i.e. ethanol) ever being used) botanical extraction solvent in innovative non-tincture based 'dynamic' methodologies, glycerol has been shown, both in literature and through extraction applications, to possess a high degree of extractive versatility for botanicals including removal of numerous constituents and complex compounds, with an extractive power that can rival that of alcohol or water/alcohol solutions. That glycerol possess such high extractive power assumes that glycerol, with its tri-atomic structure, is utilized with dynamic methodologies as opposed to standard passive 'tincturing' methodologies that are better suited to alcohol's di-atomic structure. Glycerol possesses the intrinsic property of not denaturing or rendering a botanical's constituents inert. Glycerol is a stable preserving agent for botanical extracts that, when utilized in proper concentrations in an extraction solvent base, does not allow inverting or REDOX of a finished extract's constituents over several years. Both glycerol and ethanol are viable preserving agents. Glycerol is bacteriostatic in its action, and ethanol is bactericidal in its action.

    VG must be the carrying agent when they do tobacco extractions. That's about as far as I want to go on the extraction process here. If anyone is interested about the tobacco extraction process, Kurt has a very informative thread at the very top of the DIY explaining how to do it.

    Vendors must be using the Lemon Juice and or Vinegar to lower the PH of their juices, and not necessarily as a preservative. PG and VG are already preservatives and they make up the great majority of juice ingredients, I don't see why you would need to add more preservatives. What do you guys think?

    Pete

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