BT buying e cig maker?

[nyabzns]

I might sound like an idiot but I have a thought. I had read the Phillip Morris had lowered there prices on cigarettes in conjunction with some of the government tax hikes to keep prices down to a reasonable level.

Perhaps a purchase of the company and it's patents would allow them to use the tobacco to extract the nicotine, make a US based E-Juice and market an E-cig of there own. At the same time they have the means to fight the FDA regulation if indeed the regulation is strictly for tobacco products.

In the end it could result in wider availability and recognition of e-cigs.

With the New FDA regulations I wouldn't understand a tobacco companies desire to eliminate e-cigarettes when they themselves are being regulated out of existence already. Eliminating e-cigarette "competition" wouldn't necessarily make them more money if a reasonable number of people are forced to quit smoking because they can't afford it or the FDA regulates the nicotine levels in analogs.

[windpath]

As far as I can see RUYAN does not hold a single US patent:

Patents - RUYAN Electronic Cigarette Offical International Website ? Beijing SBT Ruyan Technology & Development Co., Ltd.

And even if they did inelectual property law is very difficult to enforce. They defiantly did not invent the atomizer, the battery, PG, the heating coils, the "wool" batting, nicotine, the "cigarette look" etc...

There are documented research trials from the 1940's of vaporizing and inhaling PG, was RUYAN selling e-cigs in the 40s?

Frankly several manfacturers/distributors (including US ones) are falsely claiming patents they do not have and will likely never get.

If RUYAN holds a US patent what is the patent number, control number, or PCT number?

[IANAN]

Hon, Lik (of Ruyan) filed at least 2 applications - you can see them here; http://www.google.com/patents?q=Hon+...Search+Patents

and another- this one actually appears to be granted;

http://appft1.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-...=%22hon+lik%22

In 2007 they sued NJoy

Philip Morris already had a patent issued on electronic smoking devices in 1997;

http://www.google.com/patents/about?...onic+Cigarette

[windpath]

PM's patent states:

A stand for an electrically heated cigarette smoking device can removably support an electrically heated cigarette smoking device, which includes a rechargeable power supply.

No idea what that is....

RUYAN's is still an application, not approved, and very vague...

If anything it would only cover a specific 3 piece design.

Aside from that if you ask any intellectual properties lawyer having a patent or trademark is one thing, having an enforcable one is something else completely, and enforcing it is a whole different game altogether...

[kinabaloo]

A potentially huge story.

Now, if I was RuYan I'd say no to all buyouts, because the only benefit would be short-term (tempting of course). I would guess this is a licensing deal.

[bikergirl1908]

BT is all about money...and the FDA is in their pocket.

If BT is negotiating to get into the e-cig ball game, I think it's so they can cash in on the electronic aspect of nicotine addiction and add to their already astronomical analog profit margin.

Imagine a day when you can go to your local store and purchase a carton of Marlboro analogs as well as a carton of Marlboro branded cartridges or ejuice in varying mg strengths.

Whoever controls the regulation controls the money and vice versa.

Just my .02.

[liscab]

Originally Posted by SmokeyJoe

Please edit with link to original source and limit the number of paragraphs to two as per: About linking to news stories - Read before you post!

Are yuo this guy scrol to Javier
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[VapingRulz]

Originally Posted by bikergirl1908

BT is all about money...and the FDA is in their pocket.

If BT is negotiating to get into the e-cig ball game, I think it's so they can cash in on the electronic aspect of nicotine addiction and add to their already astronomical analog profit margin.

Imagine a day when you can go to your local store and purchase a carton of Marlboro analogs as well as a carton of Marlboro branded cartridges or ejuice in varying mg strengths.

Whoever controls the regulation controls the money and vice versa.

Just my .02.

I'm no fan of Big Tobacco, but where is the money really going? It seems to me that it's the taxes that have made cigarettes so expensive, not the product itself.

My worry is that the government will slap an enormous "sin tax" on e-cigs and juice. The more popular e-cigs become, the more likely it is that both BT and the government will want their cut - especially when they start to see tax revenues dry up as smokers turn instead to vaping.

Anyone who *really* believes that taxes on tobacco products are all about public health is mistaken, in my opinion. Now more than ever, it's about the money, which brings me back to my original point. BT is not seeing huge profits like federal and state governments are. They can tax smokers to death without a peep of protest from the non-smoking majority.

[ladyraj]

It's not BT making all the money...it's the government.

Here is a breakdown of a pack of smokes in my State and where the funds are going. Keep in mind that our State and Federal government is BROKE!

My smokes cost: $4.50 Per pack

State excise tax: $1.25
Fed Tax: $1.01
MSA Trust: $ .84 (4.2 cents per cigarette sold)
Sales Tax: $ .34 (7.5%)
---------
Total Tax: $3.44

Ciggies cost: $4.50 minus tax to state and feds of $3.44 leaves $1.06 for the tobacco companies. Please keep in mind I have not included the retail mark-up in the above numbers and therefore the tobacco companies are making less than a dollar per pack. It's the State and Federal Government that are making the big bucks from tobacco smokers.

Therefore, a safe prediction for the treatment of the e-cig would be the government regulating heavy taxation via the cost of the e-cig to fund a campaign against your ability to purchase and use an e-cig.

It's a shell game...follow the dollars and the government wins.

[ECGuy]

PM could become our biggest friend.

PM is no ones friend! LOL, and don't expect any licensing agreements. With PM and all of Big Tobacco, it's their show or no show at all. They already have the distribution network in place. They don't need any of the current manufacturers, distributors or retailers / affiliates. Trying to work with them would be more a hinderance then a help.

My gut tells me they want the technology. Its part of the major corp mentality, see a competitor, buy them up. And there are lots of reasons for them to buy Ruyan.

Aside from that if you ask any intellectual properties lawyer having a patent or trademark is one thing, having an enforcable one is something else completely, and enforcing it is a whole different game altogether...

Yes, but patents are fought for in court. What e-cig manufaturer or company has the money to fight big tobacco? To them the legal costs would be lunch, their army of lawyers could bury anyone in the industry at this time in paperwork and discovery and legal fees without breaking a sweat.