Nicotine Confusion

[jamie]

<SMACK> Ouch! Maybe I'm the only ultra-lights smoker on the board [industry definition: nicotine 50% of full flavor]. Someone has to be familiar with my brand, RJR Semantics Ultra Lights 100s.... ?

[Spider]

Haha.. I didn't mean any offence jamie, I just meant that my question was answered. Your contribution was also valuable, there are always variables involved which you are right to point out.

Spider

[jamie]

Awww, thanks Spider. In your honor I will ignore any spiders I see in the basement this weekend.

I did find a bit of info, enough for better calculations I think, neither fully complete:

Nicotine Levels per Loong Totem

Nicotine Levels per Ruyan

Nicotine Levels per Rutoo

[clavit]

Thanks for the links :-)
Despite all the variables, this is the most exact info i have seen yet. It does give a reasonable ballpark figure.

[jdrancor]

Boy oh boy, wouldn't it be great to get some carts with the SAME levels of nic per puff as a cigarette? Looks like it would be approx 32-40mg levels. THAT WOULD BE AWESOME.

Minimum order is 10,000. I would be tempted to start a pool of people to pitch in for carts, but Loongtotem seems to be supplying e-cig, which is the worst available liquid. Atomizer killers of the worst order. If only we could get it elsewhere. I'll try emailing Jane and see if she can get the extra strength here...

[toekuttr]

Does anyone know if there have been any tests performed measuring the actual nicotine content of the vapor, other than a mathematical theory of what might be possibly available for atomization?

According to some test results I read performed at the Univ of LA, the vapor contains only trace amounts of nicotine per puff. Of course these were tests on Pharma's products, and their nicotine content, (hopefully the cartridges available to the general public are much higher in nicotine). With Pharma's products, the nicotine available systemically was around only 20% of the cartidge's measured content. But again, maybe these OTC devices are far more efficient than Big Pharma's devices too.

From Clinical Pharmacokinetics, Volume 40, Number 9, 2001 , pp. 661-684(24):

"One inhaler contains 10mg of nicotine (and 1mg of menthol) of which 4mg of nicotine can be extracted and 2mg are systemically available. Shallow or deep ‘puffing’ results in similar nicotine absorption. Nicotine is delivered mainly to the oral cavity, throat and upper respiratory tract with a minor fraction reaching the lungs. This was confirmed with positron emission tomography and by assessment of arterial concentrations. A single inhaler can be used for one 20-minute period of continuous puffing or periodic use of up to 400 puffs per inhaler."

I've just been wondering why with the all the dizziness from excessive huffing and puffing, I can't wait to have a smoke when I'm through e-puffing. Another interesting thing I read, is that nicotine is not soluble in water at room temperature, but couldn't find any references about solubility in PG.


PS: wasnt able to post links, not enough posts.

[McSocker]

so in a sense we should puff 30 times in order to get a regular cigarette hit am i not wrong?

[TropicalBob]

Does anyone know if there have been any tests performed measuring the actual nicotine content of the vapor, other than a mathematical theory of what might be possibly available for atomization?

That's one of the things Dr. Laugesen in New Zealand is supposed to determine this year. No date set for results, however.

The inhaler info is new to me, and interesting. I pulled out an old inhaler last week, pulled it apart, soaked the cartridge inside with 24mg liquid, and have been using it ever since, in addition to regular e-smoking and snus. If nothing else, it's a great placebo and I used it non-stop in a doctor's office the day before yesterday. THEY recognize it and don't say a word.

I also think that inhaler info might show the superiority of the Ruyan Vegas as a delivery device. All puffing, no inhaling. All mouth absorption, no lung involvement. And certainly that's the healthiest way to suck in stuff that has never been tested long-term.

[TropicalBob]

Nicotine is indeed soluble in water. And, just for kicks, here are some facts from the chemical industry site, Nicotine (PIM)

"Nicotine is one of the most toxic of all poisons and has a rapid onset of action. Apart from local caustic actions, the target organs are the peripheral and central nervous systems. Nicotine is also a powerfully addictive drug."

"Nicotine is a liquid alkaloid. It is water soluble and has a pKa of 8.5. It is a bitter-tasting liquid which is strongly alkaline in reaction and forms salts with acids."

"Nicotine is a water and lipid soluble drug which, in the free base form, is readily absorbed via respiratory tissues, skin, and the gastrointestinal tract."

"Nicotine rapidly crosses the placenta and enters the fetus."

"Toxicity
"Adults: The mean lethal dose has been estimated to be 30 to 60 mg.
"Children: The lethal dose is considered to be about 10 mg of nicotine.
"Dog: 9.2 mg."

If you have a syringe, look at the measurements on it. The first notch -- displacing an area half the size of your toothpaste tube cap -- is 1 ml. Our 24mg liquid has 24mg of nicotine per 1 ml. Plunge even lower on the syringe. See if you can find one-third of a ml. That tiny amount would kill the family dog. Less than 0.5ml -- a sip, really -- would fatally poison a child.

There's much more about nicotine in this loooooong data sheet, including its short- and long-term impacts on body organs. An eye-opening read.

[toekuttr]

Yep, nicotine is water soluble at boiling temperatures, but I was reading that it separates and solidifies at room temps. I kept looking for solids in the "juice" and didnt see any. I was wondering if the reason I was getting no "fix" from the e-cig was because of this. I was starting to wonder if there was any nicotine at all in the e-juice since I didn't find any floaters.

It looks like the prescription devices use a manipulated form of nicotine though and their products can't easily be compared to the OTC e-products we're using. Looking forward to that research you're referring to.