A list of symptoms when quitting tobacco and changing to an ecigarette

[Satire]

8 days without cigs for me (got my package in on the 5th)

Mark me down for muscle aches on Trapezius (pull your shoulders towards your head, that guy) , Rhomboidius major (small muscle on the back that pulls your shoulder blade towards your spine, pretend like you are pulling the cord on a lawn mower), and I think Spinalis thoracis (or maybe it's that entire group of spinal muscles). I did help my dad string up a barbed wire fence and I've been using stimulants to help study (they make your muscles clench a bit), but these aren't exactly new activities for me and I've never been sore like this before. If I ever do get sore (incredibly rarely as I'm a college student and am usually reading) it's like one muscle in one spot and is quite obvious why it is sore, not a soreness covering my entire back from top to bottom and left to right. No way to tell for sure but I know my body and this small amount of physical activity can not account for the soreness, and I'm 21 and rather fit (though not buff by any standard), I don't think I have ever even had a sore back before.

Other than soreness last few days (helped my dad yesterday, was here before that but not as pronounced), I have noticed the minor dryness/irritant feeling after vapping for a bit but take a drink and it goes away. A small portion of skin around my eye did start getting dried out and reddish I rubbed a little ointment on it when I got out of the shower (helps by keeping disinfected as well as providing a minor barrier of oil to keep moisture in) and was much better the next morning, did the same thing after morning shower and it was gone by next day (48 hours total time from noticing to gone).

I have heard people mention that they use something (I'm guessing a base) to change the PH of the liquid and give it the "throat kick (or hit, I forget)" This could explain the throat/mouth dryness/itchiness as well as the skin irritation due to very small amounts of residue being left on the fingertips then touching a sensitive area of the skin such as the face (or the inside end of your nose if you rubbed it at some point, I think someone mentioned peeling or something). Also rubbing a diluted base (or acid for that matter) on freshly-cleaned (no oil barrier) skin could cause irritation.

I would suggest that anyone experiencing these skin problems to wash the area (or take a shower) and then put some antibiotic ointment on it immediately after washing or getting out of the shower (the kind that you put under a band aid and has the texture of vaseline, comes in squease tubes, brand names are neosporin or polysporin). Just rub a little on then wipe it gently off with a dry cloth until it is no longer shiny. Should be fine in a day or two.

Also anyone with these problems (you acne people too!) might want to try washing their hands after dripping or refilling carts or otherwise coming in contact with even the slightest amount of e-liquid residue and see if the symptoms stop. By eliminating the possibility of external e-liquid irritation (no chance of residue on fingers being smeared across your face every time you rub your eye or scratch your nose or w/e) you can tell if it is truly an internal problem or if your skin is simply sensitive (people who wash their face daily without using moisturizer after are exposing the sensitive skin to irritants and bacteria because you remove the first line of defense).

Also I am an undergrad Biochem student so if anyone has the formula (or at the very least, a complete ingredient list with general concentrations or each ingredient) for any of the e-liquids I would be more than happy to check out the effects of each chemical individually and if I have them around (chances are I do or can get) I could test them on myself in pure form to isolate what could replicate some of the symptoms (especially interested in the puresmoker.com premium juice ingredients, which is what I use and could do more accurate subjective testing with) Of course, some of these symptoms the heavy (ex) smokers are experiencing are due to the lack of tar and other tobacco goodies and the body adjusting, but the juice obviously has its own side-effects which can easily be pinpointed and improved with a little testing (the emerging biochemist inside me is red flagging the PH adjuster and wants to know what it is) If you want to keep the formula secret to prevent copycats you can PM me it, and I wont release any info other than the essentials like possible irritants and such, because i highly doubt that anything openly sold for use as a concentrated vapor that is often breathed in for hours at a time by all ages from small children to the elderly (correct me if I'm wrong) at concerts and magic shows of all sorts could be a major eye, skin, or respiratory irritant. I'm no expert but I am a couple years deep into a career of chemicals and how they affect the human body (and couldn't be happier) and have access to a great professor who knows pretty much everything there is to know about physiology and I know/have access to all the books and websites for this subject by heart, so I'm sure I can help.

Would be interesting to know what we have all been puffing on =)

[Kate]

Hi Satire, welcome to the forum.

Information on ingredients in eliquid has been collected on this thread - Ingredients in cartridges or E-liquid

And the little we know about pH has been mentioned here - pH values and harshness of eliquid

This is our thread for research findings - http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/for...html#post27916

I hope those help and look forward to hearing how you get on with your own research.

[Satire]

Thanks for the links, made my search much easier. I'll try not to get too carried away on this one (my last post was originally going to be like 2 sentences) as I have some homework to finish up still.

This list was supplied by Ludo of jantyshop (major thanks for sharing btw), he says all ingredients (nicotine is not on the list, this is just the base that they use) are safe and legal and that their liquids are approved by the University of Naples and the Italian Ministry of Health.
On a quick personal note I find it unlikely that he sent a bottle of prepared eliquid and explained that it was to be repeatedly vaporized and inhaled over long periods of time and they approved, more likely they were sent a list of ingredients (not including nicotine of course) and they said none of them are controlled or considered a safety hazard (or perhaps he just checked to make sure none of them are banned), but who knows and in any case it is irrelevant.

All information was found on chemical supplies websites, which are required to have the safety and first aid information (MSDS) of any chemical they sell, will gladly send links if anyone wants em, but I don't know if I'm allowed to post links yet and don't wanna risk having to re-type.

The list:
menthol -
3-methylcyclopentan-1
2-dione
1-malic acid
2,3,5,6-tetramethylpyrazine
2,3,5-trimethylpyrazine
beta-damescenone
acetylpyrazine
2-acetylpyridine
ethanol
I assumed this would just be the usual "may cause liver damage, blackouts, unexpected pregnancies, and barfights" warning, but there was specific data on other methods, I'll leave out the consumption part.
Eye: Causes severe eye irritation. May cause painful sensitization to light {haha ever had a hangover where bright lights hurt your eyes?}. May cause chemical conjunctivitis and corneal damage.
Skin: Causes moderate skin irritation. May cause cyanosis of the extremities.
Inhalation: Inhalation of high concentrations may cause central nervous system effects characterized by nausea, headache, dizziness, unconsciousness and coma. Causes respiratory tract irritation. May cause narcotic effects in high concentration. Vapors may cause dizziness or suffocation.
(don't know if we are causing it to decompose, more than likely it is not much if at all, but a rapidly heated coil could ignite small amounts of the vapors)
Hazardous Decomposition Products: Carbon monoxide, irritating and toxic fumes and gases, carbon dioxide.

rhodinol
Other Toxic Effects on Humans: Hazardous in case of skin contact (irritant {another one oh my}), of ingestion, of inhalation {doesn't give details other than irritant here, guess they didn't expect people to be breathing it often}. Slightly hazardous in case of skin contact (permeator).
Toxicity of the Products of Biodegradation{note this isn't the same as decomposition, this breakdown will happen naturally given time}:The products of degradation are more toxic {can't wait!}.

vanillin
This one I red flagged on instinct, had some irritation problems with similar substances before, so I checked it first.
Other Toxic Effects on Humans: Hazardous in case of ingestion, of inhalation. Slightly hazardous in case of skin contact (irritant, permeator {this could of course cause a rash, and skin irritants are usually the major factor in acne outbreaks of people that aren't in puberty}).
May affect genetic material (mutagenic). {yea mutagenic things are the cancer-causing stuff, wouldn't that be such an ironic bitch slap if we all got cancer within a few years}
May cause adverse reproductive effects based on animal test data.
Special Remarks on other Toxic Effects on Humans:
Acute Potential Health Effects: It may cause eye, skin, respiratory tract, and mucous membrane irritation{oh snaps plx}. It may be absorbed by the skin. Ingestion may cause gastrointestinal tract irritation and affect the cardiovascular system, respiration, liver (jaundice), urinary system, behavior/nervous system (muscle weakness {how many reports of muscle soreness have we had? weak or reduced binding of muscle fibers can cause normal exertion to over-exert the muscle, thus soreness}, somnolence, coma).
Chronic Potential Health Effects:
Inhalation: Prolonged or repeated inhalation may affect the brain and blood (changes in white and red blood cell count). {for the record chronic inhalation is what we are doing}
Ingestion: Prolonged or repeated ingestion may affect the urinary system, liver, heart, and metabolism (weight loss).
The following may or may not apply, I'm not sure if any is heated to the point of decomposition and no decompsition temp is listed.
Hazardous Decomposition Products: Carbon monoxide, irritating and toxic fumes and gases(When heated to decomposition it emits acrid smoke and irritating fumes.-found this on another msds too), carbon dioxide.

propylene glycol
Wow, I was really praying for this one too, sorry guys, at least it isn't too bad.
Slightly hazardous in case of skin contact (sensitizer). {making skin a little more sensitive to other irritants could contribute to the acne}
Chronic Effects on Humans: May cause damage to the following organs: central nervous system (CNS). {oh joy}
Other Toxic Effects on Humans: Hazardous in case of ingestion. Slightly hazardous in case of skin contact (irritant{I believe this makes 4 skin irritants so far}, permeator), of inhalation.
Flammability of the Product: May be combustible at high temperature.{lol, e-cig go boom!}
Special Remarks on Fire Hazards: When heated to decomposition it emits acrid smoke and irritating fumes


Ok this ended up taking 10 times longer than I thought, I will have to stop here, I will check the other chemicals out tomorrow or something.

So far I have to say I hope this isn't the same formula everyone uses. The vanillin in particular seems easily omittable, it can't be there for anything more than a subtle flavor and it simply isn't something we should be inhaling, especially on a daily basis.

Maybe we should start asking suppliers to provide a list of the ingredients in their eliquids (after all, if we are going to be using these daily, shouldn't we strive for the safest possible formula?) , and I will see if I can find some more info on long term effects of pg, vg, and the other essential ingredients. I know we have all been hoping the FDA won't shut us down, but that also means that lawsuit-fearing companies havent had scientists check it for long-term safety, so we should do our best to make it as safe as we can (I believe that most of us switched to e-smoking for a safer lifestyle). This board has the potential to make this happen due to the direct communication with our suppliers and group thinking/process improvements/feedback that it allows. As for any supplier not wishing to release their ingredient list for fear of people copying it, everyone here is capable of making their own juice, we come to you because it is pre-made and inexpensive (though personally I plan on making my own unless I find a pre-made liquid with ingredients that are as safe as what I could make on my own), people who want to make their own already are, the different flavors are just for novelty.

Blah no sleep for me tonight hope someone finds this info slightly useful, and any contributions on ejuice formulas (from suppliers or home recipies) would be nice so we can share ideas and discuss possible improvements in one area (I don't feel like combing through the home bake formulas and testing it all myself, and there are plenty of people already knowledgeable in the area of how different ingredients affect the end product).
I'm out. <puff>

[TropicalBob]

This is great information for the e-smoking community, Satire. Keep it up. It's hard to get excited about atomizers and puffs per cartridge when your future health might be endangered or compromised. This is the important stuff, right here. If the liquid is dangerous, nothing else matters ...

[No burn baby]

Vanillin, as in vanilla flavours?

[mouse]

Vanillin, as in vanilla flavours?

Yes.

In October 2007 Mayu Yamamoto of the International Medical Center of Japan won an Ig Nobel prize for developing a way to extract vanillin from cow dung.

From Wikipedia - I can't post links yet.

Must be what they mean by 'good s**t'

[Satire]

Ok I'm probably not going to have time to check more chems tonight because I have a lab test over muscles tomorrow, but I have a lil info to report.
To make sure I wasn't falsely attributing the rash on my eyes to the e-juice, I did a retest last night with 2 different types of the medium strength premium juice from puresmoker (pina colada and apple). Put a little on my fingertip, wiped excess off on a towel (finger was no longer "wet") and then wiped finger across the skin above the eye (in between eyelid and eyebrow), then washed hand and did the same thing to the other eye with the other flavor. This morning both areas were very red, itchy, and swollen, looked like I had been smacked in the face with a bat (my employer thought I had been attacked). As previously done, I took a shower and let the warm water rinse them for about 30 seconds (no soap), then put antibiotic ointment over area (when browsing through the first aid method for the chemicals I checked, they all said to rinse with water and apply antibiotic ointment, so I was a little proud of my previous common sense). Swelling was gone by lunchtime, though they are still red and itchy.

I have switched back to the 36mg juice I originally bought, and only took small puffs when needed to cut back on the amount of total juice consumed until I find something better. Also am much less casual when dripping now and careful to avoid getting on hands.

Oh and did anyone else see the 60min interview last night when Obama was talking about his old apartment and said it used to be next door to the chicken shack? That was awesome :P

[Papa Lazarou]

I'm sure vanilla is going to be an additive in certain tobacco blends, I know I've smoked vanilla flavoured tobacco before.

Interesting though. The info posted is suggesting that items generally regarded as safe for food (e.g. vanilla extract) can actually be classed as harmful by ingestion and cancer causing mutagens.

[efaglil]

Vanillin, as in vanilla flavours?

Wiki link is here...
Vanillin - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

[Somoney]

I noticed my throat felt dry and looked a little red the first couple weeks of esmoking, but I guess my body got used to it and all is normal again. I have pretty sensitive dry skin and can tell you that even unadulterated VG anywhere on my face irritates my skin. I was not as bold to rub eJuice anywhere on my face though like you did S. I hate to jynx myself but I can tell you so far, everyone at my work has caught the Flu accept us e-smokers.

Some of these posts dont quite make sense to me in how they can corrilate e-smoking to there symtom.

Maybe Hypocondria is a common symtom of e-Smoking?