check this out !..A free test for electronic cigarettes ?

[dc2k08]

yep Big Smoke know will definitely know about these - Philip Morris had one of their scientists design one and has owned the patent for it since 1991. It was never developed.

You can bet they are aware of the current devices but I cant find any information on what they make of them. Their CEO's 2008 speech to their investors never mentioned them. Currently PM are busy trying to source their tobacco crop outside of the US. This will piss the farmers off and the Gov. It might have to do with a deal with China Tobacco. Bolivian farmers have also started growing tobacco when they noticed that some US farmers had switched to corn which didn't turn out to be as profitable as once imagined. Perhaps they will source some there.

Will e-cigs make a large enough dent in their profits for them to start caring ? we will see in 2009. same goes for Big pharm. But most of their shenanigans will be masked. The government also have a motive for baning these on account of revenue loss but it will be behind the "we care about our citizens health" mantra. It would be pertinent to have a clinical study in the works to counter any of their claims. The proposal i mentioned in the OP might have funded it and it's curious that it has disappeared.

Here is the mail i sent and received friday:

Hi.

I was looking forward to filling out the form and applying for the grant for your opportunity PA-09-046 to do with the testing of smokeless tobacco products. I received today though the e-mail which said that this opportunity has been deleted. That was fast. Do you know if a similar opportunity will be put up again and could you please let me know the reasons as to why it was deleted ?

Thanks

--------------------------------

Thank you for contacting Grants.gov Customer Support.

I'm not finding a listing for this grant on Grants.gov.


Your case number is 1-87189***. Please reference this number when contacting us in the future for further assistance.

Thank you,

Grants.gov Customer Support
1-800-518-4726

That's it - vanished. The Hadron collider spilled out a black hole and that's where it ended up. very mysterious.

[LaceyUnderall]

and to put this into perspective with the economy... specifically the auto industry: I bet the big three wish now that they had taken the hint 5 years ago and made a more sustainable vehicle that was economically friendly to buyers.

I will not be surprised when the big tobacco companies take note that if they do not get involved with the e-cig, they may find themselves asking for a bailout a few years from now... even though tobacco is one of our oldest industries, they know it will be impossible to get a bailout.

There have been rumors for years that the packaging is ready to go for legal sales of joints.... It is naive to think that the tobacco big wigs haven't heard about these and aren't looking forward to the future of their industry.

[TropicalBob]

They've heard. They even read the industry magazine where my article on e-smoking ran in October. I just don't think they believe e-smoking is anything but a very, very minor player for cigarette smokers. A new survey recently revealed that 9 out of 10 smokers who tried snus and smokeless tobacco went back to cigarettes in a short time. E-smoking will do no better. Bet on it. No better.

Big Tobacco wants to sell tobacco products. If not in America, then in Zimbabwe or somewhere. It looks at its history with the Eclipse and Heatbar and sees only failure. It surely knows e-smoking exists, but doesn't see it as a threat. And, just today, the U.S. Supreme Court cleared the way for billions of dollars in lawsuits resulting from perceived promises in Big Tobacco selling "light" cigarettes, with the incorrect implication that these were healthier. Big Trouble.

More and more, I see our practice being of more interest to Big Pharmaceutical. Only they can produce "safe" liquid and carts. Somewhere down the road, you might have to ask your doctor for a prescription for this "nicotine alternative" that keeps you from smoking cigarettes and sustains you for life.

BTW: MAKE NO HEALTH CLAIMS, implied or otherwise, for e-smoking. Suppliers can't even hint at these being safer than cigs. There's no proof. Any claim is a future law suit. Only fools claim what they can't back up.

[dc2k08]

TB, - your article, they won't ever put it online will they ? the only way to read it is to subscribe to their print edition ?

[TropicalBob]

I think I'm going to post the whole thing before long. I've just been busy. I can break it down into, say, five parts.

[dc2k08]

i didn't think the publisher would allow you but that would be cool. only thing is, a really well written article about electronic cigarettes is going to be scraped for content all over the net by all the spammies in the biz. you'll see pieces of it regurgitated everywhere.

[TropicalBob]

Your last statements are true. Sad. But true. I doubt the publisher will care. I signed no contract and certainly wasn't paid for "all rights." In fact, I'm still awaiting payment (magazines are DYING as we speak). I'm thinking about it.

[LaceyUnderall]

i didn't think the publisher would allow you but that would be cool. only thing is, a real well written article about electronic cigarettes is going to be scraped for content all over the net by all the spammies in the biz. you'll see pieces of it regurgitated everywhere.

TB- when you are ready... I wrote a hub about content stealing based on the issue I had with my content getting scraped... what I suggested works. our content is being taken down across all of his sites. you can definitely fight for yourself online when it is time.

How to Deal with Content Stealing Online

[rattlerviper]

Wow...I can't think that a health organization would truly be out to prove that something is legitimately safer than cigs. Any data from a study can be interpreted in many different ways according to whom is doing the interpretation. Unless e-cigs are near 100% harm reduction I doubt they would receive any sort of endorsement.

As for e-cigs getting banned in the USA...LOL...That would be VERY hard to enforce. Not a desirable situation by any means, but terribly hard to enforce.

[TropicalBob]

Maybe. But that won't stop an agency bent on banning a drug delivery device and its contents. There are many laws on the books that are "hard to enforce" but that doesn't remove them. Besides, no one wants e-smoking driven underground. Sorry, but that would be the end of it. There are ways to achieve legitimacy, but they aren't quick and easy. They will be expensive and time-consuming. Surely, no one thinks the present unregulated environment is sustainable ... The only LOL is looking at this with severely rose-colored glasses. I want e-smoking to succeed, but wishing it, denying problems, etc. won't help anyone. You are going to hear:

1. Children could obtain these and become addicted.
2. Nicotine is a toxic poison that should not be sold for recreational use.
3. There are already ways to quit smoking that are safe.
4. E-smoking doesn't pay its fair share of taxes.
5. There are no proven health benefits.
6. This might pose unknown dangers, since there are no long-term health benefits.
7. The liquid contents cannot be unknowns to first responders and hospital authorities.
8. This looks too similar to banned tobacco smoking and will result in confusion in enforcing existing no-smoking laws.

How do you stop it?

1. You ban import of our liquids. Could some get through? Yes, but the shipper would be committing a criminal act. Yep, that makes a difference in availability. Liquid sources would dry up. Get ready to make your own.

2. You ban delivery of any non-pharmaceutical nicotine or nicotine-delivery product. No mail, no UPS, FedEx, etc. This is very easy to do and laws are ready now to stop delivery of all tobacco products, so our little addiction is an easy addition to those laws.

What we need is science. What we need is to find a way to slide into existing laws that allow personal nebulizers. What we need are authorities polnting to the healthy benefits of PG vapor inhalations. We do not need pollyannas who have newly discovered a way to stay off cigarettes .. for awhile.

Anyone who thinks this is going to go down without protest, please spell out your success scenario. I'm listening ... and I'll be hoping you're right. But hope won't be enough.