Australian ban; Egar illegal

[Bigredcent]

Very good e-mail,Lucisac!!! Hope it is taken seriously. I know it sure would make me rethink my vote on the banding of E-Cigarettes. Unforturnatly most people in power are lacking common sense. LOL

[lucisac]

That email alone probably won't do much, remember though, the squeakiest wheel always gets oiled first.

[slianfoxob]

I'm not sure we have a very convincing argument that vaping is healthy with the nicotine factored in there though. That's the thing. We've switched delivery methods and perhaps it's healthier but we're still addicted to a substance that I think most would assume is unhealthy.

It seems that most medical professionals would agree that any type of alternative nicotine delivery system is better than smoking cigarettes. And they would also agree that nicotine is still unhealthy.

The difference is that, as far as we know, the unhealthy effects of nicotine are only felt by us. For a government to restrict what I do to my body is a impediment on my rights. With vaping I am not pushing nicotine on anyone. 99% of the nicotine in our liquids is absorbed into the body before exhaling the vapor.

This basically falls into prohibition territory and the banning of alcohol and other hazardous for your health substances...

I'm not trying to argue with you Gabby....just wanted to share my view on the matter


Foxy

[lucisac]

I think you are on the right track. E-cigs do not harm others, this is the point I am mostly focusing on bringing to their attention.

Cigarette second hand smoke on the streets, outside pubs/clubs, movie threatres etc, places where both adults and the young are subject to inhaling the dangers caused by smokers. This is the situation that could of easily been reduced in the coming years, and this new ban will block that opportunity. It is an uninformed decision on their behalf, everyone's loved ones are at risk on a daily basis.

[GabbyD]

It seems that most medical professionals would agree that any type of alternative nicotine delivery system is better than smoking cigarettes. And they would also agree that nicotine is still unhealthy.

The difference is that, as far as we know, the unhealthy effects of nicotine are only felt by us. For a government to restrict what I do to my body is a impediment on my rights. With vaping I am not pushing nicotine on anyone. 99% of the nicotine in our liquids is absorbed into the body before exhaling the vapor.

This basically falls into prohibition territory and the banning of alcohol and other hazardous for your health substances...

I'm not trying to argue with you Gabby....just wanted to share my view on the matter


Foxy

Oh, I totally agree with what you're saying, but they are already encroaching on your rights in other ways - look at the new taxes being proposed on soft drinks in NY for example. This is the direction we've been heading in for a while now but people tend to not care until it's something that affects them directly. Have you ever heard the analogy of the frog in the pot of boiling water? Drop a frog in a pot of boiling water and he'll jump out. Put him in a pot of warm water and slowly turn up the heat and you'll boil him alive. That's how it works. We allow little by little for them to take away our choices and our freedoms. We don't care if it's an activity that we don't engage in, but eventually that arm swings around and grabs all of us in some way or another. THEN we get mad, but then it's too late.

[TropicalBob]

Lucisac, make the points Dr. Laugesen makes in his letter. I consider it a tragic mistake to in any way compare our inhalers with a tobacco cigarette. That will trigger a form response: Your government is commited to eliminating tobacco use within a decade. Period. End of their comment. You need to push all the points made by Dr. Laugesen. Your "rights" aren't an issue, either. There is no right to purchase and use addictive drugs. That should be obvious. Don't deviate from what Dr. Laugesen wrote. And we are not NRT, unless you want to wait years for tests and certification. Leave real cigarettes out of this discussion.

The likelihood of anyone saying, "Oh, we made a mistake, Sorry. We'll just take back the ban", is about the same as a comet impacting Australia today. But the case needs to be made so that this doesn't become a precedent for other governments to follow. It won't be easy. It will require reasoned argument on the highest level.

Overnight, I did adjust my own thinking about the term "electric nicotine inhaler." I agree that that doesn't cover our devices. There is a possibility of our devices being used for real inhalation therapy, as well as supplying addicts their nicotine. That being the case, I return to favoring "personal vaporizer" instead of "electric nicotine inhaler."

Unfortunately, as we've noted as long as a year ago, the label e-cigarette is now in popular use (even the very name of this forum), so we likely cannot change this. We can only refuse to refer to our devices that way in official correspondence.

From reading comments on the Australian social forum ... you guys are thinking rationally and planning well. Keep it up.

[nakli_dhumrapan]

I think Cucurucho's suggestion on working with the anti-smoking movement is an excellent idea -- far better than acting like a four-year-old throwing a public tantrum because he can't get his way, as some seem to suggest in protest.....

Well, it's hard to say. They haven't succeeded in getting cigarettes banned. Maybe what we need is to have big tobacco on board - sorta tongue and cheek with that but fully admitting that's the way it seems to work best. If we had big money, lobbyists and tax revenues on our side, we'd be fine. Grrrrrr....

Why not play both sides?

[trog100]

someone has just told me Nancy Pelosi is about to meet a screwdriver.. presented as an environmentally friendly device...

a few SDs floating around the Congressional offices might do some good bob what do u recon... he he he

trog

[TropicalBob]

That would be fantastic, Trog. Fantastic. We know what these can be. Now the powers that be need to know, too.

[trog100]

one might be useful to the new president elect as well.. he he

i dont know bob.. but a few of the right types puffing away on an SD might be useful.. we do have some odd customers..

how about this lot..

ALOHA FROM THE TAXI GUYS AT THE ALOHA CAB CO. HAPPY NEW YEAR...

nicotine addicts seem to come in all shapes sizes nationalities.. and income brackets..

trog