FDA may soon propose regulation that could ban many/most e-cigarette products, eliminate many/most companies - Page 40
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Thread: FDA may soon propose regulation that could ban many/most e-cigarette products, eliminate many/most companies

  1. #391
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    I've said it before, I'll say it again- the whole "don't call it a cigarette" argument is missing the point, as Kristin points out.

    It's a cigarette replacement. Call it what you will.

    But it's a replacement for cigarettes that allows us to continue our addiction with greatly reduced costs, risks, and payments to big pharma. THAT is where the high level opposition comes from.

    And, we're dirty nasty horrible smokers, who provide the bulllies and busybodies with someone to persecute. They didn't know who to turn to, now that racism isn't allowed in the public sphere. (Gay folks get their share of this, too.) THIS is where the low level "on the street/in your face" opposition comes from.

    We're fighting a fight to convince the massive numbers of the currently undecided (including smokers and non-smokers) to support tobacco harm reduction.

    But we aren't going to convince our opponents. They're on the side that they're on for a million(dollars worth of) reasons, and they aren't going to stop or change.

    Can't convince'em. Can't shoot'em.

    We're just gonna have to outnumber them. Which means that we need to KEEP calling it an ecig. Cause when 50 million SMOKERS get on our side, we're gonna be hard to stop. :-)

    Best,
    Ande
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  2. #392
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    I would love to be able to see nicotine through PV delivery and caffeine compared honestly, under real world use, as to health and 'cost to society'. I think it would be enlightening and I suspect a game-changer. But alas, PV's haven't been available long enough for meaningful long term studies, yeah? That's one of the primary reasons (to me) that knee-jerk bans have no basis in fact, imo.
    Smokers save society money because they die younger.
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  3. #393
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    WE NEED YOUR HELP VAPERS!

    Hawaii's state legislature recently introduced a bill that would ban the sale of electronic cigarettes to minors and classify the product and every accessory associated with it as a "tobacco product" for the purpose of taxation. As you might imagine we strongly support any measure that would ban the sale of electronic cigarettes to minors. However, the bill has many unintended consequences that endangers suppliers, supporters and users of electronic cigarettes in Hawaii and nationwide.

    These bills would unfairly tax the sale of electronic cigarettes and every electronic cigarette accessory in Hawaii, regardless of whether or not it contains tobacco/nicotine, at a rate of 70% of the wholesale price. This tax in turn would force Volcanoecigs to move out-of-state or close down due to the tremendous competitive disadvantage that would be placed on us.

    These bills would also force local Hawaii electronic cigarette users to either purchase supplies from out-of-state and international vendors (who are not hampered by this unfair tax) or force those users to resort to smoking again. These bills could also be used as a roadmap to affect laws in your state, which could create a domino effect of state legislation across the USA endangering access for all vapers to farily priced electronic cigarettes and accessories regardless of where they are geographically located.

    THE TIME TO ACT IS NOW!!!
    It's from the email that volcano fine electronic cigs sent me and I am sure any of us that have bought from this supplier. I am urging all of us to write to the Legislature of Hawaii. It seems that this will not only impact Hawaii, but all of us. The taxing of anything that could be used for producing any of the effects of delivering nicotine, to be classified as a tobacco product and a tax that will make them completely un-affordable. Ideas please on what to say before this stupid bill passes? Should it be about the benefits I have experienced from the e-cigarettes, or more about the financial unfairness? I am in a state of confusion at this moment? I will write and hope we all do too.

  4. #394
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    Quote Originally Posted by kristin View Post
    If we called them anything else, the ANTZ would just try to twist it around to say it "proves" that we were trying to disguise something dangerous and addicting to sound harmless and we are no better than Big Tobacco lying to the public. We can't win that one no matter how hard we try. No matter what they are called, we'd still be fighting for public approval one way or another. Better to call a spade a spade, not try to hide behind a pretty facade and just show the public with scientific evidence that spades aren't the same as a gun.

    I agree - no matter what you call them - they are nicotine delivery devices and will be attacked. This will happen no matter how safe they are and even if it is scientifically proven to not only be safer than cigarettes, but even beneficial in some way over time. You will never get someone to agree that it is the burning from cigarettes that is the harmful components that they are fighting. Nicotine has become the baseline for the fight - not the root cause...
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  5. #395
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    Nicotine is extracted from taxed tobacco, the taxes have already been paid. An American that values freedom to choose a safe alternative to smoking.
    That is what I posted on this page as opposition, not so much about how wonderful this safer cigarette is:Hawaii State Legislature Bill #SB2819 Before the Feb.12, 2012 when they have every intension of signing this evil corruption into law.
    SB 2819 State of Hawaii bill to TAX out of existance e-cigarettes and any mechanical device that makes using them unobtainable due to making them beyond expensive for average nicotine consumers. Measure Status
    I probably could have said more. However, it's useless to defy a lie and better to talk money?
    Last edited by Lisa Belle; 01-31-2012 at 12:41 PM.

  6. #396
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    "If they have nicotine and something that looks like smoke is coming out of your mouth, they are against them. Even without the visible vapor, they'd be against them, unless they were FDA-approved and meant only to wean you off of nicotine. Nicotine addicts are evil, weak and socially unacceptable."

    I believe that is only true today. Once modified risk, as defined by the FDA, is geared up and they approve long term use of NRT products, you will see an entirely different view. Nicotine in and of itself will be fine, AS LONG AS IT IS INCLUDED IN AN FDA APPROVED, "SAFE AND EFFECTIVE" Big Pharma product. They are, after all, the FDA's customer.
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    I am so sick of this , will it ever end?
    It seems so simple to me. Vapeing has saved my lungs and I no longer blow out second hand SMOKE .
    So what is the problem??
    Money? It looks like smoking? what???
    I hope this stops , because i am not going to stop using my PV !!!!
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  8. #398
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    Quote Originally Posted by rothenbj View Post
    "If they have nicotine and something that looks like smoke is coming out of your mouth, they are against them. Even without the visible vapor, they'd be against them, unless they were FDA-approved and meant only to wean you off of nicotine. Nicotine addicts are evil, weak and socially unacceptable."

    I believe that is only true today. Once modified risk, as defined by the FDA, is geared up and they approve long term use of NRT products, you will see an entirely different view. Nicotine in and of itself will be fine, AS LONG AS IT IS INCLUDED IN AN FDA APPROVED, "SAFE AND EFFECTIVE" Big Pharma product. They are, after all, the FDA's customer.
    I doubt the ANTZ would ever allow anything that has visible vapor get FDA approval. If it ever does, it'll be in 25 years when they finally "prove" the vapor isn't a long-term health hazard to bystanders, LOL!
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    Today I did my daily surfing, visiting CASAA | The Consumer Advocates for Smoke-Free Alternatives Association I noticed the City of Indianapolis - Mayor Greg Ballard is about to throw the "baby out with the bath water" on including e-cigarettes in a indoor smoking ban. CASAA gives a link to the facebook page of the Mayor Ballard and I left this comment. Here is the link and here is the comment. City of Indianapolis - Mayor Greg Ballard - Government agency - Indianapolis, IN | Facebook
    Here is the comment. Please feel free to put in all of our common sense on the subject, (not your two cents LOL)
    It is unfortunate that false information about the use of personal vaporizers known as e-cigarettes is spreading like the thick, filthy orange brown cancer causing, carbon monoxide containing, fire hazardous, choking, 4000 cancer causing chemicals that have been killing generations of people known as USD Domestic Cigarettes that are legal to anyone over the age of 18. From a lack of knowledge comes the word ignorance. Please feel free to be informed of the truth, read the real scientific knowledge and all about the political lobbying activities of A.C.S., A.L.A., A.H.A. who are overtly busy spewing false propaganda to line their pockets at the expense of the health of billions of nicotine addicts in the name of naming nicotine and it's users the new enemy of the people. These groups and the pharmaceutical giants are protected by the FDA not us the American citizens they were elected to. Nicotine users who use vaping instead of smoking do not cause vehicular mayhem, domestic and criminal violence, it does not render any of it's users a danger to society the way another legal drug known as alcohol and legal and illegal mind altering drugs do. Nicotine even shows promising signs in treating some mental illnesses, especially Alzheimer's Disease. CASAA | The Consumer Advocates for Smoke-Free Alternatives Association
    It's put on the boxing gloves time. We have got to be more than "pro-active", we need to hit hard and deliver every punch we can muster. whew.........I can't let them win nor can you!
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  10. #400
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    Not only that if we added positive comments to that section it would be deleted and only negative comments would remain trust me on that one. I/we know for a fact they aren't getting any profit from the sale of our e-juice and hardware to vape. Therefore until they start getting their pockets lined with money any way they can they won't let this ever end. I hate em period. Dirty rotten corporate whores. IMO I don't care if I am wrong that's how they are
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