Smoking Everywhere V. FDA Daily Docket Sheet Update--APPEAL's COURT ISSUES STAY

[andybside]

So if the ecig's INTENDED use is for delivering nicotine, and is considered a drug delivery device, then why can I go down to my local head shop and buy a frickin bong??? oh yeah, it's a tobacco pipe. sure it is!

[Sun Vaporer]

So if the ecig's INTENDED use is for delivering nicotine, and is considered a drug delivery device, then why can I go down to my local head shop and buy a frickin bong??? oh yeah, it's a tobacco pipe. sure it is!

Andy--because your bong does not have nicotine cartridge's that are specifically designed to fit your "Bong"----that is how the e-cig is marketed. A "bong' is not marketed for any specific purpose.


Sun

[Mister]

Andy--because your bong does not have nicotine cartridge's that are specifically designed to fit your "Bong"----that is how the e-cig is marketed. A "bong' is not marketed for any specific purpose.

The ........ leaf decorating motif in the local bong shop here makes the intended use quite clear.

I think it is more about the money. If some $10B/year industry were threatened by ........., I'm pretty sure that legal action would have been taken by now to ensure that the local bong shop could not survive.

[Sun Vaporer]

The ........ leaf decorating motif in the local bong shop here makes the intended use quite clear.

I think it is more about the money. If some $10B/year industry were threatened by ........., I'm pretty sure that legal action would have been taken by now to ensure that the local bong shop could not survive.

Mister---you are dealing with a totally different fact pattern here. Bongs are not sold with anything that one puts in them---e-cigs are --that being the cartridges. Think out a case, and then it makes sense.

Sun

[Garrell6888]

Then what if all PV suppliers stopped selling pre filled carts?

What if PV's weren't sold on sites that sell eliquid?

Sell pv's for use with water, as an aid to quit nicotine but keep the habit temporarily. The habit is half the addiction, wouldn't it be easier to quit half at a time?

Meanwhile someone starts selling nicotine (e liquid) liquid that comes with unprocessed tobacco for rolling or pipe use. Its safer than the kind with added carcinogens right? But........its still just tobacco. Thats legal.

Good ideas for loopholes???

[Sun Vaporer]

Then what if all PV suppliers stopped selling pre filled carts?

What if PV's weren't sold on sites that sell eliquid?

Sell pv's for use with water, as an aid to quit nicotine but keep the habit temporarily. The habit is half the addiction, wouldn't it be easier to quit half at a time?

Meanwhile someone starts selling nicotine (e liquid) liquid that comes with unprocessed tobacco for rolling or pipe use. Its safer than the kind with added carcinogens right? But........its still just tobacco. Thats legal.

Good ideas for loopholes???

Garrell--the Court does not work on "what if's" or "Loopholes. Manufactures sell and make moeny off the nicotine cartridges. It they would have just gone though the proper procedures in compliance with regulations, we all would not be in the position we are in today.

Sun

[eric]

The ........ leaf decorating motif in the local bong shop here makes the intended use quite clear.

I think it is more about the money. If some $10B/year industry were threatened by ........., I'm pretty sure that legal action would have been taken by now to ensure that the local bong shop could not survive.

Two very sound points, Mister.

[jmdjax]

I think the judge is taking so long cause he must be "vaping"

[kc0cmp]

Applefr--what would you do if you owned Paypal? They are doing what any legitmate business would do and that is get out of the crossfire of potential litigation. It is not like refusing e-cig related sales is going to affect their bottom line, rather e-cigs are an unkown. Until the Court rules and we see where this is going, Paypal did what any other business would do---which would be to listen to their Counsel and get rid of them till they are deemed legal. That is the unfortunate reality of the current state of affairs.

Sun

Your opinion seems to be that somehow Paypal could be held liable for offering a payment service.

If i were a crackhead, and If I chose to pay for my crack by check, The bank could hardly be considered liable for allowing or facilitating the payment. It is really none of paypal's business what I use their service to pay for, unless it relates to a domestic security issue (such as terrorism which is of concern to the Govt). Paypal is making it their business, either at the behest of one or several organizations, or because they have a serious problem with smokers in general and feel this (e-cigs) are akin to smoking.

I don't feel that it should ever be the business of Paypal what I use their service to pay for, as that's not Paypal's function. Paypal exists as a payment option, just like cash, checks, credit cards, money orders, or I.O.U.s... Trying to defend their stance on E-cigs is, in my opinion, taking an indefensible position.... at least in America.

[Vocalek]

Garrell--the Court does not work on "what if's" or "Loopholes. Manufactures sell and make moeny off the nicotine cartridges. It they would have just gone though the proper procedures in compliance with regulations, we all would not be in the position we are in today.

Sun

What would those "proper procedures" have been? Are you talking about registering it as a medical device and going for clinical trials? That would have been an exercise in futility. I don't believe FDA would ever have approved something for "smoking cessation" that provides as much nicotine as smoking does.

Of course we here all realize that this is EXACTLY what needs to be done to give the keepers of our health a snowball's chance in H-E-double-hocky-sticks of getting more people off tobacco cigarettes. What some of us need is "nicotine maintenance", not the FDA-approved "nicotine weaning."

But FDA listens to its "health advisors" who say things like "We're doctors. We can't recommend people stick with an addiction. They'll just have to quit." (or die)

If you are talking about a different type "proper procedure" what might that be?