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About LinkBacksOriginally Posted by MrKai
thats a good one...
SCUDOOSH
About them mobs...
I was dead serious. I think it would be an innovative thing to organize about 20 of these at a minimum, nationwide, in like train stations and bars, where at the same time, a bunch of people just whip out scigs, pipes, cigars, mods and puff away like it was 1940...film them all and put them on youTube.
I mean just like be completely and utterly non-chalant about it...even if you are in the middle of a conversation and if at least 2-3 people are in the same place it will really cause some wtf-ery
We need to really start thinking like those that would do us in
-K
All these months for a preliminary injunction. There is no justice. Time means FDA wins, no matter what the judge decides.
Last edited by SmokeyJoe; 10-23-2009 at 04:23 PM. Reason: Please, don't insult the judge - doesn't help anyone.
Flash Vaping is not a bad idea at all. A great way to educate folks about it. And you're right, lots of youtube videos... especially if we did some choreography by synching everyone's motions. HA!I was dead serious. I think it would be an innovative thing to organize about 20 of these at a minimum, nationwide, in like train stations and bars, where at the same time, a bunch of people just whip out scigs, pipes, cigars, mods and puff away like it was 1940...film them all and put them on youTube.
I mean just like be completely and utterly non-chalant about it...even if you are in the middle of a conversation and if at least 2-3 people are in the same place it will really cause some wtf-ery
We need to really start thinking like those that would do us in
-K
Anyways, they will be able to see first hand that a mass of people can vape around you without smelling a thing (cept maybe my fierce pineapple flavor). It might even stir up some media attention... hmm... we would def stir up media attention if we flash vaped naked... call it FLESH VAPING...
I agree with you. I don't think the doctor makes a good point at all. E-cigarettes are no more unsafe than the air we breathe walking down any given metropolis's streets. What the government and their cronies deem "safe" and "unsafe" is often quite hypocritical and any policies developed to address the issue usually end up damaging the public good. One example is a law in the San Francisco Bay area where you are not allowed to use your own damn fireplace during certain times of the year (and I know, because I used to live there). You're allowed to use it when the government TELLS you that you can, as if the smoke from a fireplace does more damage to the environment than the smog from the local factories. It's all hypocritical BS, just like keeping tobacco cigarettes legal while attempting to outlaw e-cigarettes. Hypocritical, bureaucratic bull****, as has become the norm in the United States.
We all know e-cigarettes are safer than their tobacco counterparts and to pretend that it is otherwise is what's disingenuous.
Last edited by quetzacoatl; 10-21-2009 at 01:06 AM.
I think we all agree E Cigs are less harmful than analog Cigs. And while it certainly shouldn't warrant banning them, it is true that no long term studies have been done on inhaling such a mass amount of PG/VG vapor. That, along with a few people who have issues with PG/VG sensativity, might suggest is not as safe as metropolitain air.
Course, on the flip side, PG vapor is used to disinfect air. Conspiracy theorists, who think swine flu or some other killer virus of some sort is man-made to reduce population, could say that PG vapor disinfects our lungs making us super-human. So maybe it is better than metroplitain air...
So, some people have PG/VG sensitivity... so what? Some people are sensitive to peanuts, that isn't grounds enough to make peanuts illegal. Some people are allergic to dairy products and that isn't grounds enough to make dairy products illegal. Just because a few people have a sensitivity to something doesn't mean that it's unsafe for the rest of the population; not only that, but there are people who have been exposed to PG for years on a regular basis with no known serious side effects. I fail to see the issue with PG, other than the FDA and special interest groups have been attempting to use the "there's no long term research" argument to shut this industry down along with a number of other arguments that have no substance behind them.
And while I am a conspiracy "theorist" (conspiracies are all around us and have existed for as long as governments have existed... there is no denying that) and I do think swine flu is a man-made virus, the idea that PG could be used to "disinfect" the lungs is far fetched, at best. I'd have to see evidence.
Found some sources:
Not without negative affects: http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/for...tml#post658895
"In May 2005, a study published in the American Journal of Industrial Medicine , conducted by the School of Environment and Health at the University of British Columbia, looked at adverse respiratory effects in crew members on a wide variety of entertainment venues ranging from live theatres, concerts, television and film productions to a video arcade. This study determined that cumulative exposure to glycol-based fogs were associated with acute and chronic adverse effects on respiratory health. This study found that short-term exposure to glycol fog was associated with coughing, dry throat, headaches, dizziness, drowsiness, and tiredness. This study also found long-term exposure to smoke and fog was associated with both short-term and long-term respiratory problems such as chest tightness and wheezing. Personnel working closest to the fog machines had reduced lung function results.and not without positive affects: http://www.ajph.org/cgi/reprint/36/4/390.pdf
Short term exposure to glycol fog can be associated with headaches, dizziness, drowsiness and tiredness.
Long term exposure to smoke and fog can be related to upper airway and voice symptoms. Extended (multi-year) exposure to smoke and fog has been associated with both short-term and long-term respiratory health problems. Efforts should be made to reduce exposure to theatrical smoke to as low a level as possible."
The report of the 3 years' study of the clinical application of the disinfection of air by glycol vapors in a children's convalescent home showed a marked reduction in the number of acute respiratory infections occurring in the wards treated with both propylene and triethylene glycols. Whereas in the control wards 132 infections occurred during the course of the three winters, there were only 13 such instances in the glycol wards during the same period.And an incredibly long list of air sanitizing products based on propylene glycol used in hospitals as approved by the FDA: PROPYLENE GLYCOL -- Pesticidal Uses
So the FDA has all sorts of ammunition too. Though I we have more especially since we must compare them to analog cigarettes.
Of course we have more ammunition. E-cigarettes don't have even close to the number of chemicals tobacco cigarettes have and whether you think PG is safe for long term use or not, the fact is that adults have the right to weigh which one is more dangerous for them to use: a tobacco cigarette or an e-cigarette. There are risks with every single product on the worldwide market and science proves itself wrong on a daily basis, so the tests that they want to do are fairly pointless in the long run, anyway, when it comes to outlawing products. Let them do the studies and let the studies be released, but they don't have the right to bar consenting adults from using the products, especially considering the vast amount of information available online. It's not like it was 50 years ago when information about what this does to your body or what that does to your body wasn't readily available to the masses. I'm an adult and I don't need the Fed to do my thinking for me or decide what's best for me.
We were already getting these side effects with tobacco smoking. So it's definitely not WORSE than tobacco. I believe that study also stated that non-smokers were affected the worst.
In addition, some of those fog machines have oils & other additives (including ethylene glycol) in them - so they stated they couldn't place the blame on PG alone.
So, some of the same MINOR side effects as tobacco smoking, yet still without 99% of the toxins.
Guess what these are the possible side effects for:
The nicotine patch.headache, dizziness, lightheadedness, drowsiness, stomach upset, nausea, flushing red, itchy or irritated skin, breathing difficulties, chest pain, irregular heartbeat, nervousness, anxiety or tremors.
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