Formidable new foe

[Vocalek]

Eric: I think you might be missing a point here. Damn near every substance under the sun is poisonous -- in large enough doses. The lab analyses you are cite are quoting from published resources about the toxicity of nicotine in general.

If any quantity of nicotine is "toxic by inhalation" then everyone who has ever smoked a cigarette has died already, and all of this discourse is being carried on by ghosts. If any amount of nicotine will kill you if it lands on your skin, why aren't people who wear the nicotine patch all lying dead in the street? Most of us who refill our own cartridges spill liquid on our skin all the time, with no ill effect. Someone I know tells me that she licks the spills off her fingers! And yet, she lives.

So then in the concentration we have it in the liquid, the nicotine is far from instantly deadly; unless, perhaps, you drink it and manage not to throw it back up. I swallowed a chunk of a Commit lozenge by accident once, and within minutes was emptying the contents of my stomach into the kitchen sink. I suspect that the larger the dose you ingest, the faster you will barf it back up again.

But I digress. We are discussing the nicotine content of exhaled vapor.

Now, after we put that liquid into our PV, vaporize a fraction of a drop of liquid, inhale it, and absorb the nicotine in our airway and lungs, the quantity of nicotine left in what we exhale is likely to be infinitesimally small. Nevertheless, Paranoyd was not talking about blowing her exhaled vapor into her child's face, or even using it within view of the child.

So IMHO, your panic is unjustified. You do what you feel is safe, but don't berate a woman who just wants to stay warm and dry.

You do Dr. Laugesen a great disservice when you try to paint him as a shill for Ruyan. If you will research him a little more thoroughly, you will find that he is a respected researcher, active in the tobacco control community, who has a goal of trying to eliminate smoking in New Zealand.

Just because Ruyan paid to have the research done does not make the research automatically a big fat lie. Who do you think pays for the clinical trials of all new drugs that are approved by the FDA? The government? Not on your life. They are paid for by the companies that own the rights to the drugs.

[Climbing down off soapbox now.]

[seminolewind]

I went to the ex-smokers forum where there was a lively debate going on regarding ecigs. The ex-smokers were 100% aginst ecigs. They said this was not the same thing as quitting smoking because we are still getting nicotine. It was argured that gum and patches have nicotine but it was like hitting your head against a brick wall. They said ecig was just another way to smoke and was not considered the same thing that all of them did. They told this person to go back to the ecig forum and that they had no place on their forum. It gave me enjoyment to read their arguments.

Of course, My dog's bigger than your dog, and all that.
Truth is for years there were 2 choices, smoke or quit. All of a sudden there's another choice, and alot of radicals can't deal with it. Something really nice happened to help a smoker. Not supposed to happen. Smokers are supposed to be like gum on the sole of your shoe. Not people who walk around with their ecig and have pride in themselves. Not someone who should be respected for quitting.

Another example of ignorance: how many recovering alcoholics have gone to a party and told by a friend or family member, "oh just have one, one won't hurt!"

[sherid]

Yeah, nothing like an out of context extract from a poorly written "research" report to settle your nerves.

Perhaps you'd find the information in the report mentioned in this thread less calming.

Link to the "lab analysis" report in the thread at this page.

Scroll down to page 4 and see the description of the "safe" characteristics of nicotine (By "safe" I mean: "toxic by inhalation" or "toxic in contact with skin" or "poison - may be fatal if swallowed".... see the report for more. And this is a report sponsored by an e-cig industry member!)

Scroll down to page 5 to see this: "The Gamucci ‘Regular’ nicotine solution contains the addictive yet poisonous nicotine component, as do traditional cigarettes. "

I've been vaping for more than six weeks now, but I've said all along: I won't vape near anyone who might be exposed to the vapor. I have no right to put the nicotine-containing vapor in a place where they might inhale it. People seem to think that just because the vapor isn't visible any longer then it - and the nicotine it likely contains - has magically disappeared. I doubt that. I can boil up a big pot of pasta and even if there's no steam cloud in my kitchen I can still feel the humidity. Same deal, I'd wager, with the vapor from an e-cig.

I think I have every right to vape if that's my choice. I don't think I have the right to expose others to nicotine. Until a credible lab - preferably associated with a reputable university, rather than one being paid by an e-cig industry member - tells me that what I'm exhaling is free of nicotine, I'll assume that those who don't want to inhale nicotine have rights superior to mine. I simply do not have any rights whatsoever to vape in places where I will expose others to the byproduct.

Do you honestly believe that the nicotine that you inhale exhales as the same? If it did and nicotine is really so addictive, wouldn't the people in bars including the anti-smokers become addicted to smoking? Clearly they are not.