Way too much info!

[John D in CT]

Look, nobody paid to see a snotfest, so let's not have one.

And the offer to explain things was to the OP, or anyone else reading this, speaking of butt-hurt.

The sticky thing is just annoying; enough said about that.

"The OP doesn't appear to be out to burn money", yet a pack a day in Connecticut is $3,175 a year, and at $6 a pack would be $2,190 a year. That really doesn't make $128 for a VMax look quite as lavish.

And I appreciate your concerns for my personal privacy, but I'm really not worried about it. I think I'm among friends here.

Let's keep the squabbling to a minimum, shall we? I've given a carefully considered answer to the OP's two posts, and I'd like to just let my previous comments speak for themselves.

***

More on-topic -

I like having a separate, dedicated DCT tank for each flavor. I'd recommend at least five, and ten would be better. All in good time, of course.

For tasting different flavors, the best thing I've found is to use a 306-style atomizer with a drip tip. The 306 is great because its little hole on top allows you to squeeze in one juice as it displaces the previous one, allowing you to taste each one with little cross-contamination of flavor. Catch the drips in a bottle labeled "?????", and try the contents when you get bored.

[thedigger]

John D,

I am a newb, only a few weeks in. I am in no way doubting your knowledge of vaping or the experience you have, but I can honestly say, as a newb, all the information you have posted for this thread has my head spinning. It is great that someone has this information and is willing to share it, I just feel it is a little too much too fast. I myself am vaping from the Volt and I love it. As long as I have my pcc with me I am good for the entire day. It is easy to use, buy juice and cartos and screw them together, two pieces, done. And you get to vape right out of the box for like $50. It being so small, I have already converted two people because I was able to pull it out of my shirt pocket and let them try it. I think that alone made it a very special purchase. I am merely stating my opinion, based on being in almost an identical situation just a few weeks ago. I know what he/she is going through, as do many others I'm sure. I too got overloaded with info, parts, measurements, batteries, th, etc. Honestly, I just about said SCREW IT and stayed with analogs. It all just seemed more of a hassle than it was worth. When I smoked I picked up a cig and a lighter and went to town. Now I pick up a battery and carto and go to town. I don't need to make sure the mah, volts, watts and all that stuff match or if I have the proper atty or a clean one in to get my fix. I'm sure once its all set up it is fun to vape, but the OP asked about the Volt, which like me, it's probably the style they have been paying the most attention to and have the most interest in, a cig size from a reputable company that has everything in a nice tidy package and ready to go when opened and that works well. I believe that is what they will get with the Volt. I do plan to get something bigger for at home, down the road, but I will never regret starting the way I did and will continue to carry my Volt to work and school. Peace.

[sailorman]

The Digger,

I understand what you're saying but I think you have the wrong impression of what's involved in a simple unit like a kGo or e-Power. There is no concern about volts, mah, watts or matching anything. It is exactly the same as using a volt, with two exceptions. Number one is that you don't have to worry about your battery running out. Number two is that, in the case of the e-Power, you have to put the battery in, just like you would do with a flashlight. Other than that, it is identical to using a volt, except the vapor is superior and the run time is longer. It is still 2 pieces, just like the volt. You can use pre-filled cartomizers, or you can fill your own, just like the volt. You don't, however, have to take your charger to work with you or change batteries there. You just pick up your kGo and a cartomizer and go to town. Just like the volt. But, unlike the volt, when the time comes, you can use many other devices to enhance your experience. You might never want to, but you will always have the option, unlike with the volt. You will also never have the situation when one battery is dying in your hand as you realize the other one has only been charging for 20 minutes. That is what will, and does, happen with a small battery e-cig and that is probably responsible for sending more people back to analogs than any other single factor.

If you are smart enough not to be confused by a single-cell flashlight, a kGo or e-Power should be no problem for you.

[John D in CT]

Digger, I appreciate the thoughtful and extremely civil post.

Yes, this can be an overwhelming subject, so I'd like to re-state the exact same advice in a simpler form.

***

All PV's work essentially the same way. A battery sends current to a coil or coils, which in turn warm and vaporize the juice to create vapor. The coils get warm because of an electrical term known as "resistance"; in other words, how hard does the coil "resist" the flow of electricity through them, causing electrons to bump into other electrons, creating friction and thereby heat, very much like the way a microwave oven heats things up. All a microwave does it get the atoms in water molecules to move faster, bump into each other, and create heat through simple friction, like the way you can get your arm warm by rubbing it with your hand.

The coils are contained either in a stand-alone atomizer (often used for "dripping", wherein the user "drips" juice right onto them and then vapes through a mouthpiece/drip tip), a "cartomizer" (combination atomizer and cartridge, where the juice is held in a polyfill that is in close proximity to the coils of the atomizer, which gives a better vape than a separate atomizer and cartridge, because the juice is delivered to the coils better; and the coil (singular) can also be found at the top of some specialized tanks that use wicks alone, and no polyfill, to feed the juice directly to a coil at the top of the tank.

I think it's safe to say that most people use cartomizers in one way or another. One very common use of a cartomizer is inside a tank, typically between 3.5 to 6ml in size, with the cartomizer running longitudinally through the middle of the tank, with o-rings sealing the juice inside the tank. A hole, holes, or a slot is either pre-made or added by the user to allow the juice to enter the cartomizer at an optimal rate. The idea, with or without a surrounding tank, is to keep the polyfill moist, but not so soggy that juice leaks out of it. Think of it they way you would with the soil of a houseplant; certainly never dry (polyfill will get scorched when too dry), and not too wet; just constantly moist. If a cartomizer is used without a tank, it must be constantly added to, maybe every ten hits or so, to keep it moist. A cartomizer inside a tank does not need to be tended to at all, until it becomes clogged after a few hundred, or maybe even a thousand hits, at which time the easiest thing to do is put another one in. Many people do clean them with good success.

One huge key to a good vape is to have the coils at just the right temperature to provide good vapor and release all of the flavor of the juice, and that obviously means delivering just the right amount of voltage from the battery to do that. I think it's pretty accurate to say that for most people and most juices, the "ideal" amount of heat/current that needs to be delivered to each coil is between 6 to 8 watts. Some like it higher, some like it lower, and it can even depend on your mood. Some day you might like your bagel on the light side, and some days you might feel like having it a little more dark and crunchy.

This is exactly where variable voltage comes in.

This is the only formula I will trouble anyone with, but it's a very important one, and is really pretty easy:

The number of watts per coil is equal to the volts going to it squared, divided by the resistance, measured in ohms, of the coil or coils in the atomizer. The formula then is "Volts x volts / resistance = watts" This is Ohm's Law.

From this formula, it can be seen that with a fixed voltage PV, it is only possible to vary the wattage by using different resistance coils/atomizers. Achieving the "exact right" wattage is difficult, but certainly not impossible. But then again, the "exact right" wattage will vary by flavor of juice, and as I previously noted, perhaps even by your present mood.

With a variable voltage PV, you can dial in any amount of watts per coil you want to, regardless of the resistance of the coil or coils, limited only by the amp capacity of the device. (OK, I have misinformed you; one last formula is in order);

Amps; consider a household lightbulb that is 110 watts, running on 110 volt household current. Amps are equal to watts divided by volts, so that would be 1 amp. A fifteen amp circuit, protected by a 15 amp circuit breaker, could run fifteen such light bulbs.

Ok, so consider a variable voltage PV that can handle 3.5 amps, like the ProVari V2. Its "circuit breaker" will trip at anything over that. Let's say it's set at 5 volts, and is powering an single coil atomizer/cartomizer that has a resistance of 1.5 ohms.

V x V / resistance = watts. 5 x 5 / 1.5 = 16.66 watts.

At 5 volts, that is 3.33 amps (Amps = watts divided by volts; 16.66 / 5 = 3.33). Just under the limit of the circuit; great.

So there it is; the reason, as best I can explain it, that variable voltage is the only way to achieve the best-tasting, most productive vape you can get on a wide variety of "attachments" (atomizers, cartomizers, clearomizers, Mega Dual Coil Cartomizers, Giantomizers, CE2 tanks, Stardust/eGo vision tanks, or whatever else). Remember that you can use almost any type of attachment on any battery/PV/power unit that uses the same type of thread pattern, with the "510" thread pattern being by far the most common one. Smaller, ciggie-like devices usuallu use the "808" thread pattern, although adapters can be had. That said, the very small battery of a device like the Volt will not be able to power most of them.

You can get a very good vape on constant voltage devices, but you will be limited to lower resistance atomizers, especially at the 3.4 to 3.7 volts that most constant voltage devices put out. And dual coil attachments will be almost unusable, since a 1.5 ohm dual coil atomizer/cartomizer, for example, will require that "optimal" 6 to 8 watts for each of the two coils, bringing the wattage required for the entire device to more like 12 to 16.

At 3.7 volts, a dual coil 1.5 ohm atty/carto will get 3.7 x 3.7 / 1.5 = 9.12 watts, but only half of that - 4.56 watts - per coil. That is simply not, IMO, enough wattage per coil for an optimal vape. I just did it, so I am convinced for myself that it's too low; minimal vapor production, and the flavor is lacking. (Not enough electrical action going on to convince enough flavor molecules to release their bond to a water or juice molecule and get released into the vapor so that it can serendipitously bounce off of a particular taste bud belonging to yours truly). I would respectfully suggest that those who say it's "just fine" simply don't realize how much finer it would be at a higher wattage per coil, and that is not an offense punishable by death. None of us know what something is like until we experience it for ourselves.

With VV, you can adjust the wattage to wherever you want, simply by selecting the voltage you want using a button or buttons and an LED readout on the device. I just vaped my Backwoods Brew "Virginia" (tobacco) blend at 4.5 volts (on the same 1.5 ohm dual coil carto inside a Smoktech 3.5ml DCT tank), and that gave me 4.5 x 4.5 / 1.5 = 13.5 total watts, 6.75 watts per coil. Much better vapor production, better flavor. I just tried it again at 5.5 volts = 20 watts total, 10 watts per coil, and that's a bit much I think, although I might grow to like it. At any rate, I have the ability to adjust the voltage/wattage to find just the right amount of coil temperature to arrive at just the right vape I want regardless of the flavor of the juice, the kind of throat hit I want, what attachment I happen to be using, or as I say, the mood I'm in.

And so can anyone reading this.

Again, my recommendation for those who don't care what size your PV is, or whether or not it looks much like a stinkie:

Smoktech VMax, $128.95, free shipping
Four IMR 18650 batteries $30
Trustfire TR-001 charger $10.99
Smoktech 3.5ml DCT tank $11.99
Boge 3.0 XL single coil cartomizer $1.80 (Five for $8.95)


Smoktech VMax:

All About Vapor

Batteries and charger:

AW IMR 18350 700mAh LiMN Rechargeable Lithium Battery

Smoktech DCT 3.5ml chrome tank (on sale):

Dual Coil Cartomizer Tank or:

3.5ml Dual Coil Tank Chrome/Black

Boge XL 3.0 ohm stainless steel cartomizers:

XL Boge 510 Cartomizers 3.0 ohm

Again, if anyone buys any of this on my recommendation and does not like its performance, I will buy it from you for what you paid for it. Shipping will be on you, and I can pay you with PayPal before you ship it. Such a deal.

Vape on.

[John D in CT]

The Digger,

I understand what you're saying but I think you have the wrong impression of what's involved in a simple unit like a kGo or e-Power. There is no concern about volts, mah, watts or matching anything. It is exactly the same as using a volt, with two exceptions. Number one is that you don't have to worry about your battery running out. Number two is that, in the case of the e-Power, you have to put the battery in, just like you would do with a flashlight. Other than that, it is identical to using a volt, except the vapor is superior and the run time is longer. It is still 2 pieces, just like the volt. You can use pre-filled cartomizers, or you can fill your own, just like the volt. You don't, however, have to take your charger to work with you or change batteries there. You just pick up your kGo and a cartomizer and go to town. Just like the volt. But, unlike the volt, when the time comes, you can use many other devices to enhance your experience. You might never want to, but you will always have the option, unlike with the volt. You will also never have the situation when one battery is dying in your hand as you realize the other one has only been charging for 20 minutes. That is what will, and does, happen with a small battery e-cig and that is probably responsible for sending more people back to analogs than any other single factor.

If you are smart enough not to be confused by a single-cell flashlight, a kGo or e-Power should be no problem for you.

"There is no concern about volts, mah, watts or matching anything ..."

- because you can't, except by using a limited selection of resistances.

To the thread in general, and not to Sailorman, who already knows this: atomizer/cartomizer resistances range from 1.25 to about 4.5, and a 3.7 volt device like an e-Power (also by Smoktech) is limited (IMO) to about 2.5 ohms on a single coil, or 1.5 ohms on a dual coil, or 5.4 and 4.5 watts per coil, respectively. There seems to be a consensus that the same amount of watts gives a better vape when derived from higher voltages and higher resistances than the converse; another reason that a VV device - typically capable of providing anywhere between 3 and 6 volts - will give a better vape than a lower voltage device.

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/for...ty-cartos.html


"If you are smart enough not to be confused by a single-cell flashlight, a kGo or e-Power should be no problem for you"

- and I guess that by that token, it's safe enough to say that if you're not confused by two-cell flashlights, a Smoktech VMax should be no problem for you, although many VV devices use just one, like the ProVari, Lavatube, and many others.

I'll conclude with two pictures of the Smoktech VMax, with a Smoktech 3.5ml DCT tank on it.

VMax portrait.jpgVMax-hand-lit up.jpg

***


Oh yeah, flavors: This thread name your fav flavor? has 509 replies. I know ... "TMI" lol

[John D in CT]

Thanks for all the advice from everyone. I am still trying to decide what I want.

I still am trying to straighten all the terminology out. (cartos, attys, tanks, clearos).

It looks like the larger ones are a little more complicated to work with. I don't think I will mind refilling the e-liquid. I have never seen any of the larger units.

It is all really pretty simple once it's explained in a clear and comprehensive way. Ever had to assemble something for the first time, and it seems complicated, and then the next one is a breeze? Same thing.

I had an idea that I was going to email to you, but since I can't, I'd like you to please email me. I'd like to try an experiment where I personally explain this all to you, and then see what you think is right for you based on what you learned.

I can tell you right now that what I'm vaping on is much better than any of the non-VV suggestions given, and I'm very interested in finding out if you're as clueless and unteachabe as many here seem to think you are. I give you more credit than that.

Do you "need" a superior vape? Hell, I don't "need" my legs, but they're nice to have. Hope to hear from you.

[vdice]

I am thinking about getting into an e-cig instead of Analog and there is way to much info to digest. I could read for hours and still not now everything.

I am looking at the Volt - Standard Starter Kit and the Ry4.

Is this a good place to start?

hi xfiles,
i know how you feel. i have been vaping mistic for a week. found this forum and was stunned by all the info and language that i didnot understand. after reading for quite awhile , i stumbled upon a thread that helped. because of that and some advice from the nice people here, i ordered my first real vaping setup. here is a copy of my order that i sent yesterday. ps: i got an email from hoosier today, that it was already shipped.(free). looks like pretty good service to me.hope this is of some help to you.........vince

Shipping Method: Free Shipping (0.00lbs.)
Payment Type: Online Credit Card
Item ID ITEMS PRICE QTY TOTAL
black KGO kit 1100mAh by SLB
Color: Rubberized Black
$42.09 1 $42.09
HEC048 Acrylic Big Belly Drip Tips
Color: 01
$1.99 1 $1.99
HEC047 Transparent Acrylic Ribbon Drip Tips
Color: C2 Black
$1.99 1 $1.99
HEC062 Boge 2.0ohm LR 510 cartomizers 5 pack
Color: Black
$7.19 1 $7.19
HEC005 USB Wall AC adaptor 500mAh $2.99 1 $2.99
HEC006 USB car adaptor 12 volt 500mAh output $3.99 1 $3.99
HEC033 Buttons for ego, KGO, riva $1.00 1 $1.00
HEC055 Black Carbon KGO lanyard and pouch $2.39 1 $2.39
HEC061 5ml Syringe and blunt 18 gauge needle $1.99 1 $1.99
HEC007 Ego carrying cases
Size: Medium - $1.00
$7.99 1 $7.99
HEC03950RY18Dekang E-Juice 18mg
Flavor: Ry4
$10.89 1 $10.89
HEC013 5ml Customizable Premium House blends
Flavor: Pure Cinnamon
Strength: 18mg - $0.35
Base: 60/40 PG/VG
$3.23 1 $3.23
HEC013 5ml Customizable Premium House blends
Flavor: Grape Soda
Strength: 18mg - $0.35
Base: 60/40 PG/VG
$3.23 1 $3.23
On Sale
New Products
YARD SALE
E-cig Kits
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USA Made E-Liquid and DIY
Dekang E-Liquid
Accessories
Batteries and chargers
Atomizers and cartridges
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Welcome to hoosier ecig supply - The Best E-cigs, Juices, and accesories https://www.hoosierecig.com/checkout...asp?k=XvXfMjm6...
1 of 2 4/27/2012 9:17 PM
HEC013 5ml Customizable Premium House blends
Flavor: Strawberry
Strength: 18mg - $0.35
Base: 60/40 PG/VG
$3.23 1 $3.23
HEC013 5ml Customizable Premium House blends
Flavor: Raspberry
Strength: 18mg - $0.35
Base: 60/40 PG/VG
$3.23 1 $3.23
HEC013 5ml Customizable Premium House blends
Flavor: Wild Cherry
Strength: 18mg - $0.35
Base: 60/40 PG/VG
$3.23 1 $3.23
XLBLK 5 pack of 1.7ohm single coil 510 cartomizer by Smok
Tech
Type: XL Black 1.7ohm
$6.99 1 $6.99
HEC049 Ego Mega Dual coil from Smok Tech 1.5ohm EMDCC
style: Black
$2.59 1 $2.59
HEC004BLKXL2.0 ohm low resistance 510 cartomizer.(single coil) 5
pack
Color: Black XL
$6.99 1 $6.99

[Lonnie Lepp]

I started with the Volt
Loved it. after a while it got tiresome to keep changing batteries, refilling carts

Moved on to a Ego 900mah battery setup and dual coil EGO Carts.
Loved it even more, still use it.

Now I have a VMax Variable Voltage battery housing and use Jugz tanks with triple punched holes at 3 ohms and 3 volts
Its great. Battery set up lasts for days. 6 mill tank needs a refill before the batteries

Bottom line
For under $60 for a complete set up tha Volt rocks
For under $100 for a complete set up the EGO sytems with the EGO Carts is awesome
For under $200 for a complete setup the VMAX, extra batteries, a charger and a Jugz tank is GREAT

YMMV
Lonnie

[X-Files]

Looks like the VMax may be a little too much to start with for me. Looking at the Volt still and the Smoktech E-Power 14650.

Could someone explain these items (from sweet-vapes)
1. Comes with your choice of e-power dual coils, XL dual coils, XL single coils, or boges cartomizers.
2. BLUE LED SWITCHES WITHOUT THE 5 CLICK FEATURE

[swedishfish]

I read here for a solid year before I ordered. I'd get a headache just reading all the info and would turn the computer off.

I finally just ordered an ego, a couple boxes of cartos and 30 ml of juice and never looked back.

Tried a lot of pv's since then but used that basic setup for close to a year. Didn't cost a lot. PV, extra battery cartos and juice cost about $70. Enough of an initial investment for something I wasn't sure I'd stick with and it had a decent warranty. Save the voltage, mah's, low resistance reading for a rainy day when your vaping and reading the forum.

A $30-$40 ego/kgo will last you a minimum of 3 months- about $10 a month. When it's on it's last leg move up if you want to. JMO.

*I know nothing about e-powers so I can't comment.