Actually, I did know about the honey. It goes back to what I was saying before. If you are the major producer of whatever, you will shoulder most of the problems. U.S. importers were not blameless in the honey situation. They knew what they were buying.Not trusting China business is hardly unfounded. I would love to trust China on all things so I could buy the illegally imported honey to make mead cheap but honey imports weren't blocked for no reason. That's just one example that you probably didn't know about.
I would love to buy cheap juice but I can't because I can't trust the Chinese to produce something I chronically ingest.
I never said a bad thing about any U.S. vendor. Any of them could be mixing in unclean conditions. We don't know one way or the other with respect to most of them. All I ever said was that "made in USA" doesn't mean what it implies. That's no secret, in e-juice or any other business. I also don't consider the fact, and yes it is a fact, that most US juice is made with Chinese nicotine to be a bad thing. The fact is that China produces somewhere near 90% of the nicotine available in the U.S.. Besides the pharmaceutical companies, where would it be going? It's cheap and just as likely to be pure as American nicotine is. So far, I haven't seen any lies about any U.S. juice vendor, so I'm not sure where you're getting that fromWho is exaggerating and fabricating nonsense about contamination and subpar quality? I see you make the claim of how much US juice is actually Chinese with nothing to back that up. This very thread has claims about US companies mixing in their bathrooms. Seems to me you're the ones coming up with unfounded claims bent on destroying good people's reputations by instilling irrational fears that aren't based on fact. Telling the FDA that US companies are mixing in unclean conditions and lying about their product is what hurts vaping, not me saying I don't trust Chinese businesses.
Sorry, it doesn't work that way with tobacco products and Chinese nicotine isn't going anywhere anyway. As long as it's around, it will be cheaper. What little is actually made in the U.S. isn't just sitting around waiting for buyers, and I don't see any boom in U.S. nicotine extraction labs. U.S. nicotine is already priced quite high. That indicates a demand, but that demand isn't being met by additional extraction labs. The reason for that is tobacco is not a "free market" crop. There are tobacco allotments, the crops are "spoken for" and they aren't about to allot extra tobacco acreage to make more nicotine in the U.S. You can't just grow as much tobacco as you want in order to meet a demand. So U.S. grown and produced nicotine will be far more expensive. If people refuse to by juice with Chinese nicotine, there won't be enough juice to go around.The more people say they don't trust Chinese juice the more US or EU companies will buy their supplies from US or EU companies. The more those juice makers buy, the more companies will make those supplies. It does nothing to harm vaping. In fact the more it avoids imports the more it makes vaping harder to ban.
Tell me one unfounded claim I've made against US companies. There are none. If a company makes juice with American nicotine, and you can afford it, then I encourage you to do so. But I'm not going to buy from an American company that shouts "Made in USA" on their website, but really uses Chinese nicotine and flavorings. And don't even try to claim that isn't happening. It happens in juice, clothing, cars and everything else you can think of.If you want to take away the fear club from the antis it is you who should stop making unfounded claims about US companies and encourage more of them to buy their goods from US sources like those who don't trust Chinese sources are doing.
It's not people's fear that is the problem, it's people's lies told in order to attack those with the fears that is the problem.
If you don't trust Chinese sources, that's fine. Buy from an American company that mixes their juice in America with American made flavorings and American made nicotine. Good luck with that. That'll eliminate about 80-90% of vendors from your shopping list. But don't pretend that the majority of US companies use American nicotine or flavorings. They don't.
Strict conditions never entered the discussion. Please show me where I said anything about JC being expensive or even using Chinese nicotine? I don't know where they get their nicotine. They're big enough that they buy vast amounts and probably buy American, if they wanted to, without paying the premium other juice companies pay. They could buy their own lab. Most juice companies can't do that. Anyway, the issue was the original source of the nicotine and other ingredients from most US vendors, not the biggest one of them all. Nobody claimed that making juice under strict conditions was overly expensive. What is the real reason for questioning claims and accusations nobody ever made? Why am I being accused of doing what I haven't done?Johnson Creek makes juice to as strict of conditions as can be and they are no more money than any other US supplied company.
That is another unfounded claim and exaggeration.
So what is the real reason?
This is the sum total of everything I've posted on this thread:
Most nicotine comes from China in a very concentrated form.
Most flavors are made from Chinese components, regardless of where they are combined.
American and EU nicotine is significantly more expensive than Chinese nic.
The word "sourced" does not mean "originated'.
The words "made in USA" doesn't necessarily mean made from U.S. components (big surprise?).
U.S. companies often take advantage of consumers' failure to understand what "made in USA" really means.
U.S. companies often take advantage of consumer's failure to understand the difference between "sourced from" and "originated from".
In proportion to what they produce, China has no worse a record than American companies (not particularly in relation to nicotine or juice, but everything).
People go to prison in China for putting contaminated products on the market, a thing unheard of in the U.S..
The biggest producer of ejuice in the world is Chinese and their factory is clean.
You can't necessarily say that about U.S. juice makers, with few exceptions where they allow inspections.
Which of those statements is false, exaggerated, fear mongering or whatever else you accused me of?