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About LinkBacksnicotine is not tobacco product ...........and for tropical bob you would fail a nicotine test but that does not make you a smoker. Someone who chews is not a smoker.Originally Posted by rmasu
nicotine is not tobacco product ...........and for tropical bob you would fail a nicotine test but that does not make you a smoker. Someone who chews is not a smoker.
Absolutely. The criteria now is not "smoking", but nicotine use. We e-smokers are no better in the view of insurance companies than a chain-smoker of cigarettes.
So, no more tomatoes?
This is true and Insurance companies will soon start asking your bathing habits
Very interesting stuff. Add me to the list of potential test candidates. Can't promise that, but I hope to. It seems there were two manufacturers of 2 different tests, or did I misunderstand? Any ways, we should all be taking the same test, and same sample (urine or saliva) and that just may be-not sure.Thanks for the update, JoAnna! Another very interesting result. Just when I thought that one has to vape intensively xx-high to max-out the test... So, this was achieved with medium-high liquid vaping? Could you add some estimate on your mileage? May not have been the same amount of cotinine (the proxy for delivered nicotine) from vaping and analogs, since highest test level is anything above the cutoff (> 1000 ng/ml). But certainly appears to be effective vaping.
Seems there can be much variation for different individuals. Just compare some graph, randomly picked from a scientific study, showing smoking habit and cotinine in urine concentrations [ng/ml] of 128 test subjects. Graph for illustration, not meant to be authoritative, here. While there is a dose dependence for the average, not everyone is the average, as reflected by the large error bars. Damn, I really thought this would turn out to be simple!
Source: Ziegler et al. (2004): Clinical Correlation between the Consumption of Nicotine and Cotinine Concentrations etc., Pharmacology 72:254–259.
I’m by no means an expert in biology or medicine. I just find the question of actual nicotine delivery from vaping personally interesting and highly important. And while we keep speculating, I‘d certainly prefer to read some professional expert’s informed opinion... But looking from my laymen’s perspective, I think that all results from the home tests (as gratefully posted by Minimike, Kate51, JoAnna1010) are (1.) internally consistent and (2.) do support the prevailing notion from user experiences and the first reports of the Laugesen/Ruyan-team, suggesting that vaping is significantly less effective for nicotine delivery than analog smoking.
It has to be noted that the Nymox home test appears to come with a relatively low cutoff (equivalent to 1000 ng/ml cotinine in urine, according to the simplistic product flyers). Most moderate smokers of 10-19 cigarettes per day would score the highest level, score above the 1000 ng/ml cutoff (see the illustrating graph above). Moreover, reading from this illustrating graph, even some occasional to light smokers would score above this cutoff. Just don’t bash JoAnna for her personal body functions, individually different for every one.
Nevertheless, a value of 200-500 ng/ml reported from someone (Kate51) who - by all means - reported constantly vaping 24 mg strength (and so I’d guess runs > 2 ml/day) IS a bench. There is not much chance that a one-pack-a-day smoker would return such a low cotinine level. But certainly, more testing and professional, better informed opinions are needed.
The margin of error in the graph presented seems quite revealing at least to this uneducated vaper. 1-9 cigarettes gives a cutoff at the 50% level. You smoke 9 cigs you'll be at the high range. You smoke 1 or 2 you'll be at the low range. 5 cigs, or average, is the mean in the bars on the graph--at the 50% --1/2 level. Same for 10-19.
Any ways, I'm in! I agree though, we will need many more "volunteers."
Ok I am going to the doc for blood work on Monday.......While I'm in there they might as well test my nicotine levels too. What tests should I ask for and should I vape right up til the test or not vape when I wake up. I'll go first thing in the a.m.
is testing blood the best way to go?
WooHoo!! I got a #3 level showing a bar!!! More to come later, gotta get to work now.
Adding Photos NicAlert Saliva Test Strip + Close-up
July 29,2009 This is a Cotinine Measurement in Saliva
Level #3 represents 100 - 200 ng/ml Cotinine in Saliva
This is from Vapor only, NO ANALOGS
Juice Nicotine Level: 18mg/ml in VGCloseup NicAlert Test July 29 2009.jpgRefer to Post #76 in this Thread, that test urine done on July 03,2009
Was level #4 200 -500 ng/ml Cotinine in Urine Using 24mg/ml Juice Only, no analogs
Will check for any discrepancy between the two types of test, but believe as of now there is no discrepancy, Real Cotinine levels are the same in both tests
NicAlert Test July 29 2009.jpg
Needless to say, I am a happy lady today!!
Last edited by Kate51; 07-30-2009 at 01:35 AM. Reason: Add photo add post#76
I hope you will let us know what you find out from your doc.
The Nymox tests do not call for any cessation.
Early morning or late night not indicated as preferable.
Yours would depend on your doc's testing. I was disappointed to hear at our hospital that they do only positive/negative, not quantity of Cotinine in blood unless it is requested, must be scheduled 2-3 mos out. Ridiculously cavalier, I think. No test kits available at all in Pharmacy. So I felt kind of lonely asking for test kits, was forced to wait for mailorder.
Let us know what you find out, good luck!
That's great! Basically, you're saying that your test results from urine and saliva are the same level, and your nicotine level is approximately 1/10 compared to what it probably was from smoking. When are you gonna smoke and test?
No way!!That's great! Basically, you're saying that your test results from urine and saliva are the same level, and your nicotine level is approximately 1/10 compared to what it probably was from smoking. When are you gonna smoke and test?
I'll get whatever data I need from published tests, I would not do that to myself ever again. My first test told me that I was already absorbing only about 1/10th of the nicotine without all those other components of cigarettes, my second test shows that I could indeed cut back from 24mg/ml juice to 18mg/ml, and if I live the rest of my life doing this level of nicotine that would be fine with me. Who knows, in a couple months I may try another cutback. I made the decision based on my comfort level. This level was also a piece of cake, not even a ripple of being "denied" anything, the non-smoking decision was made by the PV itself. I was totally comfortable doing that. I am Stoked!! Just think, not quite five months ago my Cotinine level would have been around 4000 OR MORE ng/ml. Now I am handling 200 ng/ml very well. That would be even less a span (1/2 that) than the Ruyan Tests. What an amazing thing. Yes, I wish I had known about these tests then, but would have just maxed them out, I still would have had to rely on established reports, as I am now. I love my Janty Stick!! If I could give it up today, I would, and then I'd have to frame it with a photo of myself looking healthy for the first time in 44 years. Yah, except for being 44 1/2 years older!
Last edited by Kate51; 07-30-2009 at 03:39 AM.
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