So - are we getting it or are we not - nicotine

[IANAN]

Interesting to note:

Here's something from the National Institute on Drug Abuse.

You'll notice a myopic focus on nicotine. The M.D.'s and Ph.D's go on and on with not a hint of any other factor being considered, even tangentially, in tobacco addiction.

Do we know something they don't, or have they drunken too deeply of the kool-aid?

Most NRTs treatment courses include Zyban or Welbutrin... or even Chantix- All are antidepressants. -Someone knows that nicotine alone won't cut it... even if these yahoos won't admit it.

[Vaporer]

Thumb,

The tobacco companies are required to flie a list of ingredients used in that year in thier product. Not %'s of what. It has a high non disclosure agreement that has to be signed to just read it. Making a copy for later use is a felony. For real..look it up.
They have posted lists that go into the 500's + of additives.

They have admitted to adding behavioral control substances before and ingredients that promote nic adsorbtion even a fire retardent as of late to the paper.

With that being said, figure they can do what they want , say as little as they want, and watch what happens for a profitable sales outcome. They report to basically no one.

Edit: I agree on some being in tobacco and not just the nicotine. I can use a snus and go for a longer time than just vaping. Vaping a higher level nic helps, but its not the same. I'd agree that even those "other" ingredients can be tweaked for maximum effectiveness.

[Araddoman]

Very unscientific, sure, but my own experience has convinced me that the ecig is only an alternative, like they say, not a replacement. I enjoy that I am now officially a non-smoker, but I do miss my analogs, sometimes. Over 30 years of smoking the nastiest, harshest tobacco out there and I enjoyed it all. Yes, I still got a "buzz" every morning with the first of the day and anytime I went a longer than normal period without. Ecigs don't provide that. Like my tobacco, it didn't take me long to locate and buy the highest strength nic (75mg) I could find to reproduce the same effect. I found out I could get myself feeling oogy, but that's as far as it went, no "buzz", the feeling of calm, brain stimulus, not even a good bowel movement. I've described to my wife (a lifetime non-smoker) it's kind of like being in a mental desert. Just kind of a constant mood instead of the rewarding uplift, satisfying focus I got after having a smoke. Yes, there's no doubt alot more at play here than just the nic, but atleast I can quench the craving. I just wish I could have a good bowel movement, Ha.

Your "mental desert" reference is a great description of how I would describe my frame of mind after 8 days now of vaping with no smokes at all. How long does it take for this "mental desert" feeling to go away? While the important thing is that e-cigs (only tried 24mg) completely do away with cravings, it would be very good to hear that whole "mental desert" stuff goes away or tends to fade after extended time on e-cigs. Can anyone chime in on this one?

[DVap]

Your "mental desert" reference is a great description of how I would describe my frame of mind after 8 days now of vaping with no smokes at all. How long does it take for this "mental desert" feeling to go away? While the important thing is that e-cigs (only tried 24mg) completely do away with cravings, it would be very good to hear that whole "mental desert" stuff goes away or tends to fade after extended time on e-cigs. Can anyone chime in on this one?

I'll give it a shot.

From my experience, it appears that the effects of nicotine on the brain are reversible. The first time I quit was after 14 years of analogs, I felt great within a few days, and stayed quit for 8 years. After starting up again, and finally replacing analogs with vaping, I feel great.

Here's the theory I'm left with: For some people, their brains respond strongly to tobacco MAOI's. After years of use, the brain is either slow to revert back to a pre-analog balance, or is simply unable to revert. For these people, the difficulty they have with vaping may suggest the effect of MAIO's are more or less irreversible.

Give vaping supplemented by snus a try.

[IANAN]

Or you can e-smoke while using Snus.... Gives you a very wicked high.

The problem most people will have with Snus is that it feels like you are holding a gauze pad , like from the dentist, in your upper jaw for 20-30 minutes.

Snus- you just have to try it to see if its for you-- I think its like a 1.80 for a pack of 12 right now-- so you aren't out that much cash.

[frankie1]

I read somewhere in my research, but not on this forum, that the suspicion, at least by some professionals, is that early onset, long term use of tobacco actually changes the chemical structure of the brain. For those individuals, tobacco cessation may be impossible. I'll try to find that information again and post it here.

[DVap]

Or you can e-smoke while using Snus.... Gives you a very wicked high.

The problem most people will have with Snus is that it feels like you are holding a gauze pad , like from the dentist, in your upper jaw for 20-30 minutes.

Snus- you just have to try it to see if its for you-- I think its like a 1.80 for a pack of 12 right now-- so you aren't out that much cash.

I find that snus under the front of the upper lip feels a bit uncomfortable. When I slide it more to the side over the molars, it's much better. Better still back on the side under the lower lip.

[frankie1]

My only experience with oral tobacco use was when I was about 10 and resulted in a very severe experience with vomiting!

[IANAN]

Snus isn't like chewing- its more like using the Nicotine gum but better and you don't chew it up... Its much better than just about any other oral tobacco... Its still not for everyone though.

[Vaporer]

snus isnt for everyone. But I find a strange reaction.
When adding snus to my vaping, I can go longer between vaping sessions. I dont have that " something is still missing feeling". WHen using dissolvable Ariva or Stonewall tobacco with vaping, the nic craving is suppressed faster, but the missing thing is still there.

snus, being more "less refined" than dissolvables has had the ingredient removed that causes this to occur. IMO from my stats and cravings log.

As far as placement of the snus portion, I find anywhere between the gum and lip is well suited and little difference is noted.

This would lead me to believe that snus still has the MOAI's in it, occuring in tobacco, that is either reduced or removed by processing from the dissolvables.