So - are we getting it or are we not - nicotine

[olderthandirt]

snus isnt for everyone. But I find a strange reaction.
When adding snus to my vaping, I can go longer between vaping sessions. I dont have that " something is still missing feeling". WHen using dissolvable Ariva or Stonewall tobacco with vaping, the nic craving is suppressed faster, but the missing thing is still there.
...
This would lead me to believe that snus still has the MOAI's in it, occuring in tobacco, that is either reduced or removed by processing from the dissolvables.

Your experience with snus mirrors mine Vaporer. In the short time I've been using snus my liquid consumption is down by half easily. No longer chain vaping and by all appearances I'm getting the nic or MAOI's or whatever that I need.

[frankie1]

OK I have some snus..tried it in my 801 and it did work, just like TB said. It makes a nice vape! But I am going to give it a shot. Maybe scared

[Vaporer]

frankie1,

I'm talking about having a snus in the mouth while vaping and in between vapes. My vaping can be 1/2 normal and no ill effects, cravings......
Not TB's snus juice, although it works well too.

TB is a wealth of info and if he says it, you can pretty well take it to the bank.
It just seems that when the tobacco is made into dissovables "something" is being removed thats still left in snus. Whatever it is MOAI's, specific alkaloids or other natural occuring components in tobacco that is letting the extended effect happen.

Older, we arent the only 2 that have noticed this event. It's just not getting much coverage.

[olderthandirt]

...
Older, we arent the only 2 that have noticed this event. It's just not getting much coverage.

Well, it is a vaping forum after all.

I'm just glad T Bob spoke up as often as he has regarding all alternate forms of going smokeless! Snus and vaping do certainly compliment one and other.

[kinabaloo]

But TBob always misses the key point - that for some people (perhaps a minority, but perhaps not), TBob included, nic alone does not sufficiently placate the desire (or 'addiction' as he would put it), at any reasonable dosage anyway*. That snus works, strongly suggests that other chemicals*, such as other alkaloids with MAOI effect, are needed by some people.

* if a suffieciently high dose of nic could achieve satiation, or MAOIs act partly to another effect is an interesting question; my guess would be that while MAOIs act to prolong dopamine, other effects on 'mood' may also be important in some cases
** no CO with snus; there might be acetaldehyde

[Vaporer]

Kin,

TB is working from the trenches and self experience not from the pulpit. Everyone doesnt have an expertise background in organic chemistry, plant biology, human physiology and other associated fields. So why say he misses? He's actually tried and reports effects. He's not blindly suggesting anything to anyone I know of to do something he hasn't tried himself and its effects. The fact he may not know the scientific reason or terminology shouldn't give less credence to his information and help he offers from actual experience.

Can you give me an exact chemical breakdown of all the ingredients of everything in snus vs Ariva or Stonewall for an exact comaprison to support your or my assumption?
It may be the pressure of the portion against the nerves of the mouth where it lays. If you can't prove that its not possible then you can't say it's not a possible cause.

[frankie1]

I think there is so much information that we don't have and can't get! It is irresponsible at best that our nanny government spends so much time and money on methods that do not work while trying to repress methods that do!

Vaporer: I agree, most of us do not have the education to properly research these products. Nor do we have the money! TB is a gem and does a tremendous amount of in the trenches ideas and should very well be commended for his efforts. I KNOW they have helped me a lot! (BTW, I understood you meant put the portion in the mouth LOL) Even his snus juice seems a little closer to cigarettes, probably because they have the MAOIs or whatever is the "something" I seem to be missing.

I have found Kin's information helpful although more scientific in content. I would be very interested in knowing more about his real life work! Also, Kin, if you have read about TB's snus juice method, could you give us your thoughts on that?

I hope no one is criticizing another. We are all in this together and doing the best that we can with the limited information and methods that we have. It is to say the least a bit intimidating to some of us and I, for one, welcome all the information I can get from everyone on a subject that is so vital to my personal wellbeing.

Thanks to all of you for your time and efforts.

[Vaporer]

frankie1,

What I described and older concurred, maybe you too abt using a snus extends time between vaping sessions for some, maybe many.
The dissolvables are a higher refined process and normally things are further removed by this. The nic is still there, no doubt, but the other effect just isn't the same . At least for me and older seems to confirm it as many others in diff threads have mentioned it.
Camel SNUS doesnt seem to have the best effect in this area. The Swedish type or even the Discreet snus work very well for me. I did a lot of reading from TB's description of the 2 and they are not really close in the processing. I did take a liking to the Camel Frost, but little noticeable diff on the vaping urge. General mini mints are highly favored and do produce an extended break for me.

Any others like to jump in and discuss if you've had this effect? If you've tried just the Camel and had the effect on occasion, I'd suggest trying the General mini mint (white portion) or Discreet. There is even a thread for lady snus users. SOme good info there too.
http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/for...-new-post.html

[Stubby]

I only tried the camel snus when I first started so I couldn't tell if it's less effective. Wouldn't surprise me if it was. The swedish snus is highly regulated by the swedish government as a food product. All the ingredients are known, along with how it's processed. With camel... who knows. The owner of discreet snus, which is made in the US is very open about his products, and if fact frequently post on the main snus forum.

Yes, it is a shame that there is virtually no research into harm reduction tobacco. It's all geared towards smoking and nicotine cessation as opposed to long term use of reduced harm smoking replacement. For the most part we're on our own. Fortunately we getting to the point where we have a lot of anecdotal evidence to go on. I think our best guesses are getting a lot better.

[olderthandirt]

But TBob always misses the key point - that for some people (perhaps a minority, but perhaps not), TBob included, nic alone does not sufficiently placate the desire (or 'addiction' as he would put it), ...

And for all the finer points that T Bob or anyone else might miss, we've got folks like you to fill in the blanks. And I'm glad of it Kin! The mix of experiences of the forum members makes this an interesting place indeed.

I think there is so much information that we don't have and can't get! It is irresponsible at best that our nanny government spends so much time and money on methods that do not work while trying to repress methods that do!

...most of us do not have the education to properly research these products. Nor do we have the money! TB is a gem and does a tremendous amount of in the trenches ideas and should very well be commended for his efforts. I KNOW they have helped me a lot!...

I have found Kin's information helpful although more scientific in content. I would be very interested in knowing more about his real life work!....

I hope no one is criticizing another. We are all in this together and doing the best that we can with the limited information and methods that we have....

Hmmm, lets see, oh yeah! Hi frankie. Agreed, concure, absolutely and play nice!

frankie1,

What I described and older concurred, maybe you too abt using a snus extends time between vaping sessions for some, maybe many.
The dissolvables are a higher refined process and normally things are further removed by this. The nic is still there, no doubt, but the other effect just isn't the same . At least for me and older seems to confirm it as many others in diff threads have mentioned it.
Camel SNUS doesnt seem to have the best effect in this area. The Swedish type or even the Discreet snus work very well for me. I did a lot of reading from TB's description of the 2 and they are not really close in the processing. I did take a liking to the Camel Frost, but little noticeable diff on the vaping urge. General mini mints are highly favored and do produce an extended break for me.

Any others like to jump in and discuss if you've had this effect? If you've tried just the Camel and had the effect on occasion, I'd suggest trying the General mini mint (white portion) or Discreet. There is even a thread for lady snus users. SOme good info there too.
http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/for...-new-post.html

Spot on right down the line V. With respect to the efficacy between the RJR Camel products and Discreet or the traditional Swedish snus, isande made mention to me recently that the pH of the different brands is a contributing factor in the nicotine delivery. Camel being not quite as efficient. The role that pH plays in this has been broached elswhere in some detail.

Too bad though. I really like the Camel mellow but it does not deliver. Tried several swedish, got more coming. So many to try! My current favorite for nicotine satisfaction and enjoyable flavor is the General Wintergreen White.

Edit: Hey stubby!