Calculating nicotine

[Kate]

This is the only formal test report we have Paladin - http://healthnz.co.nz/RuyanCartridgeReport21-Oct-08.pdf

It only applies to Ruyan eliquid but it's encouraging as a start.

[paladinx]

I guess someone could always compare ingredients to ruyan, im sure its probably very similar. So after reading this report kate, Would you feel safe using ruyan cartridges? I mean many of the companies selling e-cigs are making pretty profound health claims. If someone gets really sick, or even dies from using one of these products, these sellers could get sued because they are making claims that the product is either much safer or safe in absolute terms as ruyan is doing.

[Kate]

I wouldn't say it's safe to vape, we don't know what the long term consequences will be. When cigarettes were first brought out people had no idea they could harm you and were actually encouraged to smoke ... then time told all and we know now years later. That might happen with esmoking too, I'd like to think not and short term health improvements are hard to deny but who knows what tomorrow will bring.

Anyone selling these things as healthier or safer is making unfounded claims, pure and simple. They are making money out of peoples fears of the harm of smoking without any scientific backup. A few years down the line we might start dropping like flies, they will be to blame for fooling us and we will be to blame for believing them.

I take my chances with vaping, I just feel better since I stopped smoking and really I don't think vaping could be much worse than smoking. We know smoking is a killer, vaping might not be.

[TropicalBob]

I was referring to batch testing.

Tests in New Zealand and by some suppliers on their liquids have been positive, for the most part. Those are one-off tests. One liquid. One test. Until there is oversight of the entire liquid production process, we are using the liquid on faith. Faith in Chinese producers? Some worry about that after purposeful contamination for greed in recent years.

Big Pharma doesn't care about this. They have their own products to sell, all of which cost them plenty to develop and market. All they might do is subtly ask that government force e-smoking through the same costly clinical trials their nicotine-replacement items went through. End of e-smoking if that happens. No trials? No nicotine products.

[paladinx]

That is true bob. Good point. Although I still believe their current products are only aimed at current smokers, while e-smoking could be a much bigger market. Even if it falls under NRT, the idea of smoking safely will probably appeal to a much bigger crowd. Lets face it, smoking is much more enjoyable then sucking on a piece of Nicorette. If I were a Pharm company, i would view it as a potentially profitable edition to my NRT line. Probably the most profitable.

[Frankie]

Well, there is still the one all-American producer. I am vaping tasty Chinese *something* at the moment, should I switch to JC? Is is substantially safer?

[dc2k08]

as an aside, i found it interesting when i discovered recently that electronic cigarettes are not the only product that Ruyan manufacture. They also make pharmaceutical and health care products and were making them before they started to develop electronic cigarettes.

what these are I'm not sure:

Pharmaceutical
Azithromycin Granules A01
Piglydetone PG01
Mei Nuo Ping M01

Healthcare
Chenlong Baoling Longevity Ginseng BL22

I guess it just showed me that they must have a working knowledge of the industry.

[Bellinghamster]

Here's an interesting find:

Natural American Spirit@Everything2.com

This claims that the American Spirits I used to smoke contained a much higher than average tar and nicotine by virtue of using whole leaf tobacco, rather than "sheet" tobacco and the odds and ends of tobacco processing...

[quote - though i deleted all the advertising copy]
Natural American Spirit Regular Filter Cigarettes
(Turquoise Pack)
Tar 18.6 mg Nicotine 1.92 mg
Natural American Spirit Medium Filter Cigarettes
(Light Green pack)
Tar 17.8 mg Nicotine 1.79 mg
Natural American Spirit Light Filter Cigarettes
(Yellow Pack)
Tar 13.3 mg Nicotine 1.40 mg
Natural American Spirit Perique Blend Filter Cigarettes
(Black Pack)
Tar 20.5 mg Nicotine 2.12 mg
[/END QUOTE]


This pretty substantially changes my nicotine requirement calculations. Can anyone corroborate these numbers?

[Bertrand]

They sound about right. Regular cigarette tobacco has a tobacco filler to bring down the numbers. They inject tobacco with CO2 which turns it into a kind of styrofoam looking thing. If you get a pack of super ultra lights you can see a lot of it.

American Spirit (and boutique brands like Nat Sherman) use a thicker filter and more porous cigarette papers to bring down their numbers while still only using proper tobacco leaves. (It's more expensive to make it this way.)