batteries for sub-ohm ing, what's recomended?

[Hobbyvapez55]

I never go above .5, and usually stay at .2 or lower - what do you guys recomend for batteries? As far as quality over price (I'll dish out money for good batteries)

 

[nyiddle]

18650 Sony US18650VTC4 2100mAh High Discharge Flat Top Sony VTC4 (30A)

18650 LG 18650HE2 2500mAh High Discharge Flat Top LG HE2 (20A)

18650 Samsung INR18650-25R 2500mAh High Discharge FLAT Top Samsung 25R (20A)

.1 ohms = 42A. There is no 18650 (or 26650, for that matter) battery on the market capable of this.

Forgot about the

High Drain IMR 18650 Battery 30A Orbtronic SX30 rechargeable Li-ion Li-Mn

 

[Tony64]

I have an eleaf iStick 30, it goes from 0.4 - 5 ohm. So far I really love it
iStick 30W

 

[Topwater Elvis]

I assume you are looking for 18650 batteries?
For that resistance range I'd suggest using only 30a CDR batteries.

VTC4 2100mah 30a cdr
Orbtronic sx30 2100mah 30a cdr
Xtar 200mah 30a cdr (re wrapped vtc4)

 

[Baditude]

The lowest you should build safely is 0.3 ohms and above, depending upon the maximum continuous discharge rating of your battery. There are no batteries which are truly over 30 amps continuous discharge rate; a couple which are 30 amps continuous, being the Sony VTC4 and Orbtronics SX30.

Some vendors and manufacturers over-rate their battery specs by using so-called pulse discharge rates, which are unreliable and dubious specs at best. Stick with reputable brand names like Sony, Samsung, LG, Orbtronics, and AW; and pay attention to model numbers and the maximum continuous discharge rate.

Sony VTC4 2100mah 30 amp
Orbtronics SX30 2100mah 30 amp
Samsung 1865025R 2500mah 20 amp
LG 18650HE2 2500mah 20 amp
AW 18650 2200mah 20 amp (new)​

Battery Basics for Mods <--- listing of recommended batteries and specs

Deeper Understanding of Mod Batteries

Purple Efest Batteries Not As Advertised

Explain It To The Noob: Ohm's Law Calculators <--- commentary about continuous vs pulse amp ratings

 

[fattmatt805]

sony vtc4 or 5 (5s are almost impossible to get legit any more)
samsung 20r or 25 r (my favorites)
imren purple 40a
MXJO yellow 35 amps

thats what i run, and i am yet to blow myself up, and fwiw, imrbatteries.com kicked ... getting me cheap cheap batteries very fast

 

[nyiddle]

sony vtc4 or 5 (5s are almost impossible to get legit any more)
samsung 20r or 25 r (my favorites)
imren purple 40a
MXJO yellow 35 amps

thats what i run, and i am yet to blow myself up, and fwiw, imrbatteries.com kicked *** getting me cheap cheap batteries very fast

Worth noting: The Imren batteries you're talking about are 40A pulse. 20A continuous. They are re-labeled 20A batteries with inflated specs. They are no safer than a 20A battery. Keep that in mind.

Additionally, those MXJO's are likely LG HE2's. MXJO is a no-name mystery Chinese company that came out of nowhere, supposedly producing magical cells capable of things no previous cell has been capable of. I'm skeptical, to say the least.

 

[Hobbyvapez55]

I know lots of people are saying below .3 is unsafe, or insane....but that's my prefered vape, .2 and down...I use 25rs, love them, I hear so much about these Sony batteries (but I'm a die hard samsung fan for all my electronic needs).... so what's a reliable source for AUTHENIC vtcs??

 

[fattmatt805]

Worth noting: The Imren batteries you're talking about are 40A pulse. 20A continuous. They are re-labeled 20A batteries with inflated specs. They are no safer than a 20A battery. Keep that in mind.

Additionally, those MXJO's are likely LG HE2's. MXJO is a no-name mystery Chinese company that came out of nowhere, supposedly producing magical cells capable of things no previous cell has been capable of. I'm skeptical, to say the least.

i'm no expert, so be sure to take my words with a large handfull of salt. But thus far, my 2 purple imrens, and my 5 MXJO's have been flawless in operation. They do not get hot, even under pretty extreme use (my daily build is around .15)

 

[nyiddle]

I know lots of people are saying below .3 is unsafe, or insane....but that's my prefered vape, .2 and down...I use 25rs, love them, I hear so much about these Sony batteries (but I'm a die hard samsung fan for all my electronic needs).... so what's a reliable source for AUTHENIC vtcs??

Illumn and RTD Vapor. I linked to VTC4's @ Illumn in my first post (up top). They're on sale too.

i'm no expert, so be sure to take my words with a large handfull of salt. But thus far, my 2 purple imrens, and my 5 MXJO's have been flawless in operation. They do not get hot, even under pretty extreme use (my daily build is around .15)

Understood, and I've mentioned this before, people do build to .1 ohms without blowing up their hands/discharging their batteries.

If I had to guess I'd say that voltage drop through the mod is helping a lot of people out, heh. That, and VERY short pulses spread out over a long period of time.

 

[Hobbyvapez55]

Illumn and RTD Vapor. I linked to VTC4's @ Illumn in my first post (up top). They're on sale too.



Understood, and I've mentioned this before, people do build to .1 ohms without blowing up their hands/discharging their batteries.

If I had to guess I'd say that voltage drop through the mod is helping a lot of people out, heh. That, and VERY short pulses spread out over a long period of time.

Well yeah with that hard of a hit (most people) can't take a hit longer than 5secs MAX

 

[Baditude]

i'm no expert, so be sure to take my words with a large handfull of salt. But thus far, my 2 purple imrens, and my 5 MXJO's have been flawless in operation. They do not get hot, even under pretty extreme use (my daily build is around .15)

The below calculations demonstrate that the lower you go in ohms the higher the amp requirement becomes. You are also putting a lot of faith into a cheap ohm reader in being precisely accurate to the tenth/hundreth of an ohm. Always tend to err on the side of safety when you make your builds by allowing some safety head room.

1.0 ohm = 4.2 amp draw
0.9 ohm = 4.6 amp draw
0.8 ohm = 5.2 amp draw
0.7 ohms = 6 amp draw
0.6 ohms = 7 amp draw
0.5 ohms = 8.4 amp draw
0.4 ohms = 10.5 amp draw
0.3 ohms = 14.0 amp draw
0.2 ohms = 21.0 amp draw
0.1 ohms = 42.0 amp draw
0.0 ohms = dead short = battery goes into thermal runaway

Everyone is free to set their own parameters, and I can only say what mine are.

I try to never exceed 50% of the CDR (continuous discharge rating) of a fully charged battery (4.2v). So with a 20A batteries, that would be 10A. The above Ohm's Law Calculator tells me that a .4 ohm build is as low as I would want to use and have some safe headroom. You might not be aware that a loose screw in an RDA's post can drastically change a coil's resistance.

The reason that I place a 50% limit is because as a battery ages the mAh of the battery degrades, as the mAh degrades so does the batteries c rating (amp limit). So down the road, your 20A battery may only be a 10A battery.

ANY battery, when forced to perform above spec, can vent in thermal runaway. This is an irreversible condition once it begins. If your mechanical mod has inadequate venting, it quickly becomes a pipe bomb.

What's left of an exploded mechanical mod after a vented battery

 

[K_Tech]

The lowest you should build safely is 0.3 ohms and above. There are no batteries which are truly over 30 amps continuous discharge rate; a couple which are 30 amps continuous, being the Sony VTC4 and Orbtronics SX30.

Some vendors and manufacturers over-rate their battery specs by using so-called pulse discharge rates, which are unreliable and dubious specs at best. Stick with reputable brand names like Sony, Samsung, LG, Orbtronics, and AW; and pay attention to model numbers and the maximum continuous discharge rate.

I wanted to add to the highlighted portion.

There is no industry spec for pulse ratings. None. Zip. Nada. And there is no way of knowing how much and how often is considered "safe". 6 seconds at a time, not to exceed 4 times in ten minutes? 10 seconds with at least an 8 minute cool down period?

We don't know. It's a fact that pulsing a battery above its CDR raises internal temperature close to dangerous levels MUCH faster than at its CDR. And once the internal temperature gets to the thermal runaway point, it's game over for the battery and possibly a finger or a few teeth.

 

[itskohler]

Just to stir the pot here...

The Pulse rating isn't stadardized by the industry, it's what the manufacturer considers to be a pulse. Could be 5s, 6s, 10s, who knows. Most pulls are about 5-7s, so who really knows, you could be in the safe zone of your battery.

 

[fattmatt805]

Illumn and RTD Vapor. I linked to VTC4's @ Illumn in my first post (up top). They're on sale too.



Understood, and I've mentioned this before, people do build to .1 ohms without blowing up their hands/discharging their batteries.

If I had to guess I'd say that voltage drop through the mod is helping a lot of people out, heh. That, and VERY short pulses spread out over a long period of time.

the FU doesn't have much voltage drop, if any. and i do chain vape pretty often, but i definitely don't need to rely on the continuous limit as much as the pulse, i never hit my vape for more than 2 or 3 seconds, and that is no where near "continuous"

 

[nyiddle]

the FU doesn't have much voltage drop, if any. and i do chain vape pretty often, but i definitely don't need to rely on the continuous limit as much as the pulse, i never hit my vape for more than 2 or 3 seconds, and that is no where near "continuous"

All mods have voltage drop, and often the manufacturers will come out with unproven claims like, "ONLY .00001 VOLTS LOST THROUGH THE DEVICE". In most cases it's at least .05V.

Also, read the above posts about pulse vs. continuous. It's very grey area.

 

[Baditude]

Also important to note and stir the pot more:

The batteries we use in vaping were never intended to be used as we use them. They were never meant to be sold over-the-counter for individual public sale. They were intended to be used ONLY in battery packs with protected PC boards in power tools.

The fact that Sony has announced that they would no longer be selling their batteries to the general public is likely because they realized that these batteries were being used in a not recommended manner.

Final word on Sony's production plans for the US18650 VTC4 and the US18650 VTC5 (April 9, 2015)

 

[NOVA jon]

I don't understand, folks here that have been doing this for a good bit of time are giving information that they have researched to obtain, freely for the sake of safety and still, people just shrug it off!!!

Crazy! Why??!!

 

[Hobbyvapez55]

Alright alright alright - manufacturers lie, some people vape more, some people like lower ohm, sub ohm ing can be dangerous.

a few months back I saw the Orbtronic battery and thought it looked like a godsend for the vape world, but even with my inexperience in batteries I thought it seemed sketchy....so can I get some real info in the Orbtronic??...I'm honestly just needing to get this all to THREE different batteries that can keep up with being run at 0.2 - 0.1 easily...

 

[NOVA jon]

Pretty sure there have been several posts and links to batteries and what they are capable of. If you choose to go beyond what they are capable of, it's on you, baditude is the battery consultant here and has literally poured it out right there. I would suggest you head the warnings of others here and either wrap a tad bit higher and be safe, or play the "gee, hope this doesn't go south" game!!

 

[K_Tech]

I don't understand, folks here that have been doing this for a good bit of time are giving information that they have researched to obtain, freely for the sake of safety and still, people just shrug it off!!!

Crazy! Why??!!

It's a horribly poor analogy, but I don't drink and drive. Not even a glass of wine. I know a few folks that think they're okay because they've "only" had 8 or 9 beers at the VFW and they've been doing it for years. I'm not comfortable with the odds.

Alright alright alright - manufacturers lie, some people vape more, some people like lower ohm, sub ohm ing can be dangerous.

a few months back I saw the Orbtronic battery and thought it looked like a godsend for the vape world, but even with my inexperience in batteries I thought it seemed sketchy....so can I get some real info in the Orbtronic??...I'm honestly just needing to get this all to THREE different batteries that can keep up with being run at 0.2 - 0.1 easily...

At 0.2, the VTC series. At 0.1, there are NO batteries that are safe. The lowest theoretical "safe" build (for a 30 amp battery, which is the highest you'll find) is 0.14 ohms.

The 30 amp Orbtronics (SX30) I believe is a re-wrapped VTC4. I could be wrong.