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Well lets see--what does happen when you take away all the tar from smoking--common sense would say that is good--but as reported:
What happens to someone who stops inhaling the tars of cigarettes and just inhales nicotine? We don't know," Edelman says. "We are talking about use that might be three years, five years, 10 years, we just don't know. Once you have the nicotine habit, you are not likely to quit."
Rather than quit, e-cigarettes might worsen users' nicotine habits, says Michael Eriksen, ScD, director of the institute of public health at Atlanta's Georgia State University and former director of CDC's office of smoking and health.
"I have seen no evidence that people switch from tobacco cigarettes to e-cigarettes or other smokeless tobacco products," Eriksen tells WebMD. "If you look at how smokeless products are marketed, they are sold as something to use at times you can't smoke. The implication is you will increase nicotine exposure, not reduce smoking. We'll just be encouraging people to use more nicotine."
So--again if I read this correctly, all the e-cig is good for is to encourage people to use Nicotine? There just simple is no logic to that, but then again there is no logic to the FDA and all the Politics that go behind all the nonsense--That is my take on it----------Sun
What happens to someone who stops inhaling the tars of cigarettes and just inhales nicotine? We don't know," Edelman says. "We are talking about use that might be three years, five years, 10 years, we just don't know. Once you have the nicotine habit, you are not likely to quit."
Rather than quit, e-cigarettes might worsen users' nicotine habits, says Michael Eriksen, ScD, director of the institute of public health at Atlanta's Georgia State University and former director of CDC's office of smoking and health.
"I have seen no evidence that people switch from tobacco cigarettes to e-cigarettes or other smokeless tobacco products," Eriksen tells WebMD. "If you look at how smokeless products are marketed, they are sold as something to use at times you can't smoke. The implication is you will increase nicotine exposure, not reduce smoking. We'll just be encouraging people to use more nicotine."
So--again if I read this correctly, all the e-cig is good for is to encourage people to use Nicotine? There just simple is no logic to that, but then again there is no logic to the FDA and all the Politics that go behind all the nonsense--That is my take on it----------Sun
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Right Sun. I am so sick of idiots. The more I read, the more I think lack of nicotine to the brain causes stupidity and ignorance and zero common sense. Sad. 
although he is misinformed and cannot possibly see this from a smokers point of view, I DO have to partially agree with his comment which eludes to the possibility of actually increasing our nicotine intake worsening our addiction...that part at least is true, in many cases...but not all of course.
Neat little catch-22 there. Market them as an NRT and the FDA shuts you down. Don't make any claims and people like this guy twist things to say that they're marketed as a way to increase nicotine intake.
Hanger--from what I read on the posts--most are trying to cut down and then go to no-nicotine. So to the contrary, I do not see the e-cig "worsening" anybody's addiction.--Sorry, but I simply do not buy that.
Many people are taking the ill-fated postion that all aspects of the e-cig should be examined for "possibly negative effects" that are speculative, like children maybe getting hooked on them because they are "Cool" or the possible further addiction of "nicotine". WELL--how about looking at the e-cig with an eye to real harm reduction when they go under the microsope. Although there is no peer group studies as of yet, there are in fact some studies that suggest the e-cig is safer coupled with some common sense and the fact that there are no negitive studies. --------------Sun
I gotta agree with ya. I bought heavy nic e-juice, but ended up cutting it waaaaay down in favor of more vapor. I can feel minor withdrawal symptoms, but not bad, and I enjoy the basic vaping. Now, analog cigs smell nasty.
I agree and disagree with that article but it still comes down to each individual's habits/preferences. I have switched to higher nicotine eliquid and per each vaping session I probably get more nicotine in my system than I would with cigarettes but how much nicotine I take in overall in one day is still probably less than how my smoking habits were because I don't use the e-cig every hour unlike when I would smoke an analog every hour (or even half an hour).
I think the first 3 or 4 days I was OD'ing on the stuff because I was still having analog withdrawels but afterwards, I feel now that I simply don't need to puff on the e-cig all the time. In fact, I just forget about it now sometimes when I'm at work or when in the middle of a long activity.
I think the first 3 or 4 days I was OD'ing on the stuff because I was still having analog withdrawels but afterwards, I feel now that I simply don't need to puff on the e-cig all the time. In fact, I just forget about it now sometimes when I'm at work or when in the middle of a long activity.
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About this study - was it good enough for Chineese health officials to allow Ruyan to market their products in China? If so, why isn't it good enough for the rest of the world? Tell me why this can't be a baseline for the effectiveness of the concept of the product???
I get the feeling any study done to prove ecigs will meet the same fate....some stuffed shirt official will pick the study apart, never mind how shakey the arguement is against it.......
e-cigs becoming a "gateway" to regular cigs? As if anyone, once they've become accustomed to the vape of an ecig, would go to an analog's "taste-o-..." voluntarily? How many comments are there in this forum alone about the taste of analogs after just a day or 2 of vaping????
Taste-O-....
Exactly. Why would anyone voluntarily go back to stinky hair, stinky house, stinky clothes? I know I won't be, even if I have to soak tobacco leaves in water to make my own juice. (which IS dangerous)
Exactly. Why would anyone voluntarily go back to stinky hair, stinky house, stinky clothes? I know I won't be, even if I have to soak tobacco leaves in water to make my own juice. (which IS dangerous)
Gotta love clueless "experts" *sigh*
edit to add - referring to the so-called experts that were quoted in the article.
edit to add - referring to the so-called experts that were quoted in the article.
It's funny how no one really has a truly rational reason in their arguments why these should be banned outright. Whatever happened to innocent until proven guilty?
Isn't nicotine pretty much on par with caffeine in terms of harmful effects? How come people aren't picking on the Nabob man?
Isn't nicotine pretty much on par with caffeine in terms of harmful effects? How come people aren't picking on the Nabob man?
yeah, and caffeine is a psychoactive substance, according to the wiki. Yet the FDA has classified it as GRAS
Sun - it could just be that we've each been reading different types of posts...but as a newbie here who has spent the last 3 weeks solidly reading and studying for many hours each day on this forum I can tell you that one of things which immediately pops out at you as a new reader is that you get a sense from what alot of people are saying that they tend to vape more than they ever smoked. Many have cut down on the nic in their liquid so that they feel its safer to vape more often.
I especially notice an increase in young people that seem to be looking at and treating vaping as a hobby of sorts, which i personally find alarming. You cant tell the younger folk here that theyre still hurting themselves by using the nicotine...they simply dont want to hear that because they never want to stop vaping from what ive pseronsally seen thus far. Some adults seem more mature about the matter and have more realistic expectations and smarter intentions and goals when it comes to vaping...but some do not.
Another thing to consider is that it appears to me, through common sense only mind you (ill digress only to scientific/medical proof telling me otherwise), that either our bodies are absorbing the nicotine much faster OR in greater proportions with e-cigs as opposed to real cigs. I've been smoking Lucky Strikes NF and Newports heavily for 31 years now...Luckys are the strongest cigs in the U.S. and possibly the planet and I can attest with no hesitation whatsoever that in those 31 years I have never experienced anything close to the ecig "nic hit"...and NO, i dont vape 36mg...i use 16mg only and take 8-12 drags of it per hour (which are the same amount of drags ive done as a smoker). Your lungs might be feeling better on ecigs but i have a weird feeling that youre heart might not be.
As far as "harm reduction" is concerned...ehhh...to be honest even though i absolutely can see this product having that sort of potential, Im not so confident that the majority of users will have the ability to self discipline themselves in a regiment that will truly allow that...that being said there is surely a percentage of poeple that WILL...and I hope I can be among the latter group, heh.
I think to have these things scientifically accepted as actual harm reduction and especially as a cessation therapy one of thie first things that needs to be changed is that way its packaged. it needs to be packed with a certain amount of carts at so many MG's of nic for so many weeks and included with some sort of printed instructional plan that will slowly ween you off of cigarettes and then finally off of ecigs themselves. This, as a start would be a much more professional and responsible way of marketing it if the industry would ever have a chance at self regulation...which at this point is probably way too late...it should have been manufactured and marketed this way from the very start.
Lastly...i happen to believe through 45 years of life experience that for every 1 person who can act and use ecigs responsibly...there are at least 2 who cannot (without proper supervision or guidance). Most of us here are not pillars in strength when it comes to self discipline...if we WERE then we wouldnt need to be here to begin with.
As a hardened and heavy smoker for so many years (and e-cig supporter) im trying my best to look at this from both sides of the fence is all, because once you get passed all the partisan politics and corruption of it all, any reasonable person can see that there are some valid points on both sides of the issue.
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The amount of nicotine per puff via the e-cig is lower than that of a regular cig, considerably so, from what I understand.
Here is my favorite part of it all...
"It will be easy for kids to get the product," Light tells WebMD. "It could be a way to get kids into the nicotine habit to get them to smoke. It is a ploy."
lmao! YES, YES...DOWN WITH CHILDREN!!! Unbelievable!
I thought e-cig manufacturers were simply creating a product that was in demand, turns out they are planning worldwide domination, starting with the kids!
lol
"It will be easy for kids to get the product," Light tells WebMD. "It could be a way to get kids into the nicotine habit to get them to smoke. It is a ploy."
lmao! YES, YES...DOWN WITH CHILDREN!!! Unbelievable!
I thought e-cig manufacturers were simply creating a product that was in demand, turns out they are planning worldwide domination, starting with the kids!
lol
Im starting to think that because it looks like smoking, and because it works to help some quit or even smoke less, the medical/political crowd HATES e cigs.
If it was nasty, or gave no pleasure (like say the patch or the various "quit smoking happy pills" as I call them) then they would love it.
The whole gateway drug thing is just a convenient way of scaring everyone into joining the chorus of "ban it now for the children"
If it was nasty, or gave no pleasure (like say the patch or the various "quit smoking happy pills" as I call them) then they would love it.
The whole gateway drug thing is just a convenient way of scaring everyone into joining the chorus of "ban it now for the children"
Sun, you and I have been on the same side many times, and I respect your posts, but don't throw Hangar to the wolves with a blanket indictment. The article raises legitimate medical questions -- and we have no scientific answers for them. If we did, e-cigs might be well on their way to approval, not a ban.
Please also note an article today from a medical journal saying nicotine itself might trigger mouth cancer. We are saturating our mouths with vaporized nicotine contained in a humectant that gives us dry throats all day. And, no, we have no long-term studies to show if this practice is good or even more dangerous than, say, smoking a pipe.
Practices like this are exactly what the FDA is supposed to investigate. Its job is not to promote good products, but to prevent possibly dangerous ones from being marketed. So it will never be an e-smoking cheerleader. And we muster approval only with proof, which, sadly, is lacking, as this article notes.
Please also note an article today from a medical journal saying nicotine itself might trigger mouth cancer. We are saturating our mouths with vaporized nicotine contained in a humectant that gives us dry throats all day. And, no, we have no long-term studies to show if this practice is good or even more dangerous than, say, smoking a pipe.
Practices like this are exactly what the FDA is supposed to investigate. Its job is not to promote good products, but to prevent possibly dangerous ones from being marketed. So it will never be an e-smoking cheerleader. And we muster approval only with proof, which, sadly, is lacking, as this article notes.
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