Copied from: DOOMSDAY Prepping For the Possible FDA Restriction

Kurt;8436727 said:

It is my understanding that TSNAs in non-fire-cured tobacco is from fermentation, not oxidation. Oxidation is reaction with O2. In order to make nitrosamines, nitrogen oxide must be introduced, not just O2. Fire-curing does this too. Increase in snus TSNAs is probably from open-air bacteria starting to eat the tobacco. With just reaction with O2, free-base nicotine should not turn into TNSAs, just nicotine-oxides, which are not considered harmful.

I found this on long-term increase of TSNAs in snus: HowStuffWorks "How Snus Works"

Not particularly worried about it with swedish snus. Increase of 130% of already very low TNSAs is still very low. This was after 6 months, but at room temp, not freezer or fridge. At room temp, however, there is very little nic left in the snus, especially if has been opened.

I have not seen any studies that show that normal oxidation of nicotine liquids produces TSNAs, nor is the FDA evidently concerned about this. If this was a concern, they would have been all over it, and yelling from the rooftops. They did find trace TSNAs in e-liquid, but the levels were too low to quantitate, and the results were very similar to the TSNA levels in NRT gums, patches and lozenges. In the extraction process to purify nicotine, it is generally impossible to remove all the TSNAs. AEMSA does state a minimum TSNA level as being allowed, like NRTs, and it is not zero.

Most of the oxidation produces nicotine-N-oxide, which as I said is not considered harmful, and is not considered carcinogenic. Oxides do tend to have a funky taste and smell, however. And it takes only trace amounts to yellow an unflavored liquid. I personally am not particularly worried about slight oxidation, and actually I have had some clearly oxidized nics that were quite pleasant to vape. They tend to add tobacco-like notes to a liquid. I suppose that if the air-level in your environment while the bottle is being used (not sealed in the freezer) is rich in nitrogen oxide (NO), then there might be some TSNAs being produced, but I tend to think that is going to be slight. I use eurodroppers in all my dispensing bottles of unflavored nic, and the air exchange through them is pretty low.

All of my VG-nics are virtually unchanged after freezer storage, some for almost 3.5 years. Some of my PG-nics also remained unchanged after a year. Some did oxidize. PG is much more mobile at freezer temps than VG, so more likely for a nic molecule to find an O2 molecule. What caused the oxidation of some of the PG-nic? Not sure. Might be it was a lower grade nicotine in the first place, and contained other tobacco compounds, which did the majority of oxidation. Could be the PG used to make it had more O2 dissolved in it. Not sure, didn't analyze it. I will say that that PG-nic was Totally Wicked 36 mg PG Red Label, and it became orange-yellow after a year. Flavor had a distinct tobacco taste, actually quite nice! I cannot vape PG, so I gave that away, and the person who got it really likes that flavor! The other PG nics I had did not oxidize significantly in the freezer, and I would expect that to be the norm. They were Decadent Vapor, ECX, Box Elder and RTS, all of which are very pure nic in USP PG.

Thanks for posting the link to my storage method, Salem! In it are links to all the bottles and other items I use. Freezer temps do not cause nic-liquid to expand. However, you should leave a couple mL headroom anyway. Not from freezer expansion. I had one bottle of 100 mg VG that was filled to the rim for storage while my kitchen was pretty chilly in the winter. When I took that bottle out into my hot office on a summer day, that liquid expanded, and leaked out from under the euro insert! Oops! Not making that mistake again!

For those wondering if I am now stocking for a possible doomsday, a reminder that in January of 2010 there was the scary court case between NJoy and SmokingEverywhere vs the FDA. Our access to all things vaping has been under some threat since day 1, so stocking became mandatory for me pretty much since the beginning. Buying good nic when it is on sale and storing it in the freezer solves that issue for the foreseeable future.

Hardware is a bit of a different issue. Li-ion batteries do not last forever, even if not used. They store for a good long time in a fridge (not freezer). Cylinder-shape Li-ion batteries are used in countless electronic gadgets, however, and will always be available. So it might be wise to get some cheap 18650 tube mods ($20-$25). They usually last about 6 months of heavy use...it is the switch that usually gives out after a while. Box mods are also cheap and work quite well. One can buy kits to build them from MadVapes, if you are so inclined. The parts, perhaps other than the atty connector, will never be illegal. Rebuildable attys are also available, although I have not explored them. Back when I was exclusively a 510 guy, I bought a bunch of XL 510 batts and attys when they went on sale. Attys will not corrode over time, in general, and my 510 batts in the fridge, from 2009, not only still charge fine, they kept their charge for the most part. L-ion batts should be stored at least 2/3 charged for better life.

Cartomizers can be reused after a boiling-water bath. Basically put in water, boil for 15 minutes, drain, repeat this 5 or 6 times, then I oven dry them at 250 degrees. They come out almost new. For attys, I get several cycles by soaking 12 hours in polydent solution, and then rinsing thoroughly with hot water and drying. I never clean with alcohols...high atty death rate in my experience. I vape either unflavored or low-flavor light-colored juices. Easiest on attys and cartos. Carto-tanks tend to be the easiest on cartos, since they always stay wet and thus unburned by the coil. Getting cartos after a ban might be challenging, however.

Freezing flavored juices is probably ok, but I do not do this. I make fresh enough for a couple weeks, then make more. Mainly because I have found most flavors over time fade into less pleasant vaping. Tobacco flavors tend to be the opposite...they get better with time, maybe because of oxidation of the nic and other tobacco flavor compounds! Flavors will never be illegal, probably including tobacco flavors. I am fine with vaping good quality unflavored nic, however, so that is not much of an issue with me if there is a ban.

That pretty much sums it up! Figured I should jump in since I was quoted so much.

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