Titanium wire, vaping and safety
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Then why order all the way from Germany?
Indeed. Exclusively so for almost a year now.
I keep thinking about a Reo, but never pull the trigger.
I went back looking for suppliers and saw where Bloke had ordered from. I also have another one, US based I think, but went with zivipf based on Blokes glowing reports of high quality. That way if it goes wrong I can blame him, LOL.
I went back looking for suppliers and saw where Bloke had ordered from. I also have another one, US based I think, but went with zivipf based on Blokes glowing reports of high quality. That way if it goes wrong I can blame him, LOL.
Awesome news @awsum140 , really glad you're joining us on the Blue Planet 
But I must modestly decline your credit and redirect it to Tony who pioneered use of Zivipf and whose recommendation I was merely following. All I did was turn some wire blue
Now if you are also going to get a mod that allows you to adjust the coefficient to vape Ti more effectively, such as one with Infinite's Nickel Purity, then I will gladly take credit for that
Speaking of which there's now only one left Or one type I should say - the three kinds of Zero Modz clones: Geeco, and the plain and resin ones available via FT (possibly both from Infinite themselves.) Flasks and VaporSharks were all pulled in the last day or two because of VaporShark's new design patent.
Hopefully it won't be long before we see the chip in new mods. But in the meantime the Zero is not a bad choice . Adjustable 510 not spring, but that's not the end of the world.
But I must modestly decline your credit and redirect it to Tony who pioneered use of Zivipf and whose recommendation I was merely following. All I did was turn some wire blue
Now if you are also going to get a mod that allows you to adjust the coefficient to vape Ti more effectively, such as one with Infinite's Nickel Purity, then I will gladly take credit for that
Speaking of which there's now only one left
Or one type I should say - the three kinds of Zero Modz clones: Geeco, and the plain and resin ones available via FT (possibly both from Infinite themselves.) Flasks and VaporSharks were all pulled in the last day or two because of VaporShark's new design patent.Hopefully it won't be long before we see the chip in new mods. But in the meantime the Zero is not a bad choice . Adjustable 510 not spring, but that's not the end of the world.
OK, I'll blame Tony instead if it goes wrong, LOL.
I'm sitting here with five DNA boards and a DNA clone mod at the moment. The boards are still waiting for me to get properly motivated and build/convert things to install them into but the clone, Invader Mini, is working very well. I'm invested a little too far in DNA at the moment to spring for yet another, pricey at that, mod so I'll just have to lower the temperature and look for the best performance.
Anyone know if there's a squonker out there with TC and adjustable temperature coefficient curves?
I'm sitting here with five DNA boards and a DNA clone mod at the moment. The boards are still waiting for me to get properly motivated and build/convert things to install them into but the clone, Invader Mini, is working very well. I'm invested a little too far in DNA at the moment to spring for yet another, pricey at that, mod so I'll just have to lower the temperature and look for the best performance.
Anyone know if there's a squonker out there with TC and adjustable temperature coefficient curves?
There will be such a beast in the near future via Cloudmaker Tech. Modular and open source software also. I'm waiting impatiently to throw my money at them.
I totally understand, except when you say 'pricey' - the Zero mod is $59, that's at the lower price range for any decent VW, let alone one with cutting-edge TC improvements
There are some Chinese bottom feeders coming out soon, two from Yiloong (Squonk clone; 'Pinocchio' - original-ish, doesn't look great) and a Squonker from Waidea. But both are almost certainly the basic Rayn board (a la Waidea and Kangxin flasks, Heatvape Invader, KX Mini VF.) The Yiloong is definitely that based on screenshots, the Waidea is as yet unconfirmed but almost certainly will be as well. So no TCR adjustment.
Oh thank you very much [emoji14]
It will be just fine
Regarding Ti, today I threw away my last nickel build. Right now I'm 100% titanium.
Regards
Tony
Sent from my keyboard through my phone or something like that.
I tried silica, cellucotton, kgd and muji
kgd is no different compared to muji but muji is only $8 per 140 straps
both kgd and muji, much better than others including rayon... they taste better and wick better for me...
although it need more maintenance
Im wondering if the wire in the joyetech premade heads has been pre-torched or oven baked or whatever?!?! Actually that is a thought. Has anyone troied sticking a spool of Ti wire in the oven at full temp for some time?? Obviously with the plastic spool removed lol!
...i can almost here the footsteps of The Bloke as he runs to turn the cooker on at gas mark 12....
That is a very good idea When Tony first mentioned torching I immediately thought of the stove, don't know why I didn't think of the oven! It would take a bit of experimentation - I have no idea how much heat I am adding with my pulsing or Tony with his torching - but once the right temp was found it would be easy to do a whole spool at once if need be. My oven does up to 300°C I think, at least in the high 200s anyway.
Actually this reminds me of a question I had: do we know exactly what triggers the colour change? Specifically, will it change to a each given colour only at a specific temperature? So eg if it ever reaches 100°C it changes to Colour 1, at 200°C it changes to colour 2, at 300, colour 3 etc, and it doesn't matter what temperatures it reached before. Such that (in this made up example) heating to 298 then cooling to 20 would be no nearer to putting it in Colour 3 than just not heating at all
Or can it be sort of "pushed" along the scale by repeated heatings at lower temperatures?
So if I pulse at 30W, I first see it turn yellow. What I don't understand is, if, once it's yellow, I then let it cool completely, has that helped at all in getting it to blue? Will a yellow wire now reach blue sooner/cooler than a base colour wire? Or is the fact that it's currently yellow completely irrelevant for it getting to blue, because it has to be heated up to temp X to get to blue regardless of how much it has been heated before (without reaching X)
I am not explaining that very well but I hope the question is coming through. Clearly the colour states are different from say, the states of gas/liquid/solid, where a substance can be taken from its gas state to liquid to solid and back and forth, and it depends only on the current temperature. The titanium, once it has changed colour, stays changed - getting to a certain temp once permanently changes its state.
So I'm trying to understand if it getting to state 1 (yellow) changes the effort required to then get to state 2 (blue)
The reason I'm interested is when I was pulsing again last night with a longer stretch of wire I kept doing short pulses, and eventually got it yellow then eventually blue, but I wasn't sure if it eventually went blue because each pulse helped it get there (even with cooling down in between) or if it was simply that the later pulses were longer/hotter and finally got it to the right temperature threshold. I was wondering if I should have just pulsed continuously until it was blue - if I was wasting my time with those short pulses that turned it yellow, or whether in fact it was all helping "push" it along to blue, albeit slowly.
When Tony first mentioned torching I immediately thought of the stove, don't know why I didn't think of the oven! It would take a bit of experimentation - I have no idea how much heat I am adding with my pulsing or Tony with his torching - but once the right temp was found it would be easy to do a whole spool at once if need be. My oven does up to 300°C I think, at least in the high 200s anyway.Actually this reminds me of a question I had: do we know exactly what triggers the colour change? Specifically, will it change to a each given colour only at a specific temperature? So eg if it ever reaches 100°C it changes to Colour 1, at 200°C it changes to colour 2, at 300, colour 3 etc, and it doesn't matter what temperatures it reached before. Such that (in this made up example) heating to 298 then cooling to 20 would be no nearer to putting it in Colour 3 than just not heating at all
Or can it be sort of "pushed" along the scale by repeated heatings at lower temperatures?
So if I pulse at 30W, I first see it turn yellow. What I don't understand is, if, once it's yellow, I then let it cool completely, has that helped at all in getting it to blue? Will a yellow wire now reach blue sooner/cooler than a base colour wire? Or is the fact that it's currently yellow completely irrelevant for it getting to blue, because it has to be heated up to temp X to get to blue regardless of how much it has been heated before (without reaching X)
I am not explaining that very well but I hope the question is coming through. Clearly the colour states are different from say, the states of gas/liquid/solid, where a substance can be taken from its gas state to liquid to solid and back and forth, and it depends only on the current temperature. The titanium, once it has changed colour, stays changed - getting to a certain temp once permanently changes its state.
So I'm trying to understand if it getting to state 1 (yellow) changes the effort required to then get to state 2 (blue)
The reason I'm interested is when I was pulsing again last night with a longer stretch of wire I kept doing short pulses, and eventually got it yellow then eventually blue, but I wasn't sure if it eventually went blue because each pulse helped it get there (even with cooling down in between) or if it was simply that the later pulses were longer/hotter and finally got it to the right temperature threshold. I was wondering if I should have just pulsed continuously until it was blue - if I was wasting my time with those short pulses that turned it yellow, or whether in fact it was all helping "push" it along to blue, albeit slowly.
Heat coloring of titanium:
Pale Gold Straw-385 ºC = 725 ºF
Purple-412 ºC = 773.6 ºF
Deep Blue-440 ºC = 824 ºF
Red Purple-565 ºC = 1049 ºF
Brown Gray-648 ºC = 1198.4 ºF
Green Blue-925 ºC = 1697 ºF
I think it's not going to work in the oven... And as it seems former heating does not help the process. You can just control temp better by pulsing and not let it get too cold between the pulses. Did you try it by temp control mode? If this is true, you won't be able to form the dark blue as it will get temp protected.
Pale Gold Straw-385 ºC = 725 ºF
Purple-412 ºC = 773.6 ºF
Deep Blue-440 ºC = 824 ºF
Red Purple-565 ºC = 1049 ºF
Brown Gray-648 ºC = 1198.4 ºF
Green Blue-925 ºC = 1697 ºF
I think it's not going to work in the oven... And as it seems former heating does not help the process. You can just control temp better by pulsing and not let it get too cold between the pulses. Did you try it by temp control mode? If this is true, you won't be able to form the dark blue as it will get temp protected.
The colors are interference colors which result from the very thin initial oxide changing as the oxide grows in thickness.....and the colors you see are related to the wavelength of the incident light. So the color is sort of related to temperature...but it also changes with time. Another factor that can confuse it is whether their are reactive species such as organics etc. in the air or if there is anything at all on the titanium surface that could contaminate it.That is a very good idea
Actually this reminds me of a question I had: do we know exactly what triggers the colour change? Specifically, will it change to a each given colour only at a specific temperature? So eg if it ever reaches 100°C it changes to Colour 1, at 200°C it changes to colour 2, at 300, colour 3 etc, and it doesn't matter what temperatures it reached before. Such that (in this made up example) heating to 298 then cooling to 20 would be no nearer to putting it in Colour 3 than just not heating at all
Or can it be sort of "pushed" along the scale by repeated heatings at lower temperatures?
So if I pulse at 30W, I first see it turn yellow. What I don't understand is, if, once it's yellow, I then let it cool completely, has that helped at all in getting it to blue? Will a yellow wire now reach blue sooner/cooler than a base colour wire? Or is the fact that it's currently yellow completely irrelevant for it getting to blue, because it has to be heated up to temp X to get to blue regardless of how much it has been heated before (without reaching X)
I am not explaining that very well but I hope the question is coming through. Clearly the colour states are different from say, the states of gas/liquid/solid, where a substance can be taken from its gas state to liquid to solid and back and forth, and it depends only on the current temperature. The titanium, once it has changed colour, stays changed - getting to a certain temp once permanently changes its state.
So I'm trying to understand if it getting to state 1 (yellow) changes the effort required to then get to state 2 (blue)
The reason I'm interested is when I was pulsing again last night with a longer stretch of wire I kept doing short pulses, and eventually got it yellow then eventually blue, but I wasn't sure if it eventually went blue because each pulse helped it get there (even with cooling down in between) or if it was simply that the later pulses were longer/hotter and finally got it to the right temperature threshold. I was wondering if I should have just pulsed continuously until it was blue - if I was wasting my time with those short pulses that turned it yellow, or whether in fact it was all helping "push" it along to blue, albeit slowly.
Since the change in color with time is slower than the change with temperature I think you could get a reasonable relationship between color and temperature (maybe...sorta)
....but I'm not sure I would trust it.I believe our 'blue' is the one forming between gold and purple.
When I torch the wire, it starts yellow then blue, then purple and if I keep pushing it, it will suddently change to dull white/grey
Regards
Tony
Sent from my keyboard through my phone or something like that.
OK thanks very much. No I did it in normal power mode, 30W normal pulsing.
OK, so basically I need to take it to between 412 - 440°C I guess. and my earlier pulses (to yellow) were simply failed attempts at doing that, not providing any benefit to the end goal. Makes sense.
And yeah I don't have an oven that can anywhere near 400 °C
Yeah yellow and blue I see, although now you mention it I wonder if I might be going up to purple sometimes. I'm not sure if I could tell the difference that easily. I will have to do a test where I video it up close and keep heating until I've gone all the way to white. Then watch it back and hopefully be able to tell colour more easily on big screen playback (that is if the camera can capture it clearly in the first place.)
Actually I have gone too far once before, right up to one of those Titanium fires
but that was so quick I couldn't see the intervening stages.The colors are interference colors which result from the very thin initial oxide changing as the oxide grows in thickness.....and the colors you see are related to the wavelength of the incident light. So the color is sort of related to temperature...but it also changes with time. Another factor that can confuse it is whether their are reactive species such as organics etc. in the air or if there is anything at all on the titanium surface that could contaminate it.
Since the change in color with time is slower than the change with temperature I think you could get a reasonable relationship between color and temperature (maybe...sorta)
Thanks, but I'm afraid I don't really follow
Are you saying that the blue colour, once achieved, will further change over time? Or that the period of heating also affects the colour change?So we're told that 440°C = Deep Blue. Are you saying that the time over which the wire is held at 440°also plays a part? Or that it could reach that colour if it was heated at a lower temperature, for a longer period?
Also how does this correlate with the colour change chart that @SotosB posted?
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