CALIFORNIA VAPERS: Things are getting ugly...

[skoony]

I don't think it is even Realist for people who use Cig-a-Likes. And I'm not sure How Many people could get Off Cigarettes using 1ml/day.

If using an e-Cigarette costs 3 Times more than Smoking, what do you think would happen to the Rate at which people are Switching?

of course it is. two years ago the majority of smokers switched
using cigalike. although not exact the estimates were not with
out merit. today more people no doubt switch using 2nd gen.
products or newer that consume more juice. that's not the issue.
a baseline will still have to be established.
regards
mike

 

[zoiDman]

of course it is. two years ago the majority of smokers switched
using cigalike. although not exact the estimates were not with
out merit. today more people no doubt switch using 2nd gen.
products or newer that consume more juice. that's not the issue.
a baseline will still have to be established.
regards
mike

Not saying that a Cig-a-Like is Unrealistic. Heck, I switched using one. I said that using 1ml/day and being able to Switch is Questionable.

But all this is Really Off-Topic.

What is On-Topic is how a Tax on e-Liquids would be Done. And I'm not Exactly sure how a Representative is supposed to Vote on Passage without knowing Exactly will be Taxed.

 

[Lessifer]

From the bill:

This bill would additionally, on or after the first day of the first calendar quarter commencing more than 90 days on or after the effective date of the bill, impose a tax on the distribution of electronic cigarettes, as defined, based on the wholesale cost, at a rate determined annually that is equivalent to the cigarette tax rate, which would be $2.87 per package of 20 cigarettes.

That would suggest a percentage of wholesale cost.

They could try to go another way, but to be at a rate equal to cigarettes, it would have to go by mg of nicotine. In that case 0mg wouldn't be taxed, and I don't see that happening.

 

[DC2]

And I'm not Exactly sure how a Representative is supposed to Vote on Passage without knowing Exactly will be Taxed.

Quoted.

I'll leave it at that.

 

[zoiDman]

Quoted.

I'll leave it at that.

I hope it was Quoted to a Cal Senator who Represents District 38.

 

[zoiDman]

From the bill:

That would suggest a percentage of wholesale cost.

...

A Wholesale Cost of what?

Do they just put a $2.87 Tax on ever $5.00 Wholesale Cost for an "e-Cigarette"?

 

[Lessifer]

A Wholesale Cost of what?

Do they just put a $2.87 Tax on ever $5.00 Wholesale Cost for an "e-Cigarette"?

Yeah, the "what" is definitely not clearly defined. If they're using the new definition, it's everything. E-liquid, mods, batteries, vg, pg, food flavorings, cotton, wire, silica.

 

[stevegmu]

I think most politicians think e-cigarettes are basically just cigalikes one gets at gas stations. The proposed laws, for the most part, seem to be worded that way; around 1-piece units...

 

[Ca Ike]

I'm getting more depressed and angry the more I listen to the bs coming out of our reps. Cooper showed himself to be a real ignoramus during the hearings. This , as we all know , is a back door attempt at making vapor companies responsible for paying back all the lost MSA payments and the bonds sold based on them. I hope the sfata lawyers are putting together a lawsuit in prep for the court battle that needs to happen. Btw if any of you come through the valley, stop in Vapor works in Stockton and The Vapors in Tracy. Both shops are neck deep in the fight with us.

 

[FlamingoTutu]

Coming to a state near you.... Just wait. Calif. just has to try and be first.

But California isn't the first, they already lost that race.

of course it is. two years ago the majority of smokers switched
using cigalike. although not exact the estimates were not with
out merit. today more people no doubt switch using 2nd gen.
products or newer that consume more juice. that's not the issue.
a baseline will still have to be established.
regards
mike

Not sure they're actually smart enough to do that. Money first, reasoning later.

I think most politicians think e-cigarettes are basically just cigalikes one gets at gas stations. The proposed laws, for the most part, seem to be worded that way; around 1-piece units...

Won't they be in for a giant surprise.

 

[Ca Ike]

I think it's time we hold our reps personally responsible for the mess they create. The bond/program payments need to come out of their salaries, not mine. I say no paycheck for them until the bills they made are paid!!!!!!

 

[Lessifer]

I think most politicians think e-cigarettes are basically just cigalikes one gets at gas stations. The proposed laws, for the most part, seem to be worded that way; around 1-piece units...

That may be how they're written, but I doubt that's how they'll be applied.

 

[Lessifer]

I'm getting more depressed and angry the more I listen to the bs coming out of our reps. Cooper showed himself to be a real ignoramus during the hearings. This , as we all know , is a back door attempt at making vapor companies responsible for paying back all the lost MSA payments and the bonds sold based on them. I hope the sfata lawyers are putting together a lawsuit in prep for the court battle that needs to happen. Btw if any of you come through the valley, stop in Vapor works in Stockton and The Vapors in Tracy. Both shops are neck deep in the fight with us.

Funny, I hadn't heard of Vapor Workz. I used to work in Java Aroma, which according to google is what used to be where Vapor Workz is now.

 

[FlamingoTutu]

I'm still trying to wrap my head around what Washington state tried to do, and what may well happen here, with their 20% tax on other stuff vs 95% for anything vaping related. You go in to buy a drip tip, do they ask you if you are going to use it for 0mg, vaping nic juice or vaping other stuff and then you are charged accordingly? Are tobacco pipes taxed at 95%? Why 20% for something that bends your mind but 95% for something that saves your life and keeps you on an even keel? This is where we are headed in the near future and I hope those that are rooting and voting for this have to stand up and take public accountability for this ridiculous mess they are creating. All they see are short term money grabs. They don't care about us or our health no matter what they claim, let alone the children.

 

[Katya]

This is something that has come Back to Haunt Us over and over again.

And that is those Ridiculous Claims by the original Cig-a-Like Retailers/OEM's that 1ml of e-Liquid was equivalent to a Pack of Cigarettes.

Right...

This claim has so annoyed and confused vapers that poor Roly felt it was necessary to post big disclaimers (and sticky them) both in the New Members and in ECF Library. We go sick and tired of explaining this lie to new vapers--over and over again:

No, one carto is N O T equivalent to a pack of cigarettes | E-Cigarette Forum

Is a carto equal to a pack of cigarettes ? | E-Cigarette Forum

 

[Katya]

It's water vapor.

Ummm... Not quite. That's another claim (this time from our side) that's not true, but is being repeated often, here and in the media. Greg Gutfeld, a big vaping advocate, is fond of saying that. I love his pro-vaping stance but this statement is simply not accurate.

Other than that, I agree with you.

 

[Katya]

And I'm not Exactly sure how a Representative is supposed to Vote on Passage without knowing Exactly will be Taxed.

You don't? Ask Nancy!

"We have to pass this bill to find out what's in it"....

Standard operating procedure nowadays.

 

[Katya]

That would suggest a percentage of wholesale cost.

A Wholesale Cost of what?

Do they just put a $2.87 Tax on ever $5.00 Wholesale Cost for an "e-Cigarette"?

Yeah, the "what" is definitely not clearly defined. If they're using the new definition, it's everything. E-liquid, mods, batteries, vg, pg, food flavorings, cotton, wire, silica.

I'm still trying to wrap my head around what Washington state tried to do, and what may well happen here, with their 20% tax on other stuff vs 95% for anything vaping related. You go in to buy a drip tip, do they ask you if you are going to use it for 0mg, vaping nic juice or vaping other stuff and then you are charged accordingly? Are tobacco pipes taxed at 95%? Why 20% for something that bends your mind but 95% for something that saves your life and keeps you on an even keel?

 

[Lessifer]

How long does the VUSE Digital Vapor Cigarette cartridge last compared to combustible cigarettes?
It is important to note that all adult tobacco consumers use tobacco products differently, so comparing the VUSE DigitalVapor Cigarette with a combustible cigarette is not necessarily an accurate comparison. In terms of length of use, generally speaking, one VUSE Cartridge lasts about as long as a pack of combustible cigarettes.

From vusevapor

They're really not helping us....

 

[Katya]

From vusevapor

They're really not helping us....

All cigalike companies do that--they've been repeating this claim from day one. Hence Roly's stickies. We've been fighting it for years.