Brillipower 40A 3100mAh 18650 Bench Test Results...only a 15A+, 3000mAh battery

Discussion in 'Batteries and Chargers' started by Mooch, Sep 19, 2015.

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  1. Mooch

    Mooch Electron Wrangler Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Supporting member
    May 13, 2015
    Tested at 10A-40A constant current and 40A pulsed. These cells were purchased by me and used only for testing. To prevent any confusion with the eGo-type "batteries", I use the term "cell" here to refer to a single 18650, 26650, etc.

    These are safety-oriented tests, not for performance. Though you can get a lot of performance information from them they are primarily done to check the manufacturer's/rewrapper's ratings and to establish safe continuous discharge limits.


    Disclaimer
    The conclusions and recommendations I make based on these tests are only my personal opinion. Carefully research any battery you are considering using before purchasing.

    Testing batteries at their limits is dangerous and should never, ever, be attempted by anyone who has not thoroughly studied the dangers involved and how to minimize them. My safety precautions are the ones I have elected to take and you should not assume they will protect you if you attempt to do any testing. Do the research and create your own testing methods and safety precautions.

    image.jpg image.jpg image.jpg image.jpg


    Bottom Line
    In my opinion, this is a 15A+ continuous discharge current (CDR) cell with capacity lower than its rating. I recommend not using it above 20A as it runs at a very high temperature at those current levels. At its 40A continuous rating the voltage instantly plummets and the cell quickly gets very, very hot. I have included a 40A pulsed discharge (its rating) but I haven't set pass/fail standards for pulse testing yet.


    Continuous-Current Test Results
    image.jpg


    40A Pulsed-Current Test Results
    These pulsed-current tests are only done to show the performance of the cell at its pulse or maximum discharge rating. Do not set your coils or power levels to draw this much current!
    image.jpg


    Comments
    • At 10A it reached about 2750mAh. This is below average performance for a 3100mAh-rated cell at 10A. I am giving this cell a capacity rating of 3000mAh.
    • At 15A the maximum temperature reached 74°C. This is the temperature a Samsung 25R reaches at 20A.
    • At 20A the maximum temperature reached 88°C. This is way above the 78°C average for a cell operating at its CDR.
    • At 25A the temperature rose to 102°C, exceeding my 100°C safety limit.
    • Discharges at 30A and 35A were not done as it would have resulted in the cell temperature exceeding my 100°C safety limit.
    • A discharge at 40A was done to show the performance of the cell at its 40A rating. The voltage dropped immediately to 3.3V and sank down quickly from there.
    • While five additional cycles at 20A only showed about the same amount of damage a cell being operated at its CDR for several cycles would show, it runs way too hot at 20A.
    • I am setting a CDR of 15A+ for this cell. It runs at the same temperature as a 25R at 15A but is too hot at 20A. It is most certainly not a 40A cell.
    • A single pulsed-current discharge at 40A (4 secs on/30 secs off) was done to test the cell at its rating. The first pulse dropped the voltage down to about 3.2V. Its temperature rose to 66°C before the voltage eventually dropped to 2.50V.

    To see how other cells have tested and how hard you can safely push them, check out these links:

    List of Battery Tests | E-Cigarette Forum

    18650 Safety Grades -- Picking a Safe Battery to Vape With | E-Cigarette Forum
     
  2. Jimi D.

    Jimi D. ECF Guru ECF Veteran

    Oct 26, 2010
    Florida Keys
    Jeez.. That's awful. I'm glad I buy my batteries from RTD or Illumination Supply. I feel bad for the people who buy this crap. So dangerous being that sub ohm is very popular now. Thanks for all your hard work Mooch.
     
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  3. opticruby

    opticruby Super Member ECF Veteran

    Apr 19, 2015
    UK
    It never ceases to amaze me all these inflated amp ratings but 40A on a 15+A cell is shocking.

    Thankyou for testing and posting Mooch.
     
  4. sonicbomb

    sonicbomb Vaping Master Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Feb 17, 2015
    1187 Hunterwasser
    Well played sir
     
    Eric Auer and Mooch like this.
  5. Susan~S

    Susan~S ECF Guru Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Mar 12, 2014
    Mpls/St.Paul, MN
  6. Mooch

    Mooch Electron Wrangler Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Supporting member
    May 13, 2015
  7. Gary M

    Gary M Full Member

    Sep 21, 2015
    Thank you, Mooch
     
    Eric Auer and Mooch like this.
  8. sonicbomb

    sonicbomb Vaping Master Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Feb 17, 2015
    1187 Hunterwasser
    Awesome on the GG shoutout. Not so brilliant or powerful it would seem.
     
    Eric Auer and Mooch like this.
  9. Mike89

    Mike89 Full Member

    Apr 25, 2015
    I wonder if the dudes from Brillipower, MXJO, and Efest all hang out together at Starbucks.
     
    Eric Auer likes this.
  10. d4gger

    d4gger Super Member ECF Veteran

    Nov 25, 2014
    Hattiesburg, MS, USA
    They're all smarter than to pay extra for a nice label.. They hang out at the local bar, where coffee is free.
     
  11. vaporman-Kay

    vaporman-Kay Unresolved Status

    Oct 8, 2015
    This link submitter maybe a expert of smoke oil and e-cigarette but possiblely not so much professional
    on batteries. And according to him,there without a good battery now.
    1. With regard to 40A
    Our battery label 40A is the max discharge current and the continuous discharge rate is 20A+.
    The maximum instantaneous discharge pulse can reach 60A.

    This battery is designed for all consumer electronic cigarette which could meet all the regular box mods demand!
    When using a electronic cigarette, it only take a few second, and the batteries only discharge for a few seconds.
    And it is unavoidable that it will be at a high temperature if high drain batteries continuously discharge for a very long time such as 1 hour, 2 hours.
    Just like a high speed engine, long time working phone, all their temperature will rise which is determined by the batteries performance.

    2. With regard to "hot"
    He said that our batteries will be very hot when discharge at 15A , 20A, 25A in a long time, it is also unavoidable. Even if at 10A, a battery continuously discharge for a very long time,
    it will also get hot. When using a ecigs, users only sucks for a few second and the batteries also continuously for a few second, and then batteries have sometime for heat dissipation.
    In such a situation, it is impossible for the batteries to reach a very high temperature and get very hot. Our batteries will always be safe and will not explore.
    Because all our batteries with safety vent, the safety vent will be opened when battery’s temperature is too high and automatically stopped discharge.
    The reviewer say that the temperature will arrive 102C when 25A continuous discharge. This is impossible.
    And any brand batteries even sony, samsung lg,panasonic batteries will get very hot also if continuously discharge for a very long time.
     
  12. vaporman-Kay

    vaporman-Kay Unresolved Status

    Oct 8, 2015
    This link submitter maybe a expert of smoke oil and e-cigarette but possiblely not so much professional
    on batteries. And according to him,there without a good battery now.
    1. With regard to 40A
    Our battery label 40A is the max discharge current and the continuous discharge rate is 20A+.
    The maximum instantaneous discharge pulse can reach 60A.

    This battery is designed for all consumer electronic cigarette which could meet all the regular box mods demand!
    When using a electronic cigarette, it only take a few second, and the batteries only discharge for a few seconds.
    And it is unavoidable that it will be at a high temperature if high drain batteries continuously discharge for a very long time such as 1 hour, 2 hours.
    Just like a high speed engine, long time working phone, all their temperature will rise which is determined by the batteries performance.

    2. With regard to "hot"
    He said that our batteries will be very hot when discharge at 15A , 20A, 25A in a long time, it is also unavoidable. Even if at 10A, a battery continuously discharge for a very long time,
    it will also get hot. When using a ecigs, users only sucks for a few second and the batteries also continuously for a few second, and then batteries have sometime for heat dissipation.
    In such a situation, it is impossible for the batteries to reach a very high temperature and get very hot. Our batteries will always be safe and will not explore.
    Because all our batteries with safety vent, the safety vent will be opened when battery’s temperature is too high and automatically stopped discharge.
    The reviewer say that the temperature will arrive 102C when 25A continuous discharge. This is impossible.
    And any brand batteries even sony, samsung lg,panasonic batteries will get very hot also if continuously discharge for a very long time.
     
  13. ckquatt

    ckquatt Ultra Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Oct 8, 2013
    Milledgeville, GA
    LOL!!! Subbed!!
    [​IMG]




    Sent from my Commodore 64 using Tapatalk
     
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  14. Mooch

    Mooch Electron Wrangler Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Supporting member
    May 13, 2015
    Wecome to ECF!

    I think you may have me confused for someone else. I don't know anything about smoke oil and only a bit about e-cigarettes. But I do know a few things about batteries. I have been testing them for my clients since 1992. How long have you been testing batteries?

    A few things...
    • If Brillipower has given this battery a 20A continuous rating then why doesn't the wrap say "20A/40A", or something to indicate that the continuous rating is not 40A. Why do you make everyone search for this information?
    • If you put "40A" on your batteries then you are saying it can do 40A under any circumstances. Your battery does not say "40A pulsed" or even "40W max discharge current".
    • You're missing the entire point of the continuous current discharge tests, in my opinion clearly indicating that you have very limited experience with characterizing battery performance and setting specifications. Of course batteries get hot when discharged continuously. These tests are done to establish the continuous current rating of a battery, not to simulate vaping. The continuous rating is one of the most important specifications used to compare one battery to another. The only way to determine this rating is to measure its performance and temperature at various continuous discharge current levels. You then decide how much of a performance decrease you're willing to accept over a given cycle life and you pick the highest continuous current level that doesn't damage the battery beyond that. Pretty basic stuff.
    • What temperatures did this battery reach in your testing?
    • Your battery runs hotter than most of the batteries being used by vapors. That's why it was given a 15A+ rating instead of a 20A or higher rating. The purpose of a rating is to allow the comparing of different batteries. If 20A batteries from Samsung, Sony, and LG only reach 74°C-82°C at 20A continuous, do you feel its correct to call the Brillipower a 20A battery if it reaches 88°C? That's 10°C above the average....a lot.
    • Please post the results of your testing of the Brillipower battery so we can see the temperatures the battery reached. I tested two cells and both reach approximately 100°C at 25A. Lots of batteries reach this temperature, and higher, when run way above their rating.
    • Of course the Samsung, Sony,and LG batteries will get hot if discharged continuously. That's why the test is so valuable for deciding what batteries to use for a particular application. As you must know, temperature is the biggest factor in the aging of a battery. A battery that runs cooler than others has a good chance of lasting longer before needing to be replaced. Or, it can be run at a higher current level and last the same amount of time. That's why cooling running batteries often have higher current ratings. And it's why I rated the Brllipower at 15A+. If it's discharged at 20A it gets hotter than most any other 20A battery. That means shorter life. And that means it can't have the same rating as other batteries that run cooler at the same current level. This is basic stuff.
    • I never even hinted that the Brillipower battery would explode. It is incredibly hard to push a lithium-manganese, or even a "hybrid" chemistry, battery into thermal runaway unless it is short-circuited.
    • It is not impossible for a battery to get very hot when vaping. And I'm stunned by your lack of concern regarding an important safety aspect of battery use....a malfunctioning device. If a regulated mod autofires or an unregulated/mechanical mod has a broken/stuck button'or it gets accidentally pressed in a pocket then the temperature the battery reaches becomes incredibly important. How a battery manufacturer/reseller can completely ignore this aspect of battery safety is very upsetting to see. Knowing how hot a battery would get if the device malfunctions should be something every vaper has an opportunity to learn if they want to. That's another very important reason for these continuous current tests!
    • I find your lack of understanding of how your battery's safety vent functions....disturbing. The discharge does not stop if the battery vents. If the load applied to the battery continues then the heating of the battery will continue. This can be a big problem because the first venting can clog the path to the vent and allow the pressure and temperature to rise higher before the battery, hopefully, vents again.
    • If the "max discharge current " rating is 40A, what is it? It's not continuous. And you have a 60A "max instantaneous discharge pulse" rating. I'm confused as to what this rating means.
    • If the "max instantaneous discharge pulse" rating is 60A, what is the rated length and duty cycle for those pulses? What was the highest battery temperature allowed when setting this rating? It's not a rating without the conditions used to establish the rating. Unless you just doubled and tripled your continuous rating for these other ratings, that is. But, surely, you would never have even considered doing that!!
     
  15. sonicbomb

    sonicbomb Vaping Master Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Feb 17, 2015
    1187 Hunterwasser
    "I find your lack of understanding of how your battery's safety vent functions....disturbing"
    ~ Mooch Vader
     
    NoFumus, Baditude, Haadkoe and 9 others like this.
  16. Mooch

    Mooch Electron Wrangler Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Supporting member
    May 13, 2015
  17. fordp

    fordp Full Member Verified Member

    Jan 30, 2015
    Dallas
    Nothing safe about diving a shipwreck, or exploring a desolate island.
     

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  18. danjaman

    danjaman Super Member ECF Veteran

    Dec 18, 2014
    bristol, england.
    Nice work Mr Mooch, vapers all over the world salute you for the stellar job you do of informing us of dangerous batteries.

    Many thanks from England!

    Sent from my XT1032 using Tapatalk
     
    Mooch likes this.
  19. Marikc0

    Marikc0 Full Member

    Jul 23, 2014
    United States
    To be fair there are a lot of situations that only require <15A and for that 3000mAh isn't bad at all, but it's obvious that you shouldn't claim a battery is something that it's not.
     
    Mooch likes this.
  20. Mooch

    Mooch Electron Wrangler Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Supporting member
    May 13, 2015
    Agreed! If they had just labeled it 15A, 15A/40A, or even 20A/40A, it would have been ok and I would have said that it met its ratings. It's this labeling of batteries with any old number they can think of (unless they say how it's a rating) instead of a true rating that gets me all riled up.
     
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