Cotton Wick - To boil or not to boil , that is the question.

[BigEgo]

I am researching stuff lately as I want to build my own wicks.

I'm sorry, but to all the "I use xxyy and it works fine" on all forums everywhere, that doesn't mean squat. Analog cigarettes work fine too until you get a tumor years later. What we really want to know is, how safe it is and what we can do to make it more safe.

From what I've found, no one knows.

Is organic cotton safer than sterile cotton?
Probably so

Why do you say this? Sterile cotton has been specifically treated for medical use which often requires that no microorganisms are present. Organic cotton merely means that the cotton was grown with certain soil and without certain pesticides. It says nothing about the cotton being sterile. Cotton has natural microorganisms that live within it and just because it is organic does not mean these are not present. In fact, organic cotton likely has less treatment which means it is probably less safe.

What causes lung problems with cotton are endotoxins (bacteria). For instance, from a paper on pubmed: Bactericidal treatment of raw c... [AIHA J (Fairfax, Va). 2003 Jan-Feb] - PubMed - NCBI

Also, bacteria and fungi present in cotton do not in themselves cause byssinosis, but the endotoxins-heat-stable lipopolysaccharide-protein complexes contained in the cell wall of Gram-negative bacteria-are responsible for the development of this respiratory disease of workers on cotton, flax, and some other fibers.

The purpose of that paper was to study how to cut down on the respiratory diseases found in cotton workers. They treated the cotton with benzododecinium bromide to study it's effect on these bacteria (it basically killed them). I have no idea how organic cotton is treated or whether such treatments are effective. I am not saying it is not safe, I am merely saying I don't know. I would err on the side of caution and use sterile, USP cotton.

Is something OK to inhale just because it is OK to rub on a cut?
Hell no. What is this logic? Would you smoke Mercurochrome?

The same could be said about Glycerine. It is used quite often in skin care products. So it seems we are using "that logic" not just with wicks but with a key ingredient in all vapor. Does this mean glycerine is unsafe to inhale? No, it's safe at least in moderate quantities. Long-term effects are still unknown.

Will boiling get rid of left over stuff in the cotton?
I haven't found a shred of evidence of this. I will probably boil in distilled water just because it 'might' help. But who is to say what evaporates, gets left behind, or dissolves... Different materials have different boiling points, densities, ability to dissolve, etc. People _speculate_ this helps and I agree, but am also _speculating_.

I agree. Different microorganisms have different heat tolerances (I would be less concerned with the tap water, though). This is why sterile cotton used for medical purposes is treated with very high temperatures and pressurized among other things. It's not as simple as putting it in some water and boiling it.

Is cotton safer than silica?
People seem to _think_ it is. I read at least one article where someone played amateur scientist and claimed particles were given off from the silica, but there doesn't seem to be good hard evidence. Cotton certainly seems easier to work with in my own opinion.

The silica argument has been pretty well hashed out on this forum and settled as far as I am concerned. The silica used in these wicks is amorphous and not crystalline (this is what causes silicosis). The particle size of these amorphous wicks is too large to cause any serious respiratory distress. You would need smaller particles (like in crystalline silica) to cause permanent damage. Further, the silica in our wicks is wet and not really "airborne" like you would see in factories, for instance. Moreover, silica is far more tolerant to heat than cotton is, which makes it better for wicking. The downside is that it is so damned hard to work with if you rebuild.

 

[brekehan]

Why do you say this? Sterile cotton has been specifically treated for medical use which often requires that no microorganisms are present. Organic cotton merely means that the cotton was grown with certain soil and without certain pesticides. It says nothing about the cotton being sterile. Cotton has natural microorganisms that live within it and just because it is organic does not mean these are not present. In fact, organic cotton likely has less treatment which means it is probably less safe.

Because all we have to do to put the "sterile" label on the package is heat it up and seal it or add a chemical to it that is safe if contacted in an open wound.

Again, "Safe for medicine use" does not mean go inhale it. Wiping something on your skin is vastly different than heating it up and inhaling it. (a certain forum filtered street drug name) is used medicinally in hospitals as a blood clotting agent. That doesn't mean we should feel safe about smoking (a certain forum filtered street drug name). I could name a thousand substances that are obviously harmful if inhaled, but are safe for medicinal use and are safe in open wounds.

At least organic, you know have peace of mind that there isn't any unknown pesticide or chemical used to "sterilize." Sure, you have a point about micro-organisms, hence the boiling dilemma.

All we can really conclude is "probably so." Notice, I didn't say certainly. As you are saying yourself, we simply do not know what is in these materials. I'm more than a little worried about it, for myself, and how people are spreading things around by word of mouth via, "I tried XYZ and it works fine" What does "works fine" mean? You didn't keel over and die instantly? Well, that's good, but I don't think people should stop their concern with that. I think we should find out more about what we're inhaling.

Don't get me wrong. I am not for any government intervention or the FDA getting involved. That would just result in taxes, bannings, and regulation, along with political garbage. But as popular as e cigs have become and given the number of people starting to rebuild. It sure would be nice is someone could give us some expert information. Non profit group? I dunno. It sure would make me feel better if some unbiased organization wrote "we looked at this XYZ brand, labeled ABC, in the lab and found nothing but cotton."

...The purpose of that paper was to study how to cut down on the respiratory diseases found in cotton workers. They treated the cotton with benzododecinium bromide to study it's effect on these bacteria (it basically killed them). I have no idea how organic cotton is treated or whether such treatments are effective. I am not saying it is not safe, I am merely saying I don't know. I would err on the side of caution and use sterile, USP cotton.

Interesting, but as we have discussed. We can sterilize organic cotton ourselves, no? All we have to do is heat it up. Even heating it to in the oven to temp lower than that which would cause it to catch fire, would wipe out most microorganisms, no? I'd feel safer using something that I knew was free and clear of chemicals and pesticides + heated myself vs something that could have anything in it that someone else heated or added an unknown chemical to. But, like you said, we don't really know what it takes to kill off everything. So all I can conclude is "probably."

Of course, everything I said is my summarized opinion. I did not mean to imply I had any expertise at all aside from reading and drawing conclusions.

 

[Road_House]

To clear up a statement in post #1, it has been suggested to burn your cotton to determine if it is 100% if you're not sure. It will be reduced to nothing but ash if 100% cotton. If some of the fibers melt and turn hard, then it's not 100% pure cotton and includes synthetic fibers not safe to vape.

You don't use the burnt cotton for wick

 

[Whatnametouse]

I just tried my first cotton build, 2nd build in general, and used regular pharmacy brand cotton, not boiled. Is this an issue?

 

[btgm71]

I just tried my first cotton build, 2nd build in general, and used regular pharmacy brand cotton, not boiled. Is this an issue?

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It's only an issue if it's an issue to you.

 

[Goodrat]

Organic does not mean safer.
Are lower pesticide residues a good reason to buy organic? Probably not. | Science Sushi, Scientific American Blog Network

 

[defdock]

have not had a problem with the walgreens organic cotton balls but, doing some reading it appears they use hydrogen peroxide to clean them. While I have not seen any off flavors or issues I am a little weary of the hydrogen peroxide.

hydrogen peroxide is as safe as water. it basicaly IS water.
no need to fear

 

[tententacles]

hydrogen peroxide is as safe as water. it basicaly IS water.
no need to fear

Actually, it's not like water at all: hydrogen peroxide

That said, I would think that when it is turned into vapor, it turns into hydrogen and oxygen, which are plentiful in our atmosphere and should be safe to inhale.

 

[kissthefloor]

sorry for digging an old thread. New to rebuilding, and i used cotton swabs that are for skin care/make up removal. Tested it, fired it up. wicks well but i am having a very bad cotton taste, and the flavours are very muted.

What am i doing wrong?

(P.S: nope didnt boil them.)