DNA 40, NR, Nickel Builds

[DejayRezme]

I've heard of people wrapper ni200 around kanthal and still being able to have temp control.

I want to try the other way around, thin kanthal around nickel. That way the kanthal should have zero electrical influence on the coil and only serve to increase the surface / heat sink. I just need to get some really thin kanthal.

DNA 40, NR, Nickel Builds | Page 120 | E-Cigarette Forum

 

[Phone Guy]

I want to try the other way around, thin kanthal around nickel. That way the kanthal should have zero electrical influence on the coil and only serve to increase the surface / heat sink. I just need to get some really thin kanthal.

DNA 40, NR, Nickel Builds | Page 120 | E-Cigarette Forum

Lightning vapes has 34g kanthal and kanthal ribbon. And they are about the cheapest place around

Kanthal A1 Resistance Wire | Lightning Vapes

 

[sunnata]

would the resulting coil as DejaRezme describes fall somewhere near .10 ohms? always wanted to try a clapton build

 

[Phone Guy]

@Phone Guy it's all ni200 and both wires are annealed.

Man, now I gotta buy 28g Ni200!? man vaping gear gets pricey after a while LOL

Nickel clapton with TC .......... Look out, here come's PHONE GUY!!!!!!!!!!

 

[DejayRezme]

would the resulting coil as DejaRezme describes fall somewhere near .10 ohms? always wanted to try a clapton build

Basically it should have the same resistance as a normal 28 AWG coil with the same wraps / slightly smaller diameter. Or whatever wire gauge you use for the inside of the clapton coil. Of course that's just the theory, I never actually build a clapton coil

 

[ATylerRose]

Came up with this idea yesterday for a vertical build on my veritas, I've been calling it variable spacing. The idea is to have less heat near the top where little airflow is available, and to have more heat near the center of the airflow. will report back how it holds up in a few days.impressed with results so far.

sorry for the terrible pic:

tempered 28ga ni200 + rayon

Well I gave this a try. The lowest tempered Ni200 I have is 29 gauge but I wrapped the coil then wicked it. Installing it off the rod was a challenge on the Veritas and I'm definitely sure I have enough rayon in there but they are much more mangled than installing on a rod. I straighten it out and properly posisitioned it in front of the air hole the best I could. So far so good this will be a practiced makes perfect. Thanks for your help.

 

[Alexander Mundy]

I want to try the other way around, thin kanthal around nickel. That way the kanthal should have zero electrical influence on the coil and only serve to increase the surface / heat sink. I just need to get some really thin kanthal.

DNA 40, NR, Nickel Builds | Page 120 | E-Cigarette Forum

kingorchid on eBay has Kanthal sizes all the way down to 46g

 

[BNEAT]

Mundy, your signiture just keeps getting better and better!

 

[sunnata]

Well I gave this a try. The lowest tempered Ni200 I have is 29 gauge but I wrapped the coil then wicked it. Installing it off the rod was a challenge on the Veritas and I'm definitely sure I have enough rayon in there but they are much more mangled than installing on a rod. I straighten it out and properly posisitioned it in front of the air hole the best I could. So far so good this will be a practiced makes perfect. Thanks for your help.

Agreed that it's a bit weird at first, and I also believe it gets better with practice. I find that long leads are very helpful, and trapping the wires clockwise becomes more helpful than ever. I also like to pre-bend an U on the leads prior to mounting. I sort of measure the distance from coil to screw(eyeballing), then bend an U so that it sort of snaps into place while installing, and all I have to do is pull on the lead to keep it in place.

a pic in case this makes little sense, please excuse my drawing skills:

terrible drawing is terrible. please pretend the bend goes clockwise

 

[tchavei]

Agreed that it's a bit weird at first, and I also believe it gets better with practice. I find that long leads are very helpful, and trapping the wires clockwise becomes more helpful than ever. I also like to pre-bend an U on the leads prior to mounting. I sort of measure the distance from coil to screw(eyeballing), then bend an U so that it sort of snaps into place while installing, and all I have to do is pull on the lead to keep it in place.

a pic in case this makes little sense, please excuse my drawing skills:

terrible drawing is terrible. please pretend the bend goes clockwise

Am I the only one impressed with this drawing?

Are you an illustrator or had drawing classes? I'm a noob regarding art but those strokes made me have flashbacks of some illustrated kids books.

Very cool

Regards
Tony

Sent from my keyboard through my phone or something like that.

 

[ATylerRose]

Agreed that it's a bit weird at first, and I also believe it gets better with practice. I find that long leads are very helpful, and trapping the wires clockwise becomes more helpful than ever. I also like to pre-bend an U on the leads prior to mounting. I sort of measure the distance from coil to screw(eyeballing), then bend an U so that it sort of snaps into place while installing, and all I have to do is pull on the lead to keep it in place.

a pic in case this makes little sense, please excuse my drawing skills:

terrible drawing is terrible. please pretend the bend goes clockwise

Wow that's an amazing illustration and I can definetly see where doing the prebend will help. My awkwardness with this is those little screws on the top. As I tighten it down my wire seems to twist my coil out of shape. I'm using my little curved needle nose (feeling like I wish I can a 3rd hand) LOL. I've also had a problem with a hot leg on the top lead so I've been trying to leave my top fluff a little long right there for insulation. Thanks again for all the great ideas. You rock

 

[Phone Guy]

So is there any advantage to building higher ohm ni200 Coils? Is pretty hard to get to 0.5 and above, most of my build have been closer to 0.12 to 0.19 range.

Is there any advantage or disadvantage either way?

 

[Major911]

So is there any advantage to building higher ohm ni200 Coils? Is pretty hard to get to 0.5 and above, most of my build have been closer to 0.12 to 0.19 range.

Is there any advantage or disadvantage either way?

You are actually right in the sweet range .12 - .19. For ni200. .5 is too high for nickel.

 

[falken02]

On DNA40, experimentally, 0.1-0.2Ω (cold, which means vaping between 0.2 and 0.4Ω) seems to be working best for its power range.
<0.1Ω can be overwhelming (and not officially supported), >0.2Ω can lead to below ideal heat capacity (slow coil) and higher risks of unnoticed hot spots.

 

[Phone Guy]

Great, glad I'm doing that right. now, why must they be spaced? Why can't ni200 Coils be touching micro Coils?

 

[drmarble]

Great, glad I'm doing that right. now, why must they be spaced? Why can't ni200 Coils be touching micro Coils?

Kanthal forms an oxide layer on the surface that is non-conducting. Nickle doesn't. A contact coil can have shorts between the wraps if the coils touch. Some times they don't have any problems, other times the could resistance is low and variable. Leaving a little space prevents this shorting.

 

[jks89]

A contact coil can have shorts between the wraps if the coils touch. Some times they don't have any problems, other times the could resistance is low and variable. Leaving a little space prevents this shorting.

I'm wondering if this might be causing some of my problems. I've only done a few nickel builds so far (with no great results), but when I pull them out I've noticed that portions of them are blackened, while other parts still look shiny and new. I think I may also be having some issues with my wicking, I still haven't been able to find the "right amount" on any of the RTAs I've used (Subtank, Delta II, and Lemo 2 so far).

I've been wrapping 3mm ID coils, and have tried using strips of cotton 3x, 2x, and 1x of the ID, but each time it starts off great (probably because the wick is soaked from pre-juicing and positioning) and very quickly starts dropping my watts down as low as 1 to keep it under temp.

I'll have to try doing a coil with some spacing, and see if it goes any better.

 

[Phone Guy]

Ok, so here's yet another question. I've been building using 30g ni200. Usually 2.5mm to 3mm ID Coils. When you guys build these type Coils and wick them, are you pull just barely enough cotton as not to deform the coil, which to me seems like too little cotton. I'm used to wicking kanthal where it's somewhat firmly packed in the coil. But when I try to similarly wick the ni200 Coils they bend all out of shape. (so yeah to address something said earlier. Maybe I am using too much cotton?)

 

[sunnata]

Ok, so here's yet another question. I've been building using 30g ni200. Usually 2.5mm to 3mm ID Coils. When you guys build these type Coils and wick them, are you pull just barely enough cotton as not to deform the coil, which to me seems like too little cotton. I'm used to wicking kanthal where it's somewhat firmly packed in the coil. But when I try to similarly wick the ni200 Coils they bend all out of shape. (so yeah to address something said earlier. Maybe I am using too much cotton?)

personally, I pack my wicks with lots of rayon, normally it does deform the coil when passing the wick thru, turning spaced coils into contact coils. Then a little bit of pulling on the wick back and forth gently, and the coil becomes spaced again...and it's time to vape.

YMMV

g'luck

 

[Rikk]

I fought using spaced coils in the beginning. Mostly because micro coils was all I ever used.

Once I started using and got use to using spaced coils, I stopped having issues with hot spots/legs and found it was much easier to keep the coil under temp while still having a great vape.

I don't do lung hits so I rely on having my coil heavily saturated to keep it below temp, versus having a massive amount of airflow. I obviously still have some, but can't rely on it to much to keep my coil cool since I MTL. So I pack my coil with lots of cotton. And it's been very successful for me.

I use tempered nickel which helps keep the coil stable when wicking it. My winds do move some when wicking, but I just readjust them if they squish closely together. When I was using annealed that was more of an issue than it is now.

When I say I pack my coil, my coil ID is 3mm and I cut a strip of KGD that's about 6mm wide. I remove both outer skins, very thin skins and I don't compress the cotton. I just twist the end to get it through the coil and then work the rest through the coil pulling it back and forth. It's completely full and packed inside the coil, but not compressed, if that makes sense.

For me, that's the trick that works best for me. Using a lot of cotton, but making sure it's not rolled and compressed inside the coil. I've never had an issue of using too much cotton where it's choking the coil. Probably because it's a spaced coil. I'm sure this probably wouldn't work as well with a micro coil.

Well, that's what works for me guys, but your milage may vary. But I think it's certainly worth a try. And I would love to hear what works best for you.