Precisely! I will continue esmoking regardless- unless it is shown somewhere that Esmoking is magnitudes worse than ciggs, but I'd at least liek to know what it is that I am smoking-
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Precisely! I will continue esmoking regardless- unless it is shown somewhere that Esmoking is magnitudes worse than ciggs, but I'd at least liek to know what it is that I am smoking-
apologies are due to big Pharm..guess what? Thailand makes its own Nicotine gum now!
The Nation which posted the original article also posted a story last year about Yongyuth Tundulawessa's admirable undertaking to help reduce the number of cigarette addicts..
AKA Lets get them addicted to my sh*t.
it would be guess that the anonymous Dr Varanant Buejeap and the esteemed Yongyuth Tundulawessa if not one in the same are in league. I would not be slow in casting The Nation into the fire for good measure also.
The Nation which posted the original article also posted a story last year about Yongyuth Tundulawessa's admirable undertaking to help reduce the number of cigarette addicts..
AKA Lets get them addicted to my sh*t.
it would be guess that the anonymous Dr Varanant Buejeap and the esteemed Yongyuth Tundulawessa if not one in the same are in league. I would not be slow in casting The Nation into the fire for good measure also.
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Naz, you don't have to bend over backwards to give her the benefit of the doubt. She's making an extraordinary claim, the onus is on her to support it, not on us to be neutral. Not all claims are equal and there's no obligation to treat claims that run counter to all known evidence as valid until proven otherwise.
That "article" is a travesty. I spent my entire adult life as a journalist for reputable publications, where facts and truth were important. Attribution was important. Accuracy was important. No reader question was left unasked in an interview.
At Time/Life, there were researchers whose job was the check every fact before an article was printed. The article didn't get printed until there was a blue check mark above every fact.
You'd never see something as pathetic as this Thai "article" printed in the New York Times, LA Times, Washington Post or my papers, the St. Petersburg Times and The Tampa Tribune.
I guess I take personal offense at shoddy journalism.
Way to go, DC.
At Time/Life, there were researchers whose job was the check every fact before an article was printed. The article didn't get printed until there was a blue check mark above every fact.
You'd never see something as pathetic as this Thai "article" printed in the New York Times, LA Times, Washington Post or my papers, the St. Petersburg Times and The Tampa Tribune.
I guess I take personal offense at shoddy journalism.
Way to go, DC.
I'm not tryign ot do that, I am though curious as to whether there is any truth to what she says- My hope is that it's all bubkis, but I also want to know if there indeed might be carcinogens, and if so, how many, and how severe might htey be- I'm an armchair medical/biology investigator, and I've learned that the bodies chemistry is a remarkable and complicated machine, and while her claims might be exaggerated, or outright false, if htere is soem basis of truth, I'd liek to know abotu it so that I know what we're takign in in fairly large quantities-
I personally am not all that concerned, as I still do smoek regular ciggs, but if there are soem carcinogens, I wantot know about them just for the sake of makign informed descions one way or hte other.
That's all I'm suggesting, not that we give her any benefit of doubt, or to outright dismiss her without knowing for sure- I just want hte truth one way or hte other.
I agree TB- the article is very very shoddy, as I stated in previous post- I do blogging on my own site, and if there is soemthign that I am 'reporting on' (Blogging reporting, which is different than journalism reporting) that can't be verified, and shown so that the reader has evidence to back up the claims, I don't report on it- period. The National article was a very bad example of journalism in my opinion, but again, the 'what-if' comes into play now that hte article is out htere- and what I am after is the truth, as it pertains to a product I use heavily- Most likely htere isn't any truth, but what-if there is? I just want to know- that's all.
P.S I've used the Tampa tribune for soem info on stories i nthe past- woohoo (Yes, I know, hard ot beleive with my bad spelling I report on stuff lol, but I take my time as laboriuous as it is to make sure I write well)
@DC: if they do not respond, you could try pressuring them a bit by asking if the university stands behind Dr Varanant Buejeap's words/study. If that doesn't work, ask if she works there. It of course would help if you were journalist or researcher.
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I did send mails to 3 top-tier addresses listed on their site asking if there was anyone by that name who worked there and then some then other Q's. so far no responses and none from The Nation either. Perhaps school is still out for the summer though.
my thinking is still that whole story is bollix. just a case of prooving the guilty party/ies.
"bluejeap".... what sort of name is that anyway. Maybe Bob would know if there is some sort of watchdog media group we can get on the case.
This sentence suggest that tests might not have been carried out at the school but by a researcher who works at the school..
my thinking is still that whole story is bollix. just a case of prooving the guilty party/ies.
"bluejeap".... what sort of name is that anyway. Maybe Bob would know if there is some sort of watchdog media group we can get on the case.
Unfortunately, I don't. There is so much junk journalism around the globe that I would pity any watchdog group trying to investigate it. I stick with my bet that this "article" is a government ploy to brainwash the masses so a ban looks to be in the public's best interest.
I truly believe that casting doubt, or raising alarms, was the main intent of the article. If you look at some of the responses here, they accomplished their goal. I'm not gonna stress about it at all unless there is some actual research to back it up.
-Dusty-
-Dusty-
You need to ask someone who actually runs the department or whatever.
I'm sure one could make e-liquid "with 28 carcinogenic substances, such as
alkaloida, which releases substances that have amphetaminelike effects". It really depends on how e-liquid is manufactured. That doesn't mean every e-liquid would nor that e-cig would be more dangerous than cigs.
After reading that for the 10th time, I think "nicotine released by the electronic cigarette is absorbed into blood vessels faster than regular cigarettes" is the only new tibid of information they learned. Considering your lungs wouldn't be covered in tar all the time, I might actually believe this. I would imagine this can be adjusted easily if need be.
Nicotine increasing blood pressure isn't exactly news.
Nor is higher blood pressure increasing risk of heart failure.
So yeah, this is what I'd like to call FUD(Fear, uncertainty and doubt) flavored with a hint of new information.
I'm sure one could make e-liquid "with 28 carcinogenic substances, such as
alkaloida, which releases substances that have amphetaminelike effects". It really depends on how e-liquid is manufactured. That doesn't mean every e-liquid would nor that e-cig would be more dangerous than cigs.
After reading that for the 10th time, I think "nicotine released by the electronic cigarette is absorbed into blood vessels faster than regular cigarettes" is the only new tibid of information they learned. Considering your lungs wouldn't be covered in tar all the time, I might actually believe this. I would imagine this can be adjusted easily if need be.
Nicotine increasing blood pressure isn't exactly news.
Nor is higher blood pressure increasing risk of heart failure.
So yeah, this is what I'd like to call FUD(Fear, uncertainty and doubt) flavored with a hint of new information.
excellenty point jigtg- if they are going to ban the devices, they will have to prove every single liquid sold causes the 28 carcinogens (or thereabouts) because as you said- there are many different concoctions of juice on the market. As well, who knows if that study didn't intentionally add stuff to be tested that they knew would show up bad? What juice did they test? What device? Was their device pre-primed at hte factory with the bad substances?
We need answers !!! Not generalizations by some dentist who apparently can't be bothered to provide the evidences to back their claims up.
We need answers !!! Not generalizations by some dentist who apparently can't be bothered to provide the evidences to back their claims up.
I'm not concerned about the allegations; I'm concerned about the impact the unfounded allegations will have on those who read this "article" -- and don't know better. Words in print are powerful. And believed. I spent a career with them.
This also tells us a great deal about our enemies. Forget the article; remember the hoopla it caused even among us. It's not a trivial thing.
This also tells us a great deal about our enemies. Forget the article; remember the hoopla it caused even among us. It's not a trivial thing.
it didnt cause any hoopla with me,because i disregarded it immediately as unsubstantiated blurting.
but yeah,to the uninformed its pretty damaging stuff...
theres always been propaganda...the question is-what are we supposed to do about it?
i dont think we can do much about this kind of article until a legitimate and comprehensive study is fully completed and published,and gives us hopefully favourable,concrete facts to hurl back...
so we are currently relatively powerless to defend our position against quacks like this.
but yeah,to the uninformed its pretty damaging stuff...
theres always been propaganda...the question is-what are we supposed to do about it?
i dont think we can do much about this kind of article until a legitimate and comprehensive study is fully completed and published,and gives us hopefully favourable,concrete facts to hurl back...
so we are currently relatively powerless to defend our position against quacks like this.
exactly, because it's the rabid anti-everythingers, the rabid anti-smokers who will grab words liek the article, run to congress with htem and scream bloody murder while we e-vaperers who don't have a powerful voice, will be left wonderign what just happened when the products become banned.- that's beeny my concern as well, s with any misinformation ot info that hasn't been backed up with evidence.
im not convinced the government is in on the game unless they themselves make a tidy profit from the nicotene gum that is patented by a university professor, made in thailand and marketed by him at universities to students who wish to quit the weed. remember, this gum is sold only through pharmacies and dentists in thailand.
The thai government has prooved to me by their anti-smoking measures that their only agenda is to get people off tobacco, so unless i find that some ministers are connected to the prof or the thai government earns a huge margin of their taxes through the gum, i scratch them off the list. what i would like to do is investigate the professor which i will try to...still no returned mails by the way.
The thai government has prooved to me by their anti-smoking measures that their only agenda is to get people off tobacco, so unless i find that some ministers are connected to the prof or the thai government earns a huge margin of their taxes through the gum, i scratch them off the list. what i would like to do is investigate the professor which i will try to...still no returned mails by the way.
Keep at 'em, DC. But read Dr. Loi's posts when his study was effectively shut down by the Thai government. It's all about money. Thailand is very anti-cigarette, yes, but it will also be very anti e-cigarette. Bet on it. This might just be a rogue researcher looking to kick up sales of nicotine gum, but I still smell something stronger than that ...
You still haven't been able to confirm this "doctor" even exists, right?
You still haven't been able to confirm this "doctor" even exists, right?
yeah bob, dr bluejeap does not exist outside of that article and nor does the odd surname "bluejeap". I was not aware of Dr loi's posts about the restrictions the thai government put on his research. thank-you for making me aware of them. are they located in the forum? i will try to find them and take them into consideration.
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