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E-liquid lab/toxicology reports

Discussion in 'Health, Safety and Vaping' started by Oliver, Oct 6, 2008.

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  1. Oliver

    Oliver ECF Founder, formerly SmokeyJoe Admin Verified Member ECF Veteran

  2. Oliver

    Oliver ECF Founder, formerly SmokeyJoe Admin Verified Member ECF Veteran

    reserved for future use
     
  3. Kimmiegrif

    Kimmiegrif Super Member ECF Veteran

    Sep 21, 2008
    Maryland USA
    I am confused. I couldn't download the report.
     
    humdingher likes this.
  4. Kimmiegrif

    Kimmiegrif Super Member ECF Veteran

    Sep 21, 2008
    Maryland USA
    okay now I see the links...they didn't show up the first time I read your post or I didn't see them.
     
  5. ApOsTle51

    ApOsTle51 Moved On ECF Veteran

    Aug 29, 2008
    UK
    the link to the report of pillboxes totally wicked liquid in joes initial post is for the cartridges that pillbox stocks not his Wicked Range.

    Heres a link to the latest Totally Wicked E-Smoking Liquid lab report.
     
  6. jigtg

    jigtg Super Member ECF Veteran

    Aug 4, 2008
    Sparta, Greece
  7. Silver

    Silver ɹǝʌןıs Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Supporting member
    Jan 24, 2008
    New Zealand
  8. convert

    convert Full Member

    Sep 3, 2008
    Near Leeds UK
    Silver - great report. Where did you find the link? I've been on the nz website and can't find a reference to the latest report
     
  9. Silver

    Silver ɹǝʌןıs Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Supporting member
    Jan 24, 2008
    New Zealand
    Hi Convert,

    I (like many others) found this second version of the report on the NZ site when it first came out. I was keeping an eye out for it since we knew a further report was due to come out around that time. Being a NZ resident, and an avid e-smoker, you could say I was very interested in reading it ;). As soon as I found it I downloaded a copy and saved the link in my favourites.

    Strangely enough, I can only find the first report on their site (under R&D Plan - Ruyan e-cigarette) at this time and I have no idea why that is. All I can think of is that when the first report came out, it went offline quite quickly because it was getting so many hits that they couldn't cope :rolleyes: ! Perhaps that's why they've put it somewhere less easy to find ? I really don't know.

    I e-mailed Dr. Laugesen recently to enquire whether there had been any further publications, but he replied that "more tests were being carried out and writing up the results takes time", that "the nature of the work involves delays in analysis" and that "Ruyan as the funders are entitled to the results first". He gave no indication as to when we could expect further results.

    He was also interested to know whether I knew of other devices that are being tested as he was "interested in the differences between the various brands and products". I replied by pointing him towards the postings of our resident doctor from Malaysia on this forum who was doing extensive testing (initially on the N-Joy I believe ?) at the time, but I believe his government has pulled the plug on him now.

    I did not receive any further response to my last e-mail.

    Cheers,
    Silver
     
  10. convert

    convert Full Member

    Sep 3, 2008
    Near Leeds UK
    Silver,

    I've had a chance to read the report thoroughly now and I must say that although accurately reporting the data, there is definitely a pro Ruyan bias. Where it was possible to give a positive 'slant' to the data it was! I was also a little confused about the discussion over how many carts you should use a day.

    The report seemed to suggest that the expected usage was a high strength cart should last between 1 - 4 days. A very long period when it also said that a cart has the equivalent of about 10 cigs. What 'normal' smoker smokes 2.5 cigs/day. From personal experience, I'm going through about 3/day - not a ruyan however.

    Nice to see the tox assessment on the flavouring additives. I was a little unsure of them but they all seem to be commonly found in foods.

    Approx 88% PG was a surprise, I thought it was 50 - 60%. I agree with the tox report on PG as I had a similar 'discussion' over recommended daily limits some years ago - this was on oral use however. I think the only worry would be metabolic acidosis for chronic high use but I don't see this as a major concern.

    I'm a liitle perplexed overr the delay in follow up reports. I hope that there have been no negative findings and Ruyan are digging their heels in over publishing.

    As I said before a good overall report however after detailed reading I think it would carry more weight if it was less slanted


     
  11. Silver

    Silver ɹǝʌןıs Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Supporting member
    Jan 24, 2008
    New Zealand
    Hi Convert,

    I'm not entirely surprised by the fact that a positive slant has been given where possible after all, as you can read on page 3:

    the e-cigarettes and funds for testing were provided by Ruyan. As long as the information given is correct and true, I can live with that.

    On the other hand, there are others who have noted (on a Dutch language forum) that they feel this report is not entirely scientific in it's approach, but I really wouldn't be able to judge as I don't pretend to have any knowledge whatsoever of what makes a study properly scientific.

    As to the expected usage and such, again, not sure where they got that information. It does however state (on page 9 under heading 4.2, second paragraph) that


    and I'm thinking maybe this comes from the original precept by Ruyan that the e-cigarette was meant only for occassional use (what Trog is always on about ;)) rather than continuous use ?? I really don't know, but what I do know for sure is that a cartridge definitely does not last me 4 days, or even three or two for that matter, although I do only vape low nicotine cartridges, so not the 16 mg mentioned in the report.

    I too am rather perplexed about the delays in follow ups of this report, especially as it states that more results were due in May and June or July (page 3, summary), which is why I went ahead and e-mailed Dr. Laugesen about it. I'm hoping that it is indeed due to delays in writing up test results and such, and not because they have found something that Ruyan doesn't want to come out with. I guess ultimately it would be up to Ruyan to decide whether or not the report is actually published ?

    I will of course keep all of you updated if I hear anything new...

    Cheers,
    Silver
     
  12. Kate

    Kate Moved On

    Jun 26, 2008
    UK
  13. Kit

    Kit Ultra Member ECF Veteran

    Jun 24, 2008
    UK
    silver ive had to get my mini DX microscope out to read your post !
     
  14. jigtg

    jigtg Super Member ECF Veteran

    Aug 4, 2008
    Sparta, Greece
  15. Silver

    Silver ɹǝʌןıs Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Supporting member
    Jan 24, 2008
    New Zealand
    Oh dear, really ?! I'm so sorry, the font in all the posts look the same to me :cry:. What are you seeing (or not seeing :D) ?? Are all my posts like that ?

    Cheers,
    Silver
     
  16. Silver

    Silver ɹǝʌןıs Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Supporting member
    Jan 24, 2008
    New Zealand
  17. Silver

    Silver ɹǝʌןıs Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Supporting member
    Jan 24, 2008
    New Zealand
    I thought I'd post the summary of the report here, for those who are interested but don't have the time and/or inclination to read the entire report at this time:


    Cheers,
    Silver
     
  18. jigtg

    jigtg Super Member ECF Veteran

    Aug 4, 2008
    Sparta, Greece
    Yes the climax is near. Website says they are going to publish parts of the effiency/blind test paper in some sci magazine.
     
  19. Silver

    Silver ɹǝʌןıs Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Supporting member
    Jan 24, 2008
    New Zealand
    That's excellent news Jigtg because I'm sure we're all very curious and anxiously awaiting the findings on the efficacy of the E-cigarette as a Smoking Cessation Device (which was, after all, their initial goal in doing this study). Groundbreaking stuff, possibly with global implications for all us E-smokers !

    Kudos to Murray Laugesen :thumbs: !

    Cheers,
    Silver
     
  20. Silver

    Silver ɹǝʌןıs Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Supporting member
    Jan 24, 2008
    New Zealand
    This report makes for very interesting reading, but the best part of all ??

    Page 20, under point 5, last paragraph, last sentence:

    Wooohooo :thumb: :hubba: !

    Cheers,
    Silver
     
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