Eleaf iStick "pico"
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that is pretty,,, pretty nice!
I assume you mean the Melo 3 tank?
It comes with a 0.3 and 0.5 ohm coil. The 0.3 has a rating of 30W-80W and the 0.5 has a rating of 30W-100W. The recommended minimum on both coils is 30W, but they do have a 0.75 ohm MTL coil that's rated 8W-25W and designed for thinner juices.
Yes, Melo 3 is what I meant. Thanks for that information that helps alot.I assume you mean the Melo 3 tank?
It comes with a 0.3 and 0.5 ohm coil. The 0.3 has a rating of 30W-80W and the 0.5 has a rating of 30W-100W. The recommended minimum on both coils is 30W, but they do have a 0.75 ohm MTL coil that's rated 8W-25W and designed for thinner juices.
I'm having TCR troubles with 430 SS. Is Arctic Fox and TFR the answer?
I'm running a stock Pico. It seems to run hotter than my 2yo MVP 20 in power mode (9.5W on MVP ~ 8.0W on Pico), which is a simple adjustment. I'll chalk it up to old battery vs newish Samsung 30Qs. But that's not my issue at the moment.
I've never used TC before this week. I ordered a spool of 28AWG 430 SS from Unkamen, and it's just not doing a good job in TC.
I know that the Pico with stock firmware has issues with SS, as confirmed by the thermocouple measurements for 316L in this YouTube video t
and by @David Wolf
That found 79 rather than 92 was the preferred TCR value.
I performed cotton burn tests, and found it singed the cotton at TCR 100 rather than the nominal 430 TCR value of 138.
However this gives a weak, flavorless vape at any setting below 500° in my (modern) Digiflavor Siren. This holds whether I set the Power to 75W or 8W. One which spends most of it's time in "Temperature Protection."
I've tried diluting my juice with DW. I've tried my dripper. I've tried rewrapping my coil. And I've tried making the adjustment.
I get a weak, airy, flavorless vape (with poor vapor production, fwiw).
Thanks
I'm running a stock Pico. It seems to run hotter than my 2yo MVP 20 in power mode (9.5W on MVP ~ 8.0W on Pico), which is a simple adjustment. I'll chalk it up to old battery vs newish Samsung 30Qs. But that's not my issue at the moment.
I've never used TC before this week. I ordered a spool of 28AWG 430 SS from Unkamen, and it's just not doing a good job in TC.
I know that the Pico with stock firmware has issues with SS, as confirmed by the thermocouple measurements for 316L in this YouTube video t
and by @David Wolf
That found 79 rather than 92 was the preferred TCR value.
I performed cotton burn tests, and found it singed the cotton at TCR 100 rather than the nominal 430 TCR value of 138.
However this gives a weak, flavorless vape at any setting below 500° in my (modern) Digiflavor Siren. This holds whether I set the Power to 75W or 8W. One which spends most of it's time in "Temperature Protection."
I've tried diluting my juice with DW. I've tried my dripper. I've tried rewrapping my coil. And I've tried making the adjustment.
I get a weak, airy, flavorless vape (with poor vapor production, fwiw).
Thanks
430SS has a completely different TCR than 316L, which is typically the SS preset used. The TCR for 430SS is 138 (I'm virtually certain).
Yes. I tried 138 first.
At that setting, the cotton caught fire well below 400°F.
I lowered the TCR until it began to brown the cotton, and arrived empirically at a TCR setting of 100. Any lower and no singeing. Any higher and significant charring.
So I concluded that on the stock Pico, a TCR setting of 100 gives an accurate reading of ~410°F.
ETA:
However, the Temperature-Resistance curve at a coefficient setting of 100 leads to a useless vape at any reasonable temperature setting.
And a coefficient of 0.00138 at 410°F on my Pico leads to burning cotton. Burning as in fire.
Unless I fundamentally misunderstood the dry cotton singe test, as per for example: Cotton
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If your base resistance is not correct you will encounter the problems you are describing.
A quick test is to fire the coil without any wick. If the coil glows then your base resistance is not correct or the TCR is way off. I have Unkamen SS430 and it works perfectly with a TCR of 138 on the Pico and my DNA devices. I usually ran a 2 strand twisted 28g coil on 3mm for 8 wraps. It measures out to 0.6 ohms and I ran it at 55W/450F on the Pico.
What atty are you using and what are your coil specs? Not all attys are TC friendly.
Dry cotton will scorch/burn very easily. Once you get any moisture in it the temperature rises quite a bit before it burns.
1. I'll do a glow check when I finish my current tank. I assume that's with 138 TCR setting at 400°-450° or so. And that no part of the coil should glow?
2. I'm using a Digiflavor Siren 22mm on the smallest airflow hole (just about 2mm). Using a single strand of Unkamen 28AWG nickel-free 430 SS. In a single, non-contact coil. 1/8" (3.175mm) internal diameter, 7 full wraps. About 0.5mm gap between wraps. A little under 1mm per leg (though the wick contacts some of that). Resistance 0.68±0.02 ohms. Coil 0.5-1mm above diffusing air hole. 10mm KGD (including top and bottom sheet), long strands running perpendicular to the coils, extending to around the bottom of the channel.
ETA: Should I ignore the dry cotton burning at 300-some degrees at TCR of 138?
Yes, none of it should glow. The main problem with the Pico is the randomness of it detecting a new coil. I have found that unless it asks the New Coil question, there is a great possibility of TC not working correctly and running much hotter than it should. Like in your cotton burning at 300F.
There is a good thread here where David Wolf (who has since Moved On for some reason) did some tests to figure out TC on the Pico.
Pico problem - How accurate are mods' resistance measurements?
The ArcticFox firmware is the best thing to happen to eLeaf/Wismec/Joyetech devices in a long time when it comes to TC. NFE Team There are functions in that firmware that can force the Pico to reread the coils resistance and set it properly. Or you can lock it in 0.01-2 ohms higher to fine tune or improve the vape.
The single build you listed will have a heat flux of 240 at 20W which in a nice warm vape. I'd set the power to 30W and the temp between 400F to 440F adjusting to taste.
With each new build either spaced or contact, I always dry fire in power mode to check it and burn off any residual chemicals from manufacturing. The best thing is to vape the tank in power mode first just to make sure that the wicking is working properly. If a build won't vape properly in power mode (dry hits etc...) then there is no point even trying to get TC working at all. Inadequate juice flow is one of the major contributors to poor TC performance.
It definitely seems like a resistance read issue. I rebuilt a coil, 7/6 wraps, being very careful to get a good even spacing. Reading 0.75 ohms at first.
I pulsed for hot spots, took a couple short test puffs in power mode, and let it cool until I got a consistent reading.
I messed around in the Pico settings, powering on and off, changing attys, etc. until I could get a correct resistance to lock.
And now I'm getting a solid vape at 75W/300°F.
Probably still not a 100% correct temperature reading, but not like the useless vape at TCR 100. Closer to my 8W in power mode, without the ramp up time and overheating while chaining.
I generally prefer a cooler vape with a flux under 150. Temp set at 300 is doing the trick.
I cleaned the piece of wire I used with isopropyl alcohol until it wiped away clean. And dry pulsed to make sure my build was even and any surface residue was hopefully burnt off.
The Siren is a MTL tank built on a cloud chaser frame. Meaning I have to wick with a centimeter of KGD to fill the juice channels. Flooding is far more of a concern than dry hits. Even with 97.5% VG, 2.5% PG nic. The (primed) wick itself holds at least a mL.
Thanks for all the help.
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I am thinking Pico's are fairly temperamental/wonky and each unit can vary in output. With all the recent talk on TCR settings I though I would do a little playing with my two Pico's. Right away I saw both units had a glitch. They both will fire a stock 1ohm Kanthal coil in SS mode or M1. Neither Pico ever kicked the Kanthal coil from TC back to wattage. In the testing I did change coils from a lower to higher resistance to trigger the "coil up/down nag) with every coil/tank change. Hmmm?
My basic coil for the past 5 months has been a S.S. 316l 30g 1.23 ohms. In wattage mode I used 9w and in TC mode 12W at 300-310*F These two modes produced a very similar vape.
Reading that the Pico's TC mode is about 50* high I then played with the TCR M1 settings. Taking both Pico's M1 settings to 80 I flopped the same tank from TC mode to M1 mode and Pico to Pico.
(both Pico had freshly charged cells and the newest firmware)
Pico #1 Wattage 9W equals TC mode at 300-310* In M1 mode I had to take the temp to 370*-380* to get the same vape experience.
Pico #2 Wattage 9W equals TC mode at 300*-310* In M1 mode I had to take the temp all the way up to 460* to get that same vape. I didn't think this was possible so I double/tripled checked- 460*
I'll be sticking with the stock TC mode at 300-310* in both Pico's - it just seems to work fairly well.
I do see a DNA mod in my future.
My basic coil for the past 5 months has been a S.S. 316l 30g 1.23 ohms. In wattage mode I used 9w and in TC mode 12W at 300-310*F These two modes produced a very similar vape.
Reading that the Pico's TC mode is about 50* high I then played with the TCR M1 settings. Taking both Pico's M1 settings to 80 I flopped the same tank from TC mode to M1 mode and Pico to Pico.
(both Pico had freshly charged cells and the newest firmware)
Pico #1 Wattage 9W equals TC mode at 300-310* In M1 mode I had to take the temp to 370*-380* to get the same vape experience.
Pico #2 Wattage 9W equals TC mode at 300*-310* In M1 mode I had to take the temp all the way up to 460* to get that same vape. I didn't think this was possible so I double/tripled checked- 460*
I'll be sticking with the stock TC mode at 300-310* in both Pico's - it just seems to work fairly well.
I do see a DNA mod in my future.
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It would be interesting to install Arctic Fox on both and see how that affects their differing behavior, and if it sheds any light on the difference.
You can always reflash the stock firmware afterwards.
Can you tell me where the max watts option is? I am making a squonker out of an istick tc 100W.
I will only ever have one battery, and would like to reduce the max watts for safety reasons...
I like the AF software so far, especially being able to correct the resistance reading and use TFR
I've only accessed it once via the PC tool box. It's there in the latest version. I like the comfort of knowing the mod can't exceed 30 watts under any circumstances. Mostly I vape at 16 max watts with a 150% pre heat that lasts .3 seconds.
The iStick TC 100W will only put out 75W on a single battery just like the Pico does.
This is where you set it.
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