Hi Dinky. I think we met Sat. on the chat room. I've been going through the same thing, but not to the same extent as you, as I try to move off analogs. I had the same problem each time I tried to quit with other means. Last time I quit using the commit lozenges, I would take one and then sleep for two hours until it was time to take the next one. I just couldn't face going those few hours in between doses so slept them away. In addition to what everyone else has suggested, I had a doctor tell me that many people who smoke are self medicating for depression without realizing it. He said doctors weren't sure but think the smoking creates changes in the brain that causes a depressive state when the nic is removed. So you may not be depressed when you first started smoking but smoking itself causes the brain changes that lead to depression leading us to smoke more to medicate it. That is why he believed that like other depressed people ex-smokers begin to eat more and sleep more just like people with other depressive disorders. It also explains why they have seen some success with using anti depressants to help people quit smoking. If it is not contra indicative to your other disorder, you may want to consider taking some St. John's Wort which can help with mild depression. Off topic, will you be at the vapefest in Philly this month?
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im def. getting a depression situation going. i just hate to go to the dr with this if i dont have to. always concerned about the medical insurance and them documenting a depression even if it is because of quitting smoking. nex thing u know the rates are going thru the roof or they are trying to cancel ur insurance. so goes it with the self insured/employed.
no vapefest for me. couldnt get away from work even if the body would allow for such a trip. im pretty much nailed to home turf all the time with the fibro. only leave the house to do what i need to do and then back home. very short trips out and not every day. thats the way fibro works. if u dont listen to it it will stick u in bed and u wont get up. i dont like the paybacks so im a good doobie and i stay close to home.... the mind is willing but the body says no. lol
no vapefest for me. couldnt get away from work even if the body would allow for such a trip. im pretty much nailed to home turf all the time with the fibro. only leave the house to do what i need to do and then back home. very short trips out and not every day. thats the way fibro works. if u dont listen to it it will stick u in bed and u wont get up. i dont like the paybacks so im a good doobie and i stay close to home.... the mind is willing but the body says no. lol
Dinky, I just found this on another thread posted today that was talking about depression and cigs. The thread started about a patent but got into the MAOIs that is in full tobacco but missing from ecig juice. If cigarettes due to the MAOIs and nic act as an amphetamine boosting our energy levels then we are righting yet another battle in trying to quit.
Nicotine - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
QUOTE:"Technically, nicotine is not significantly addictive, as nicotine administered alone does not produce significant reinforcing properties.[41] However, after coadministration with an MAOI, such as those found in tobacco, nicotine produces significant behavioral sensitization, a measure of addiction potential. This is similar in effect to amphetamine.[42]"
Sorry we won't be seeing you in Philly. I look forward to meeting other vapers and learning from them so I can start to really enjoy this vaping.
Nicotine - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
QUOTE:"Technically, nicotine is not significantly addictive, as nicotine administered alone does not produce significant reinforcing properties.[41] However, after coadministration with an MAOI, such as those found in tobacco, nicotine produces significant behavioral sensitization, a measure of addiction potential. This is similar in effect to amphetamine.[42]"
Sorry we won't be seeing you in Philly. I look forward to meeting other vapers and learning from them so I can start to really enjoy this vaping.
I certainly hope you all improve. I recently retired and I vape from about 7:30am to about 1am the next day, and I sleep like a baby with a full stomach. Who's to say what is going on, but I sure hope it gets figured out, for all your sakes.
very interesting. u have to wonder what the cig industry was putting all this stuff into analogs for. sounds like something that 60 minutes should take on. not bad enough we were all inhaling a bunch of tar etc but what were those other additives for. why are they there????? good question that deseves an answer..... probably wont get an honest one out of anyone though... but a good questions just the same.
i do too rosco. when i started on this adventure.... and i do call it an adventure right now..... i had no idea what i was going to be up against. if i had of known i probably wouldnt of started vaping at all. would have just been status quo for me. now i cant go back. cant stand the taste of analogs. they make me gag. so here we are stuck in limbo and trying to make sense of it all.
I think the official answer is for customer satisfaction. They sure do the job, right?
I always knew all the info that they warn you about when I was in my early teens and starting to smoke; cancer, emphysema, copd (actually, I don't think that one exsisted yet)... etc., etc., etc.,.... But I've learned so much more now that I'm having to defend my continued nicotine use.
I didn't know that people with natural, biological chemical brain disorders like depression or bi-polar are more likely to start smoking. Or that people with chronic pain issues are more likely to start smoking. The one that still shocks me, makes me the maddest, the one they should be putting on the warning label is the one where people who become addicted to smoking can (if they smoke long enough, like me) eventually damage the dopamine receptors in their brains so that they will never feel "normal" without some sort of crutch like nicotine to help their brains absorb the dopamine.
All those years I blamed myself because I was too weak willed to quit smoking. I forgive myself now that I know the truth.
wow rosa. thats incredible. i didnt know that. wel this dope has no dopamine anymore either im sure..... yup has to make u wonder. im afraid i fit the criteria too. as a child growing up in the 50's and 60s smoking wasnt a big deal. everyone smoked. well practically eveyone. no one thought anything of it. yeah ppl got cancer and died. but they got cancer and died from other stuff too. it was just a fact of life . tragic but not a big deal...... neither was lead paint or asbestos or a whole lot of other stuff. so in my case i came out of an era of smokers just in general. more ppl did than didnt kind of stuff. not an excuse. it just was the way it was back then. so much has changed. and yes i wanted to quit and yes i tried to quit. i just couldnt stay quit. all it took was one big crisis and i was smoking again. i guess from what ur telling all of us we were just cooked from the start hugh...
and how do u get that little tag about how many days u havent smoked? very cool and so keeps us on track.
You can click on the one that you like and it'll take you to the site to enter your own info. Then you go to "settings" at the top of the screen and then "edit signature" on the left side of the screen and paste the url into the text box of your signature.
Hi. Just a thought. I found out after vaping for the first two or so months that I was using WAY too high nicotine levels too close to bedtime (24mg and 36mg!). In turn, I was waking up after only sleeping for an hour, then laying wide awake most of the night. This was happening every night and during the day I felt pretty groggy. I finally started searching around here and realized what I had been doing and others had the same issue and suggested lowering nic a few hours before bedtime. Now I start vaping 12mg around 930pm and crash out around 12am. Sleep like a baby all night now and feel pretty charged the next day. The night I switched to lower nic a few hours before I slept I instantly noticed full nights sleeping again.
I wonder if this is what is going on...of course, drink water too and maybe bang on the high nicotine during morning and throughout day.
Good luck!
ice
I wonder if this is what is going on...of course, drink water too and maybe bang on the high nicotine during morning and throughout day.
Good luck!
ice
me too. I won't say it's impossible to quit smoking and stay quit because I know people do it all the time. I could never stay quit for more than 6 months, that's my limit. I talked to a few long-time quitters and it seemed to me that the general consensus was that you'll always want a cigarette, you just don't let yourself have one. I didn't like the prognosis so I started smoking again. I figured I was better off happy and dead 10 years too soon than miserable and get to live 10 extra years. That's just how my mind works though.
I'm just glad I found e-cigs though, because now I don't have to make that choice anymore. Once you get the routine down, it'll get so much better. Easier.
I always figured that if I ever had shortness of breath or a health scare or something that I'd just quit, after all they say nicotine only stays in your system for, like, three days or something. I figured if I could just make it three days, maybe a week, I'd be scott free. But my craving for a cigarette just never went away. I'd think about smoking all day and then dream about cigarettes every night.
I can't remember now where I read that thing about the dopamine receptors because I've been from one side of google to the other looking up info of this sort for 11 months now, but when I read that it was like a lightbulb went off in my head and I was just thinking, "well, no wonder! It's all making so much more sense to me now."
That's the first time I was really angry with Big Tobacco - I don't mind if quitting is going to feel impossible for a week, but for it to feel impossible for the rest of my life because of the additives that they add to "make the product more enjoyable"!!?? That's what really steams me. Yeah, it's more enjoyable for their wallet.
OK, rant over
i've had the insomnia groggy syndrome too--just finished my one month sprint shaking the analog mindset by just cranking in as much nicotine as i wanted/could take regardless of whether i slept but aft 4 weeks with an awful lot of 4 hour sleep nights with a couple of 8 hour stretches i feel i've outrun the direct desire for an analog. I just got in a mega juice order and mixed up a half strength vape of peppermint/menthol--my first diy mix. (down from 26 to about 15) The flavor is a little too pure and light --but its decent--have nice variety of atomizers, carts and tanks on hand and am settling down to beat the analogs over the next three months. last time out i made about 5 months (actually about the same as my typical nicorette lozenge assisted quit) I did manage a 5 year quit once (vowed to quit smoking before i had kids--succeeded (have 1 kid) but eventually faced some life stresses, dabbled in casual smoking y'all know the drill) but this time around i'm going to pay more attention to nic levels and plan my sleep with a bit more attention. I have made it to bed by 2 am pretty consistently but getting up at 7:30 this is still short of the 6-7 hours in bed (even if not asleep i actually need.)
my latest little nicotine related health hassle--teeth grinding at night. anyway off i go to roam around looking for that next ideal cart/cartomizer/atomizer and really stock up this time so equipment failure, supply shortage won't be an issue in a relapse.
my latest little nicotine related health hassle--teeth grinding at night. anyway off i go to roam around looking for that next ideal cart/cartomizer/atomizer and really stock up this time so equipment failure, supply shortage won't be an issue in a relapse.
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@ Oakland:
There's a vendor in Berkeley if you're ever in a bind. They're pretty good too, not a store front, but I guess the guy will come out and meet you and bring your order if you call him.
vaporden
There's a vendor in Berkeley if you're ever in a bind. They're pretty good too, not a store front, but I guess the guy will come out and meet you and bring your order if you call him.
vaporden
actually he was my first real supplier (after the kit i bought in a telegraph headshop) I did go running to him a couple times at first--bought a bad setof atomizers from them though and didn't feel to comfortable after that--prices were high...but now i know better all around and seem to have overcome my reluctance to shop online--kind of miss my daily visits to the local tobacco shops and seven 11s in some odd useless way (sure made it easier to pick up some milk for the kid though) would love it if there were at least some meet-ups on this side of the bay. nearest i have seen this month is in santa rosa or some such and too far a trek for my schedule.
I am 100% know what you talking about I have Fibromyalgia I'm experiencing the same symptoms, I though it was my medication which after quitting had to be altered..plus tons more
thanks for the input ice. one i get my levels settled out i will keep that in mind. unfortunately or fortunately owever u look at it im not having trouble sleeping. its quite the opposite right now. i suspect those maois in the cigs were pumping me up even though the fibro still had me tired. now im super tired as there is nothing propping me up. add too low of nic level and disaster. thats what im thinking for now.
got the vitamins today...... will start that tomorrow and see how that goes...... woohoo after 4 days i managed to get myself out of the house.
got the vitamins today...... will start that tomorrow and see how that goes...... woohoo after 4 days i managed to get myself out of the house.
i think u ranted perfectly. what happened to full disclosure. every little mg of what is in our food, drinks etc is on the label. so where the heck does it say any of this. doesnt sound like it would fit on a carton let alone a pack of smokes. very very depressing hugh...
The bay area is gigantic... I lived in Fremont and my mom lived in Berkeley and I still only saw her a couple of times a year. Moving to the Portland metro was a no-brainer for me, I won't be missing much (no offense).
so im curious.... what did ur dr say . it would appear that our analogs were proppin gup our fibro/cfids bodies and we got a surprise we didnt bargain for. whats the drs take.
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