Fallout starting close to home

[Lessifer]

Yes, it is short, and to the point to some extent.
But it clearly failed on the "impossible to miss" aspect that I noted previously.

But then again, it's just a cup of coffee.
Not a highly dangerous product.

I've never purchased a loose battery for vaping that had any warning.

But I haven't purchased a loose battery in years, so there may be warnings now.
I wouldn't know.

vape shops are the ones that need to inform and educate.
Both online and brick and mortar.

If for no reason other than getting sued and having their lives completely ruined.
But they are also the initial point of contact for those buying the equipment that needs said batteries.

And the warnings need to be IN YOUR FACE, not buried somewhere in a long line of small font.

But that's not how things work in the American market. I don't know of any product where the Retailer is responsible for providing a warning for something that is Manufactured by someone else.

The loose batteries for vaping don't have warnings on them because they were not intended for individual sale, they are not labeled for individual sale. Take a look at a duracell AA battery, there is a cautionary statement on the battery itself. Most of the batteries we use barely have identifiers on them, let alone warnings.

 

[DC2]

But that's not how things work in the American market. I don't know of any product where the Retailer is responsible for providing a warning for something that is Manufactured by someone else.

The loose batteries for vaping don't have warnings on them because they were not intended for individual sale, they are not labeled for individual sale. Take a look at a duracell AA battery, there is a cautionary statement on the battery itself. Most of the batteries we use barely have identifiers on them, let alone warnings.

I think I am losing track of where you think the warnings should be.
But I think you're saying it should be the battery manufacturers.

What about the batteries bought in bulk by B&M shops and online vape shops...
And then sold "loosely" without any manufacturer packaging.

Heck, what about my Ego Twists that I buy all the time...
With the battery built in.

 

[Lessifer]

I think I am losing track of where you think the warnings should be.
But I think you're saying it should be the battery manufacturers.

What about the batteries bought in bulk by B&M shops and online vape shops...
And then sold "loosely" without any manufacturer packaging.

Heck, what about my Ego Twists that I buy all the time...
With the battery built in.

Yes, if there is to be a warning somewhere, I think it should accompany the battery. If it's a built in battery, then with the device. I actually think this is a problem in the vape industry. We use products that are not meant to be used in our applications, and because of that we end up with items that are not properly labeled for retail. Walk into a Batteries+ store and you won't find Sony vtc4's for sale, because they're not intended to be sold that way.

I don't really expect Sony to start labeling them that way. I might expect a reseller to take the initiative and rewrap with proper labels and warnings, which I believe is already starting to happen with the "vape specific" brands.

Personally, I'd trust an unlabeled vtc4 from a reputable vendor over a rewrapped "vapestar" or whatever battery, but the rewrap probably has better legal protection.

 

[skoony]

Read and comprehend before you spout.
Mech related injuries draw the attention of the FDA and antz to the 'grave dangers of e-cigarettes'.
Yes, sir, they will indeed use anything to ruin vaping, and the more people disfigured or worse from mech's blowing up in their faces then the more ammo for the FDA and antz and the worse off we all are.

Again, read the entire statement so that you might comprehend:
"The greatest threat to vaping today are mech related injuries. Those videos of people lying disfigured and paralyzed in hospital beds is all the fear-mongering ammunition the anti's require in order to ruin vaping for everyone."

You "can't believe" that I could ever say such a statement.
That statement is TRUTH!

The FDA considers each and every component in the hardware and, each ingredient
in the juice to be gravely dangerous. Even without the accidents we would still be
right where we are right now. Because/the chillen '.
Regards
Mike

 

[WattWick]

"The greatest threat to vaping today are mech related injuries. Those videos of people lying disfigured and paralyzed in hospital beds is all the fear-mongering ammunition the anti's require in order to ruin vaping for everyone."

The threat pales in comparison to letting statistical insignificance grow into fear mongering hysteria.

Paralyzed? PARALYZED!?

 

[beckdg]

The FDA considers each and every component in the hardware and, each ingredient
in the juice to be gravely dangerous. Even without the accidents we would still be
right where we are right now. Because/the chilled'.
Regards
Mike

Could you please explain?

Thanks
-Brilliant Poster

 

[DC2]

The threat pales in comparison to letting statistical insignificance grow into fear mongering hysteria.

The problem is not that WE are letting it...
The problem is that the mainstream media is marketing it...

 

[beckdg]

The threat pales in comparison to letting statistical insignificance grow into fear mongering hysteria.

Paralyzed? PARALYZED!?

See my last post.

 

[beckdg]

The problem is not that WE are letting it...
The problem is that the mainstream media is marketing it...

I adamantly disagree.

The problem is not only that we are rolling over for it.
But that some of us even believe it and will argue for it.

Even here people believe in truth in marketing.

To go to extremes to make a point... even Baditude parrots information from vendors he supports as facts... and NEARLY EVERYONE takes it as gospel.

 

[DC2]

I adamantly disagree.

Regarding mechs, or regarding batteries in general?

The problem is not only that we are rolling over for it.
But that some of us even believe it and will argue for it.

The point I was trying to make was that what we say here doesn't really matter.
Mainstream media is telling all of America what they want them to think.

It's quite possible I did not get the point of your post though.
I kind of feel like I may not have.

 

[papergoblin]

I think I am losing track of where you think the warnings should be.
But I think you're saying it should be the battery manufacturers.

What about the batteries bought in bulk by B&M shops and online vape shops...
And then sold "loosely" without any manufacturer packaging.

Heck, what about my Ego Twists that I buy all the time...
With the battery built in.

You're right most batteries bought loose, like your ego, which is just a battery and a switch have nothing. These have caught on fire and exploded themselves, mechs. are blamed on the fore front because of the damage they cause. The truth is there are mechs in all sizes yet the 18650 is what we always see going boom, wonder why. Could it be that people using smaller variants like the 350, 490, 500 or the 14xxx series are more careful?

I do know shops that sell loose batteries and they tell the customer it's a samsung, sony, etc. and what size, what more can they tell them. Why is it not on the consumer to know what battery to use? I have kids and have bought many battery powered toys, yet I have never seen the toy manufacturer tell that the toy needs x amps, just 3 or 4 or even 6 A, AA, C or D batteries that are not included. Battery powered device makers let the customer buy their own and blame the customer for misuse or improper batteries all the time, why is vaping so different?

A mod be it mech or regulated takes x type batteries, the customer than can choose how powerful. We can't blame blowing up mechs and sue, if so then how many of us need to get a class action suit on every battery device that has had AA batteries leak acid from being left in them. If those toys, remotes or flashlights had been made correctly, no acid would have leaked or should we sue the AA battery manufacturer for making a battery that can leak, or how about both? Where does the insanity end and the responsibility begin? What happened to buyer beware or use at your own risk?

Plain and simple people are buying devices they know little or nothing about but instead of learning what and how, they are too busy doing. How many of us worked on a car before the internet existed? There wasn't anything in the manual (still isn't) about how to fix parts of the motor or tranny, we read books or asked people that worked on them. Most of the time though, the asked info was not fully correct, but no one sued for bad info. Too many lazy people are just sue happy and no warning or waiver will fix it, think about it, you sign a waiver when buying a mech. That means you entered into a contract, a crap lawyer can say it shouldn't stand since you entered into a contract not fully understanding the risks. That's why people can get DUI's and pay a lawyer 10k and it is gone, life is one big loop hole or angle, depending on how you look at it.

 

[skoony]

Could you please explain?

Thanks
-Brilliant Poster

No need to, you've read the same threads I have.
Regards
Mike

 

[papergoblin]

I adamantly disagree.

The problem is not only that we are rolling over for it.
But that some of us even believe it and will argue for it.

Even here people believe in truth in marketing.

To go to extremes to make a point... even Baditude parrots information from vendors he supports as facts... and NEARLY EVERYONE takes it as gospel.

He also does his research before agreeing to any posted info. I've also seen him on many occasion say in his opinion, followed by look for yourself. He get more crap because he actually tells people not to use a battery to the limit, to leave 50% headroom, people hammer him all the time saying he advocates under using batteries. He in fact advocates self research, safety, and continued knowledge. I do trust his posts but I also verify and find most stuff he says extremely accurate.

 

[DC2]

Plain and simple people are buying devices they know little or nothing about but instead of learning what and how, they are too busy doing.

People need to know there is a reason to research before they will do so.
And that is where I part company with many on this thread.

Some here seem to think it is common knowledge that batteries are dangerous.
And I will continue to insist that it simply is not common knowledge.

 

[beckdg]

"Regarding mechs, or regarding batteries in general?

Yes

The point I was trying to make was that what we say here doesn't really matter.
Mainstream media is telling all of America what they want them to think.

Advocacy atrophy on our part makes that possible. There has been much smaller issues facing many more opponents with a statistical insignificant number of supporters in comparison that have repeatedly, constantly garnished huge wins for their cause. They fought and educated with truth, knowledge and purpose. That's the difference.

We lose because we choose to.
With half or more of us believing the media, that's a statistical loss by choice to begin with.

Look at this thread... there's proof everywhere just here.

It's quite possible I did not get the point of your post though.
I kind of feel like I may not have.

Hopefully that was much more clear.

 

[Wruff]

Paralyzed? PARALYZED!?

Yes.
> > Springs Man Disfigured, Breaks Neck In Fall After E-Cigarette Explodes « CBS Denver

 

[beckdg]

He also does his research before agreeing to any posted info. I've also seen him on many occasion say in his opinion, followed by look for yourself. He get more crap because he actually tells people not to use a battery to the limit, to leave 50% headroom, people hammer him all the time saying he advocates under using batteries. He in fact advocates self research, safety, and continued knowledge. I do trust his posts but I also verify and find most stuff he says extremely accurate.

trust what you wish.

years down the road when he's posting what i've been posting for years, i hope you remember. though it's yet to happen (that somebody remember), so i doubt it.

but if you see me questioning or disagreeing with what he's posted, i suggest you dig deep below the surface and find the truth.

a little hint... you're not going to find it on any vaping site spelled out.

 

[papergoblin]

People need to know there is a reason to research before they will do so.
And that is where I part company with many on this thread.

Some here seem to think it is common knowledge that batteries are dangerous.
And I will continue to insist that it simply is not common knowledge.

You and I are about at the same point, I think. If people are lied to when a sale occurs then yes, they have a right to take action. Then there is the battery side all batteries we normally use have warnings, now someone has a battery that needs to be charged and a charger. The chargers are full of warnings and rational people would go hmmm, and look into it. It's honestly a mess all the way around and some mistakes can be easily stopped but many I think can't be until people take their own safety in their own hands. I mean these are things we put in our face and breathe in, for the love of all that is holy, why don't people actually research what they are putting in their bodies, lol.

 

[beckdg]

For example...

These little rings are more for aesthetics than insulators. Most don't cover any of the top of the batteries negative pole...

Rewrapping batteries

If you really want, I'll rewrap 5 different model batteries and show you in pics.

Tapatyped

 

[papergoblin]

trust what you wish.

years down the road when he's posting what i've been posting for years, i hope you remember. though it's yet to happen (that somebody remember), so i doubt it.

but if you see me questioning or disagreeing with what he's posted, i suggest you dig deep below the surface and find the truth.

a little hint... you're not going to find it on any vaping site spelled out.

Hey I agree with a lot of what you say as well and at times may be on the opposite side of the debate but I can say either way it's generally a good and informative argument either way. The only way any of us get better or smarter is to have these debates, not take things personally and spark an interest to learn.