FDA FDA announces 3rd so-called Public Workshop on Electronic Cigarettes and Public Health on June 1 & 2
- Thread starter Bill Godshall
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(This is mostly from my post in the Zeller thread in media but it fits so well here.)
You have to remember while the FDA cannot tax anything how they treat them can affect how they are taxed.
When taken in context with this quote from Andre Calantzopoulos, CEO of Phillip Morris International in the June 16, 2014 issue of Forbes it becomes clear why they are set on ramming the deeming regulations down our throats as written. They can't afford to allow vaporizers to exist in their present form without full government control and that is much easier when there is a small number of manufactures.
It hasn't changed, follow the money.
Desk murderers all.
You have to remember while the FDA cannot tax anything how they treat them can affect how they are taxed.
When taken in context with this quote from Andre Calantzopoulos, CEO of Phillip Morris International in the June 16, 2014 issue of Forbes it becomes clear why they are set on ramming the deeming regulations down our throats as written. They can't afford to allow vaporizers to exist in their present form without full government control and that is much easier when there is a small number of manufactures.
It hasn't changed, follow the money.
Desk murderers all.
- Apr 2, 2009
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For its 3rd e-cig workshop, FDA invited Spike Babaian and CASAA's Carl Phillips to participate on panels to prevent vaping activists from claiming that we were locked out of the conferences.
But if you noticed, FDA invited e-cig prohibitionists, propagandists and/or junk scientists to account for the vast majority of presenters and penalists at all three FDA workshops.
FDA stacked all of the sessions and all of the panels with e-cig opponents (who have made many inaccurate and inflammatory claims about e-cigs at all three FDA workshops) to negate the accurate and objective statements made by experts (and to promote the FDA's deeming reg to ban >99.9% of e-cigs.
But if you noticed, FDA invited e-cig prohibitionists, propagandists and/or junk scientists to account for the vast majority of presenters and penalists at all three FDA workshops.
FDA stacked all of the sessions and all of the panels with e-cig opponents (who have made many inaccurate and inflammatory claims about e-cigs at all three FDA workshops) to negate the accurate and objective statements made by experts (and to promote the FDA's deeming reg to ban >99.9% of e-cigs.
Yes, I realize she was a token and I was not particularly enthused when she introduced herself as "the Devil". A joke. At some level though we vapers tend to believe it.
As that particular panel discussed, I found myself thinking of the tens of millions of dollars those researchers were spending on who, what and why vapers do what they do when all they had to do was ask the person sitting right next to them. Spike has more knowledge in her pinky than all the PhDs combined.
As that particular panel discussed, I found myself thinking of the tens of millions of dollars those researchers were spending on who, what and why vapers do what they do when all they had to do was ask the person sitting right next to them. Spike has more knowledge in her pinky than all the PhDs combined.
its 3:02 6/1/15 am. who was that last lady and where did she come up with her figures?
if i heard her right she stated e-cigarettes are a gateway to smoking for use and of
no help in helping adults quit.
mike
if i heard her right she stated e-cigarettes are a gateway to smoking for use and of
no help in helping adults quit.
mike
I either missed that or did not interpret whatever it was that way, sorry.
Ok, I got a late start, have only watched about 45 minutes so far. How do these people talk with a straight face? "I've received no funding from anti-ecig sources, all of my funding has come from the NIH"
"the ecig industry claims we just don't know enough about ecigs to make any decisions"
"the ecig industry claims we just don't know enough about ecigs to make any decisions"
Ok, I can't watch the whole thing. Did anyone ask a clarifying question of Mrs. Dutra about whether or not her data for "overall nicotine use" filtered out those adolescents who used 0mg nicotine products? Or was this a case of "it looks like a cigarette, so we'll say it's nicotine use?"
For about the last 2 months I've been hanging around a local vape shop. Really hadn't been in any before that - a few cig stores that had disposables and cigalikes but not real vape shop. My 'casual' assessment is that with mainly the young (but up to around 30 yrs old) sub-ohm vapers (not adolescents), about 40% of them vape zero nic, another 20-30% vape 3mg nic, none more than 12mg - of those whom I asked. Some 3mg'ers said they tried 6 mg and it was 'wow - too much'. None of the sales people - all sub-ohm'ers - vape over 6 when sub-ohming. Half are at 0mg.
That's been my limited experience as well. I started at 24mg, and after two years I'm down to dripping at 12mg, which makes the B&M people look at me like I'm crazy.
I just don't get how they can call it Nicotine Use(which I did notice they changed from "tobacco" use) when there may or may not be nicotine.
It is very worth while to listen to the whole thing as to what is being presented in total there.
It is a little over 5 1/2 hours long
for the first half
the second half (second link) is an additional 4 hours
for the first half
the second half (second link) is an additional 4 hours
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Again, just guessing, but from experience here and elsewhere, before sub-ohm the zero nic people were less than 10% of the vapers. When we do a 'taste your juice' (using our own 510 drip tips on other's PVs) the 0 nic people don't try the nic ejuice at all. (and nothing is made of that.... ie. 'understood' :- ) Since I vape 8-11mg, the sub-ohmers will tootle puff my mod lol... they're just checking the taste anyway.... they usually open up the air flow though lol... I tell them they can crank it up if they want but again - just tasting the flavor.... :- )
I was very impressed by Dr David Abrams PhD and admittedly a bit surprised by a few things Spike Babaian had to say. I am really looking forward to tomorrow it should be interesting, thanks again for posting this 
Oh wow! I'm at work today and will catch the re-run!Loved your presentation Bill !!
Yes..how long before they make it available i don't know..but it will be posted on the same website. They are at lunch right now but thus far, day 2 has been pretty interesting so far and well worth watching IMO.
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