Frustrated. Ohms Law/Rebuilding. Dummies/Basics, Backwards, this is not the way I learn ;(

[USMCotaku]

Thats weird, I cant delete or edit 2 of them to shorten them. No idea how that happened. Never happened before.
(but I CAN edit this post--guess this forum only allows u so much time before u cant edit anymore?!)
Suprised a mod didnt delete those.

Anyhow, its been busy so this is the first chance i have had to get back here.

The problem with the sore throat. I was being told it was VG/PG and maybe too much Vodka as they apparently use it in DIY for a throat kick?
I didnt feel it was either and took it in to be tested and it wasnt firing properly so everything was wrong on it.
Thats been sorted out and the throat is ok again.

Been too busy to make anymore than one coil since i was last here but tomorrow i have time to do it all so I got all my proper tools etc and was understanding it all except, I cant quite figure out my settings now.

Listed below:



The store owner set it all up for me but I unsure of something....HERE below is where he put my settings.

Seigelei 100W+Kanger Subtank Mini - 4.2V, 17w + 1.0 ohm

iStick 50w + Delta ll - 3.8v, 30w, 0.5 ohm

Vamo Clone + Subtank mini - 3.5v, 17w, 0.8ohm

So looking at various charts on this forum where you have to stay within the certain color/range it seems i am awfully low.

When I went to buy my first Kanger Subtank mini a month ago after using Nautilus Minis and wantint to rebuild he told me no, I needed Delta ll. It was only later I realized the cost difference

So he said i had to go sub ohm which i had been told would increase my taste.
So i apparently went sub ohm
but maybe he had me riding before i could walk?

but with everything i read, i am not really too sure that one has to go sub ohm today and that voltage is better, etc, therefore not necessary and any time i mention sub ohm I get attitude as if i am blowing clouds.
My only interest is Taste........

So.......arent I a bit low on these ohms?
Or am I reading this incorrectly?

I look at the chart and all I see are resistance numbers between 1.20 - 6.50

Wheres 0.5, 0.8, 1.0? Are they not ALL below 1.20 OR do i have it backwards and they are all above?

I cant tell if I am in the blue the red reen or purple?

The thing about the regulated device you are using...ohms isn't quite as important as long as you are in the range of your mod, which toy are.
A lower ohm build will give you more warmth to your vape, but you can adjust your power up or down to find your sweet spot on most coils... So don't sweat the number, just play around and find what you like. I'm currently using one of my sub tanks at 1.8 ohms and 29 watts

 

[ShelaghDB]

The thing about the regulated device you are using...ohms isn't quite as important as long as you are in the range of your mod, which toy are.
A lower ohm build will give you more warmth to your vape, but you can adjust your power up or down to find your sweet spot on most coils... So don't sweat the number, just play around and find what you like. I'm currently using one of my sub tanks at 1.8 ohms and 29 watts

U r right.
I couldnt figure it out for the life of me in the beginning, as this thread shows my frustration well.
I was completely past the point of "sweating" anything about it, just needed the time to actually do it.

But I think I will end up being m ore like yourself in that I am likly to prefer a cooler Vape than what i am at.
Also I think these higher ones drink juice like an alcoholic.........unless that is just me and i am a real juice addict

The Vamo clone that I was trying to work with when I first began this thread was throwing me off.
It was set high or so I thought.
So I had planned.

But when I was vaping a Vanilla and Custard juice, it was nice and warm, a bit hot on the way in but still fine bt on the way out it was quite cool.
It was the cooler part i preferred so I asked around and a few people told me that it would be Vodka, that it provides a throat kick so i hadnt any reason to doubt that but in another group pertaining to the maker of the juice I asked if it was Vodka i was tasting.
Guessing that asking is a no no.
I wasnt asking because i wanted to copy the flavour, not that I would know how to do so anyhow but because IF it was vodka, I wanted to know if that was what was making it seem cool.

Long story short, I was given attitude for even considering that it might be Vodka and someone told me that they cant put liquor in juce so i had it all wrong, etc, etc, etc.....so I dropped the subject.

But then I want to test the device and it was apparently starting up quicly to 40w and then quickly dropping to 17w......hence, THAT was why I was likely getting this cool taste that i liked.
Id like to believe that No question is a stupid question but unfortuantely there are too many that like to share their thoughts about questions they believe to be stupd and y asking it if was vodka was that question.

In any event, i KNEW something was there but i coudlnt put my finger on what it was. I am not experienced enough to know it was mis-firing but just like one kmows their car I knew someting was wrong with it.....thats why it was tested. Now i know i might likely prefer a cooler Vape than what I have been at......


Thx again

 

[USMCotaku]

I'm loving my high ohm high watt builds....i get more vapor, but cooler. That's the fun thing about vaping..... There are so many options...even with all of the gear you already own....trying out all the different ways to build is a blast, to me at least.
Sent with one hand, the other is busy vaping.

 

[EZinTN]

ShelaghDB, after reading this saga I'm hoping you have had some success with building. This thread reminded me I was neglecting my Delta II and the deliciousness there in, so thank you, I vaped a tank dry and refilled.
A tip on dialing in your settings with any build (any ohms, at least between 0.2 and 2.0) that I've found works well for me is to start at 3.9 Volts (I don't pay much attention to Watts until I'm fine tunning). That seems to be the best starting point, and if that isn't quite where you want to be just adjust up or down a little at a time until you find the sweet spot for that build.
Also, when you are comfortable with building basics, check out this build for the Delta II - If you can get past his persona you'll find he does some really good tutorials and this particular build is the best I've found for the Delta II. I was going to sell or trade mine before I got the rba head and threw this build in it, and it works well with the Subtanks as well. He uses 24 gauge Kanthal in the vid, but 26 - 28 works fine too, you'll just be a few tenths higher on the resistance. I think I used 26 or 27 and it came out to 1.1 ohms, fairly cool and extremely flavorful with the air flow choked down to about one quarter open or a tad less.
One other thing that came to mind reading this - I found RDAs (drippers) easier to learn on as opposed to RTAs or RTA/Clearo hybrids (Delta, Subtank). You can get a decent clone for between $10 & $20, just be sure to get one with a single coil option (Atomic, Zenith, or Tugboat V2 are good easy to build ones with a single coil airflow setting) to start with. Best of luck, vape on.

 

[rurwin]

You know, I wouldn't worry about all these numbers, or even ohms law, for the moment.

Try building some coils. Build them and test them. If they come out between 0.8 and 2.0 ohms, try wicking and vaping them. Start with a low power and work up. Learn how they work. Sometimes they will be good, sometimes they won't. Try more wick, less wick. The worst that can happen is having a tank full of juice leak all over the place. Try wider coils and narrower coils, try touching coils and non-touching coils, try silica and cotton wicks. Try different gauges of wire.

So long as you keep above, say, 0.8 ohms, there's nothing that can go seriously wrong and even then, with a VV mod you are pretty safe. It will refuse to fire if the resistance is too low.

 

[Kevin littell]

I BUILD..... All caps there because its time for a Beer....Ok....All good now.


1.4 to 1.8 ohms BUT I THINK your handicapping yourself by starting off with 26 ga wire. I THINK you should set that stuff off to the side and go get a roll of 28. Once you get building down on 28 try the 26.


I no like my builds below 1 ohm as they are too hot....Recently started building 2.5 ohm coils on a Kayfun and have been winding these things for about a year now and still dont have a standard build....


The build deck on my kayfuns tell me to use coils 12 wraps or less for spacing and my mechanical doesnt put out anymore then 4.2 volts....I like like the 10-12 watt vaping area....


BUT,


I don't like charging batteries all the time so I keep my builds ABOVE .6 ohms....I'm still a TELCO electronics engineer so I don't aim more then 20 watts at my teeth and push the button and my favorite juice tastes like a Miller High Life. Sweet juices require different builds.


I KNOW I'm not really helping here...Just giving you more variables.

 

[ShelaghDB]

You know, I wouldn't worry about all these numbers, or even ohms law, for the moment.
Try building some coils. Build them and test them. If they come out between 0.8 and 2.0 ohms, try wicking and vaping them. Start with a low power and work up. Learn how they work. Sometimes they will be good, sometimes they won't. Try more wick, less wick. The worst that can happen is having a tank full of juice leak all over the place. Try wider coils and narrower coils, try touching coils and non-touching coils, try silica and cotton wicks. Try different gauges of wire.
So long as you keep above, say, 0.8 ohms, there's nothing that can go seriously wrong and even then, with a VV mod you are pretty safe. It will refuse to fire if the resistance is too low.

All great advice and am doing in order to find the right spot.
Not dealing with one but 2 very different tanks.

I need to go figure out the range of the Delta ll. I know off hand the premades are 0.5 and I LOVE the taste they give off but I could learn to love it equally so at a higher one at a more "common" setting and/or it drinks less juice and i a able to use it to practise on away form the Kanger understandig of course, it isnt the Delta

I don't like charging batteries all the time so I keep my builds ABOVE .6 ohms....I'm still a TELCO electronics engineer so I don't aim more then 20 watts at my teeth and push the button and my favorite juice tastes like a Miller High Life. Sweet juices require different builds.

Yes that too. 0.5 does go thoughh batteries frequenty so again i must today go refresh my memory as to the Delta Range but also work with the sub tank mini ...todays the first day i have had all week to do this and will play with both and see if which i prefer.
No, I appreciate your advcie
Hpefully toay I finally finally make one that is perfect and move on

I went back to the beginning of this thread, on the weekend and read thoguh and so far started copied the very first persons advice that posted.....have a few to ago through today

Thx, much appreciated, all of you

5 kanger subtanks and 2 lemo drops - adding 2 more lemo 2s next week

 

[ShelaghDB]

You know, I wouldn't worry about all these numbers, or even ohms law, for the moment.

Try building some coils. Build them and test them. If they come out between 0.8 and 2.0 ohms, try wicking and vaping them. Start with a low power and work up. Learn how they work. Sometimes they will be good, sometimes they won't. Try more wick, less wick. The worst that can happen is having a tank full of juice leak all over the place. Try wider coils and narrower coils, try touching coils and non-touching coils, try silica and cotton wicks. Try different gauges of wire.

So long as you keep above, say, 0.8 ohms, there's nothing that can go seriously wrong and even then, with a VV mod you are pretty safe. It will refuse to fire if the resistance is too low.

HOW LONG would you say it took you doing this before you could do it with great confidence, finding the right spot and feeling you had done it right, finally?

 

[ShelaghDB]

Meant to add that I did go back about 2 weeks ago to the beginning of this thread and sat down and made several coils at wraps etc that were shown to me on SteamEngine though here and a few others and for the Kangor Subtank i was able to, so far, wrap some good ones around 1.1 or even 1 but even then as long as i take regular hits they are ok but i have never yet mastered the art of building special wicks, as i have see on You Tube that enabe me to take long deep hits on it without a touch of a dry hit. But from all I have read, its not a favourite for everyone anyhow. It might just be that in the end, although I would always use them, the Kanger Sub tanks, but it might not be my fav tank.

Gotta admit that i am drawn more to the Delta ii but due to its problems, that being a whistle and a small tank that needs refilling a lot, as well as that it drinks juice like a raging alcoholic, I want to try the Kayfun 4 I see everyone talking about or even the Lemo.
But I have held off as i have not yet mastered the Delta wraps to taste anywhere as good as they do with the pre-made one on it. I wont rest until they are equally as good! Then I will go on and try the other 2.

So its not as if I havent been wrappig them, but I just havent yet reached the point where I can do it without small aggrivations that will no longer be present once i have done 100 or so of them
Its really hard to learn when you only have 10 mins here, 15 there and I literally had to plan time to sit down and do them but often that would be delayed 2-3 days---at which point Id have 5 mins here, 5 there and i would quickly post a question or read......and it was frustrating not being able to find the time to do it.

I just want and need to be able to do it perfectly and one within 5 minutes, like the rest of you. I dont want to have to think about it but just know what wraps i need, at this or that........but I will never be like the ones that say they actually enjoy learning how to do these and spend hours perfecting a coil style

 

[rurwin]

HOW LONG would you say it took you doing this before you could do it with great confidence, finding the right spot and feeling you had done it right, finally?

A few months, but then I haven't really built that many. I found the hard part was getting the wick right and that changes from atomiser to atomiser. For a long time I stuck to separated coils wound over silica because I couldn't be bothered to empty out the tank and change the wick every time. Coils lasted several months with just a wash and dry burn now and again. Now with the Square/R I don't have to take everything apart to get at the coil so I've gone to micro-coils with cotton; it tastes much better and the extra practice with wicking means I've now got that art down too.

But I know Ohms Law intimately. Physics A-Level, a computer engineering degree, being a Radio Amateur and having a hardware-oriented job for thirty years will do that. For me, once I'd mastered the physical art of wrapping a coil I was done. I don't bother with the coil calculators out there, I write a spreadsheet if I want to work something out. The numbers are my friends.

It sounds like you are more practically oriented. The numbers are definitely not your friends. So I was suggesting a way that you could explore how it all worked without needing to get into ohms/per inch and heat flux per square millimetre.

But for both of us and anyone else, practice makes perfect. Winding a coil is much much, more than getting a neat helix of wire. That's only the start and a good part of the rest is a dark art that you have to learn for yourself.

 

[ShelaghDB]

A few months, but then I haven't really built that many. I found the hard part was getting the wick right and that changes from atomiser to atomiser. For a long time I stuck to separated coils wound over silica because I couldn't be bothered to empty out the tank and change the wick every time. Coils lasted several months with just a wash and dry burn now and again. Now with the Square/R I don't have to take everything apart to get at the coil so I've gone to micro-coils with cotton; it tastes much better and the extra practice with wicking means I've now got that art down too.

But I know Ohms Law intimately. Physics A-Level, a computer engineering degree, being a Radio Amateur and having a hardware-oriented job for thirty years will do that. For me, once I'd mastered the physical art of wrapping a coil I was done. I don't bother with the coil calculators out there, I write a spreadsheet if I want to work something out. The numbers are my friends.

It sounds like you are more practically oriented. The numbers are definitely not your friends. So I was suggesting a way that you could explore how it all worked without needing to get into ohms/per inch and heat flux per square millimetre.

But for both of us and anyone else, practice makes perfect. Winding a coil is much much, more than getting a neat helix of wire. That's only the start and a good part of the rest is a dark art that you have to learn for yourself.

Thanks. U r right and one has to just keep doing it, We learn repetitivly. I understand that.

One thing I have learned on this trail is that even some of the more experienced coil builders dont fully understand Ohms Law and have just learned from practise and hearing over and over that a coil for one subtank will be between this and that number but press further about Ohms and I have come to learn that many dont grasp it as I thought they would. I wish I had realized that sooner for I couldnt understand why i wasnt grasping it quickly as I normally do with most things and that was really frustrating me. Once I realized that not ever one else was either, I relaxed a bit.
Am female and of the age group where no matter ones intellect, most us us were not encouraged to excel in maths or sciences. In fact it was quite acceptable to fail one or the other yearly without consequences providing we excelled in languages, arts and Home Ec (cooking/sewing) so admittedly I have gone though life quiet well without needing any of the maths forced upon us in school such as algebras and i suppose Ohms although i really dont recall ever hearing, or remembering anything about Ohms before this experience.

For example, a person I know that has been doing it for years, a creative person, told me once to wrap one on 26", about 9x and it should come in, roughly between 1.00 and 1.13 that it would be fine and how one should never go lower than 1.00, down to 0.5, etc for then they never have to worry about safety.
Today, I understand that its likely had i pushed that person futher, they too might not really have bothered to understood ohms law other than, as explained, to keep it between a set of numbers.

Yes, numbers are NOT my friend. They are, indeed my most hated enemy

Thanks for your advice

 

[rurwin]

I am also of the age when only girls learned typing. As a software engineer, it is a skill that I've lamented every day since. By the time I realised I needed it I was so fast with hunt-and-peck that I couldn't learn to touch-type. Five years after I left school the era of the shorthand/typist was finished so I don't suppose it helped the girls much either.

I'm OK with cooking, but dangerous with a needle.

 

[ShelaghDB]

I am also of the age when only girls learned typing. As a software engineer, it is a skill that I've lamented every day since. By the time I realised I needed it I was so fast with hunt-and-peck that I couldn't learn to touch-type. Five years after I left school the era of the shorthand/typist was finished so I don't suppose it helped the girls much either.

I'm OK with cooking, but dangerous with a needle.

I would have preferred ur school.

I was the first girl, in grade 9 to apply for IA (Industrail Arts). For some bizarre reason I cannot fathom, my typically British name makes people think i am male (Sheila?? Because of the spelling of mine) and I was in. The first day, I was one of the last in and the boys all refused to have a girl in their class and I was shamed and marched up to HomeEc, which BTW I hated. But in those days we would not have sued or demanded our rights.
I also took music and did not want to play the flute and wanted drums.
There were 3 boys on drums and myself and i can promise you that i was never allowed near the good ones.
It never occurred to me that my choices were considered peculiar at the time but suffice to say I HATED school.
Very Feminine but was definetely a tom boy.
Fortunately we have come a long way since and I imagine/hope that girls that want to play the drums and guitars, and/or learn to build with wood, tools, etc; are accepted and taught and not sent flying up to HomEc where I was forced to make a pink dress with puffy sleeves, which was, to this day, the most Helucious (sp?) garment ever created in all of history.
Apparently I guess I was an oddball in my teens for thinking I could do what boys could do and never thought to question that everyone else might not feel the same.
HOWEVER, it has NOT helped me with understanding Ohms

Anyhow, on to the next coil.

Thanks again to all that helped in this thread, but I think its now time to duck out and use the time to practise getting the coil in under those little screws effortlessly and easy. Its never as easy as they make it look on video. Time and practise...maybe one day i will get it all done in less than 3 minutes.



Typing- i too was like u. but computers cured that. Just practise and like coild building it becomes very easy. As a legal assistant typing tons of disclousres daily, i picked up my speed and am very quick...i can type a long post in 1/8th the time most can type 1 sentance and I have become much faster even, online, although admittedly online I dont usually fix several typos I might make at that speed as i would professionally...so if i can do it, any man can.

Good Luck

 

[Kevin littell]

When I first started I'd make a new coil, mount it, see what it ohmed out at, wick it and try it for a week.


Then, as the week went by I'd wonder.....Instead of a 1.2 ohm what would happen if I went 1.8? OR .8.....And if it vaped good enough to get me thru the week Id make a new coil and wick it up (never the same twice) and try it.


I settled for a 1.4 ohm coil in my Kayfun for about a year....Then one day I brought home a 50watt box that was on sale and had a though......What about a huge 3 ohm coil???



It didnt heat up right at 3 ohms.....I am currently at 2.4 (number of wraps changes....) ohms and have make this same coil 3 times in a row.



Trial and error Shel... trial and error.....

 

[ShelaghDB]

When I first started I'd make a new coil, mount it, see what it ohmed out at, wick it and try it for a week.

Then, as the week went by I'd wonder.....Instead of a 1.2 ohm what would happen if I went 1.8? OR .8.....And if it vaped good enough to get me thru the week Id make a new coil and wick it up (never the same twice) and try it.
I settled for a 1.4 ohm coil in my Kayfun for about a year....Then one day I brought home a 50watt box that was on sale and had a though......What about a huge 3 ohm coil???
It didnt heat up right at 3 ohms.....I am currently at 2.4 (number of wraps changes....) ohms and have make this same coil 3 times in a row.
Trial and error Shel... trial and error.....

Said i was gone but had to respond

3.0?
Why there? Dont mistake my question as sarcasm. I really am not sure what 3.0 would do and/or why?

I first started them at 0.5 on the Delta. Proabably ran before I could walk and dry hits dont appeal to me so i went back to the coils on those 2.
Just now perfecting, or trying to perfect, the Kangor sub tank mini first and then I will work on the Delta, althoug i really think i want a Kayfun clone IF they really are good
I don't want to run out and spend $200 and then discover its not for me BUT it sounds as if it will give me the taste that I prefer, which i find the Subtank is kind of only so so with.
I've been spoiled by the Delta, which up until now, even with just pre-coils, has been my fav flavour output of all of all, but I am also of the belief that i might not have to stay as high to find a flavour i really love, but as it is now I reach for the Deltas far more than the sub tanks, so I am using them, Subtanks to get that perfect wrap into....cutting it to the first level, trying to have the cut end sort of graduated rather than blunt, then tucked up sort of....in other words, its an art form I have been shown that i havent perfected yet

The Deltas I can take a long, deep hit on.......and no burned hit whilst the SubMini I find I must do shorter hits with. If i do its ok but if i take a long deep one, like the Delta, for sure it gets a dry hit
I have read something about new Nickel wire and how it is easier to wrap and not get a burned hit, if true??!!

But this 3.0...on what wire gauge and watt? how many wraps about?
And the reasoning behind it?

 

[ShelaghDB]

But yeah, starting to do the try it for a week wick trick to see what i prefer, as well.

 

[Kevin littell]

surface area.....BIG coil....fills all the room in the kayfun.


And it's different.


It draws cool the way I like it, has good flavor and the box mod doesn't have a voltage step down in watts mode (10 watts at .9 ohms is below battery voltage but 10 watts at 2.4 is 5.0 volts. (which brings the OTHER variable in....the equipment.

first coil took me an hour to get in the Kayfun, 2 hours for the Erlkinogin....now Its 10 mins on either and I can rewick the Kayfun sitting in Atlanta traffic.


This is all like giving up the stinkies.....trying out different till you find what works for you.


relax, keep you ohms above .4 and experiment. (It keeps me sober and away from the TV)

 

[ShelaghDB]

Well I am willing to try it, at 3.0 although admittedly its not one i would have thought of. But I need to double check my watts mode on each device first.
I have 4 devices each with a tank in it and batteries.
It gets a bit more confusing this way and i am learning to keep a text document of which one is at what watts, ohm, wrap, etc as I didnt the first time and forgot what I did the first 2x.

Not worried about smoking as i have been vaping since a year ago April. Started off on old crap that I was sold in an e-cig store that saw a newbie coming. Vaped for 3 months and got fed up with process. That was due to the same store being greedy and knowing full well I was frustrated, never taking the time out to explain why I was but kept selling me the same crap and NEVER once pointed me in the right direction. I got extremely fed up using many of their coils that did not work. I was led to believe it was me but I was told one day that they had made a bad purchase and the coils were likely fake. Lost all interest that day in that store.
Only now, with knowledge, can I look back and see what advantage they took. But I suspect those in the store were in it for the money and not for the love of it as the owner still smoked anyhow
Got fed up, smoked again for a couple of months and then discovered that there were groups, forums, etc about Vaping online.
Who would have thunk it?
I never went online to cht chat or learn about Smoking, so never thought to look up Vaping but once i did, I moved away from Nautilus mini tanks right away that had silica in the wicks and gunked up quickly. Tried the new 100% cotton ones 2 weeks ago and was very impressed with them. Had those likely been around when I began, I am not sure I would have gone further, but, I did and havent had a cigarette in a long time so its not staying away from them that concerns me.
But I have not had good experiences with B + M stores so it was knowing I could buy and learn online that made all the difference or I never would have come back to it.
Just started to read up on RDA about 6 weeks ago and didnt have a chance to get out and stock up on wire, tools, etc until about 3-4 weeks ago, hence when it started for me but I didnt have time to dig into it other than theory until about 2 weekd ago.

So good luck with staying off the cigs. If IT ALL became illegal tomorrow, not sure Id pick up a cigarette again BUT i know it only takes one! Its easy to quit but much more difficult to remain hyper vigilant in remembering its the first one that will get u every time. Addiction has an uncanny way of making our brains tell us that first one will be ok....and it never is! ;(

BTW, I will warn all friends in Atlanta to say off the roads when you are driving/sitting in traffic and making coils lol
If your traffic jams are THAT bad there I would suggest buying a scooter.
Its so much easier to dart in and out but likely much more difficult to build or rewick at red lights

 

[ShelaghDB]

I have a few differet ones to try.. also the one that rurwin suggested and a couple further back but sorry, what wire gauge do u use for that 3.0 version?

 

[Kevin littell]

I took a brief detour into 26 ga territory but it vaped too hot....I'm a 28 ga Nichrome kinda fellow....