Glycerine from pig fat?

Discussion in 'New Members Forum' started by myasin, Nov 30, 2009.

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  1. myasin

    myasin Full Member ECF Veteran

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    Nov 18, 2009
    Hi all,

    I've just read somewhere that glycerine in the liquids was obtained from either vegetable or pig fat, or it is synthetic. Because of the religious concerns, I need to know which liquids of which supplier is not obtained from animals. Synthetics and vegetable based ones work for me.

    Currently I am using cartomizers from Green Smoke. Does anyone know if they have any ingredient from animals?

    And yesterday I ordered a 510 kit from cignot and ordered [FONT="]PG Marlboro (USA MIX)[/FONT][/COLOR] and V[COLOR=black][FONT="]G Marlboro (USA MIX[/FONT]) juices. Do you know about them as well?

    Thanks in advance...
     
  2. Elapid

    Elapid Super Member ECF Veteran

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    Mississippi
    If your concern is the Pig fat in the PG you could order only VG liquids as they are only made from vegetables meaning there are no animal fats used. If your religious beliefs are against the pig, which many are, you could be sure only using VG.
     
  3. myasin

    myasin Full Member ECF Veteran

    Joined:
    Nov 18, 2009
    I also read that PG gives way better hit comparing to VG. If that is the case I better find a vegetable based PG. Does anyone know some products for sure?
    Thanks...
     
  4. Darmeen

    Darmeen Senior Member ECF Veteran

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    This is not correct...if you are really worried about pig fat, PG would be the sure way to go...there are forms of VG that are made from animal fats.

    Practically all commercial production of PG is by non-catalytic hydrolysis of propylene oxide using high temperatures and high pressures.
    (found on the Dow website)

    Glycerol (ie glycerin) forms the backbone of triglycerides, and can be produced by saponification of animal fats, e.g. a byproduct of soap-making. It also is a byproduct of the production of biodiesel via transesterification. Because of the emphasis on biodiesel, the market for glycerol is depressed, and the old epichlorohydrin process for glycerol synthesis is no longer economical. Approximately 950,000 tons per annum are produced in the USA and Europe. Production will increase as the EU directive 2003/30/EC is implemented, which requires the replacement of 5.75% of petroleum fuels with biofuel across all Member States by 2010[2].
    Glycerol is also produced as a byproduct of refining of cooking and salad oils, and various brands (e.g, NOW) are sold to the retail market as "Pure Vegetable Source" glycerin, 100% pure, which is safe for ingestion.
    (wikipedia)


    There is no such thing as a vegetable based PG. If it is derived from vegetables, it will be VG. You will have to do research to find a VG fluid that is derived from plant oils and vegetables.

    I know the question has been asked here before about manufacturers who make 'vegetable' VG, so I would suggest doing a search here to find that info.
     
  5. Thatdamncat

    Thatdamncat Senior Member

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    Milwaukee, WI
    I believe that Drew at nhaler.com has kosher juice.
    On a side note, glycerin is used in making explosives. In WWII, citizens were encouraged to donate their used cooking grease to the US gov for bomb production.
     
  6. Darmeen

    Darmeen Senior Member ECF Veteran

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    That is where nitroglycerin is from. :)

    glycerin has been used for an incredible amount of things:

    Glycerol is used for an evaporative fogging agent as an alternative to Propylene Glycol in some solutions for "electronic cigarette" use, mostly for those with a physiological sensitivity or other health concerns.
    It is also used in de-icing/anti-icing fluids, as in vitrification of blood cells for storage in liquid nitrogen.
    In motion-picture production, glycerol is used as a non-evaporating substitute for perspiration or tears on actors. It is also used in some types of stage blood.
    Compost additive
    For tincture extraction and preservation of essential oils and chemicals from herbs
    Citric acid production
    Cosmetic bonding agent for makeup, including: eye shadow, lipstick, lipgloss, lotions and eyedrops
    Glycerol may be used as antifreeze for plants, if mixed with water in a 10 percent solution. It is believed to be effective at temperatures near -18 °C[dubious – discuss]
    Glycerol can also be used as a bodybuilding supplement to increase nitric oxide (NO) uptake in the muscles and act in a similar way to the amino acid arginine to create swelling in the working muscle for the individual
    Glycerin, when poured on potassium permanganate, will combust making it a useful firelighting tool.
    Glycerine is used as an anti-drying agent in watercolor paints.
    Glycerine is used as a preservative to keep tobacco mixture for use in hookahs moist.
     
  7. Kurt

    Kurt Quantum Vapyre ECF Veteran

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    I buy Heritage VG at Whole Foods. It is a purely vegetable-based glycerin. Works great but it is very thick, and I generally cut it with a few drops of vodka. You can also use distilled water to thin it. I am primarily using a 510 system, but I have a Green Smoke too. I believe their carts are PG-only for the vehicle, so not from animals. I am not a fan of PG, due to negative reactions to it, and I've tried VG in their carts. For the regular batts, it is fine, because it is 3.7 V. But I also have the GS passthrough (they call it USB electronic cigarette, I think). That monster MUST run at 5V, direct from the USB. Unmodified GS carts work great on it, MASSIVE vapor. But add VG and vape on the GS PT, and things go bad fast! Acrid cough-producing harsh vapor. I think maybe the 5V cooks the VG into acrolein, as this is a reaction product of VG under very high heat, which is not possible with regular 3.7V. Regardless, for whatever reason, and I've done the experiment several times, VG in the GS PT is a no-go. I've hurled a few otherwise good GS carts into the trash, as the vapor was that bad, and it was clear the cart would never give good vapor again. Not tried VG in GS carts on the GS batts yet. My guess is they will be fine at 3.7 V, but I'll try it at some point and report. It would be great to be able to avoid PG and reuse GS carts. GS is expensive, maybe too much so, but it is a quality product, very convenient and well built. The PT is about 3x as expensive as my 510 PT, but is a raging beast of vapor in comparison.

    I've been asking around in several threads if others have problems with vaping thick VG-based juices at 5V, but so far no one has responded, so I guess PG is the juice of choice with high voltage.
     
  8. Birdy

    Birdy Super Member ECF Veteran

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    Houston
  9. myasin

    myasin Full Member ECF Veteran

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    Nov 18, 2009
    Thanks for the detailed information. But at the JC FAQ page they say their PG liquids are vegan. How about that?
     
  10. myasin

    myasin Full Member ECF Veteran

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    Nov 18, 2009
    Thank you very much for sharing your experience. If you do not know already GS uses the same generic model E9 and there are some other sellers who sells parts and kits way cheaper. e-cig, red dragon, and bloog (?) are the major ones.
     
  11. Kent C

    Kent C ECF Guru Verified Member ECF Veteran

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    Location:
    NW Ohio US
    All vegetable (no animal) 100% pure Vegetable Glycerine.

    NOW Foods - Vegetable Glycerine - 16 oz.

    "NOW Foods does not test on animals."


    What is the source of NOW® Vegetable Glycerine, and can it be used as a sweetener?
    NOW® Vegetable Glycerine is a natural by-product of the cosmetic industry. It is derived from palm oil and is 100% pure. Vegetable Glycerine is safe to use as a natural sweetener, and actually metabolizes slower than regular table sugar."

    NOW Foods - A Message from NOW Foods Founder, Elwood Richard=

    A Message from NOW Foods Founder, Elwood Richard

    "The proof of NOW quality rests in our adherence to excellent manufacturing processes. We are a GMP and organic certified manufacturer. We are also kosher certified by the Union of Orthodox Jewish Congregations of America. We support not-for-profit organizations such as Citizens for Health and DSEA (Dietary Supplement Education Alliance) whose mission is to educate the public on the benefits of natural products, for our bodies and our environment."

    And one heck of a price right now at amazon.... never seen it that low there:
    $4.92 for a 16 oz bottle.

    Amazon.com: Vegetable Glycerine 16 fl.oz: Everything Else

    A bit lower in the older bottling:

    NOW Foods, Vegetable Glycerine - 16 fl oz - Nutricity.com

    Didn't check shipping on either.
     
  12. Birdy

    Birdy Super Member ECF Veteran

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    Location:
    Houston
    I think he just meant that PG isn't animal or vegetable based- it is synthetic.
    Glycerin can be animal OR vegetable based.

    If you buy USP Food Grade "Vegetable Glycerin" then it will not contain animal products. The ingredient list on the bottle should state that clearly.

    I've never heard of any eliquid that does contain animal products- some vendors go ahead and say that so that anyone concerned (like you) can buy them without worrying about it.
     
  13. myasin

    myasin Full Member ECF Veteran

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    Nov 18, 2009
    I've checked it and you are right. PG is kosher based at nhaler. Thanks a lot...
     
  14. Birdy

    Birdy Super Member ECF Veteran

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  15. myasin

    myasin Full Member ECF Veteran

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    Nov 18, 2009
    If glycerin is animal based I still should avoid it. Do you mean glycerin in e-liquids is not animal based?
     
  16. Birdy

    Birdy Super Member ECF Veteran

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    Houston
    Just remember kosher doesn't necessarily mean vegan.

    So when you're seeing generic glycerin it can be kosher but still contain animal products.
     
  17. myasin

    myasin Full Member ECF Veteran

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    Nov 18, 2009
    It's OK. I can go with kosher.
     
  18. myasin

    myasin Full Member ECF Veteran

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    Nov 18, 2009
    Sorry, I am confused. Let say I got VG from above links. What should I do else to have the liquid to vape. Peaople use the term cut, but I could not figure out it yet. I asked my question in the first place to buy just a ready made mix. I am afraid I do not have the DIY experience yet.

    Thanks...
     
  19. Kent C

    Kent C ECF Guru Verified Member ECF Veteran

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    NW Ohio US
    I was just addressing the more general question about VG:

    "I've just read somewhere that glycerine in the liquids was obtained from either vegetable or pig fat, or it is synthetic. Because of the religious concerns, I need to know which liquids of which supplier is not obtained from animals. Synthetics and vegetable based ones work for me."

    As far as DIY, you'd have to get a VG or PG based nic juice that is also kosher and then flavorings that are kosher as well. Pretty sure you're good to go with Nhaler for premade juice that will be kosher. You could PM Drew directly if you had questions:

    e-cigarette-forum.com • The place for electronic cigarette reviews, news and chat - View Profile: Drewsworld
     
  20. Kent C

    Kent C ECF Guru Verified Member ECF Veteran

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    I like it. It's clean and I cut it with distilled water. I thought I got a deal at amazon for $5 something ;-) but that's a pretty good price above. Never priced it locally though.
     
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