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Lots of new squonkers - a threat to Reo?

Discussion in 'Liquid Feed APV Discussion' started by gpjoe, Oct 6, 2017.

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  1. gpjoe

    gpjoe Ultra Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Oct 30, 2013
    Motown
    I'll start by saying that I am a huge fan of Reos Mods, and own five of them - two Grands and three P67s. Love them, and Reo is the granddaddy of squonking.

    Lately, we have seen a ton of new budget squonkers being announced, as squonking is finally getting the attention it deserves. Until recently, I got the feeling that squonking was embraced by the "older" crowd (me included) and that the younger cloud-chasing vapers were not interested - though that appears to be rapidly changing as squonking becomes more mainstream. (Note that this is not a knock against cloud-chasing, and I enjoy a good fog myself.)

    So, my question: With the advent of the budget (sub-$100) squonkers Geekvape Athena, Sentorian Ram, Vandy Vape Pulse, etc...what is the effect on the Reos Mods sales model, if any? Having been the benchmark for a looong time, and still one of the most durable and reliable squonk mods around, the Reo never really had any competition until now.

    I'll be honest - I love my Reos and have always been a huge booster of their mods (still am), but I can't see myself buying another when there are so many other intriguing choices hitting the market. My future dollars will likely go elsewhere, if only for variety.

    I hope that Reos Mods is around forever, but can't help but think that with all of the other mods competing for one segment of the market that Reos Mods will suffer. Remember what happened to ProVape - a slow (no?) reaction to a changing market was their demise. So what is the answer?...lower prices?...new product?...will the competition even affect Reos Mods?

    Personally, I would love to see a colorful resin P67.

    Thoughts?
     
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  2. B2L

    B2L Vaping Master Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Supporting member
    Jan 14, 2012
    Jacksonville, FL
    On the other hand, it is introducing squonking to a whole new audience that would not have, initially, spent $200 give or take on a higher end device built to last. I would bet some (a lot? A few?) go on to purchase a REO. It could be a jumping off spot for them which would drive REO sales.
     
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  3. Marc411

    Marc411 Vaping Master Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Mar 17, 2014
    Windy City
    I guess it depends on what a person is looking for out of their purchase.

    If they are looking for a device that will last damn near forever, have continued support for the device and available parts they buy a REO.

    If they are just looking to trying squonking and don't want any of the above they pick up something else.

    I purchased my REO's in 2012 and both are still traveling with me every day. They are tough and can take a pounding. Both have been upgraded with the new 510 pin and are still working flawlessly.

    So if you want a VW beetle you pick one up, if you want a tank pick up a REO ;)
     
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  4. gpjoe

    gpjoe Ultra Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Oct 30, 2013
    Motown
    That is a good point.

    My fear though, is whether Reo can remain relevant. I recently saw a P67 in the FS forum. Guy was trying to sell a P67 with a Nuppin and got zero interest. That set-up would have lasted about an hour six months ago, but he ultimately pulled the post.

    It's tough to convince a new squonker to buy a Reo for over 200 bucks when they can get five Vandy Vape Pulse squonkers for the same price.
     
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  5. gpjoe

    gpjoe Ultra Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Oct 30, 2013
    Motown
    No doubt, but if you don't roll with the changes, you get trampled. Again - I give you ProVape and the Provari. The "continued support" is only good if the company stays in business. That is my concern.
     
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  6. oplholik

    oplholik ECF Guru Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Supporting member
    I had no luck selling a P67 either. I do think the interest has waned. I hope Eric and crew can do something about that.
     
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  7. gpjoe

    gpjoe Ultra Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Oct 30, 2013
    Motown
    Here's a good example of the perception regarding Reos. This guy portrays himself as an "expert" and rates some squonkers. A LOT of them are pure crap - yet he rates the Reo last. Buy a Reo clone if you want to try one?...seriously? I had one of those and used it for about 5-minutes before I PIF'd it here. The clone is in no way a fair representation of the genuine article.

    I commented about how wrong he was - but all of the other comments and questions are about the other mods. The guy is certainly entitled to his opinion, but he is a clown, and completely wrong about the Reo as I point out. I almost hate to give him any exposure by linking to his "review".

    Wondering how pervasive this is?

    http://www.geekayvapes.com/squonk-mod/
     
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  8. AzPlumber

    AzPlumber Vaping Master Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Aug 28, 2011
    Arizona
    Your concern is real, one only needs to look at Provari as an example.
     
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  9. Train2

    Train2 ECF Guru Verified Member ECF Veteran

    May 11, 2013
    CA, USA
    1 - I too would love a resin (or delrin) P67!

    2 - all this already happened.
    Squonking is BOOOMING. There's thousands and thousands of people buying squonkers, and showing them off on Facebook and Instagram. There are dozens of vendors with thousands of "followers". There are new bottom-feed rda's ever day. There are people waiting months, lotteries for the chance to buy, bidding wars...
    And for the most part, Reo isn't part of that boom, but a niche product.
    Reo's remain popular with "old school" vapers - who started a couple years ago or more.
    Reo's I think retain the reputation as super heavy-duty, reliable, high quality. Possibly a good European market as well.
    But they've missed some trends - similar to Provape not following the trend for higher wattage, Reo didn't follow the trend for a smaller device with minimal voltage drop for low resistance vaping.

    I'd love to see the new owners invigorate the brand's popularity with some new products.
    I'd hate to see them just "jump on board late" with another basic little box. PLEASE not a 3D printed little box. There's 10,000 of those.

    But they COULD make their mark with a new product - and I, for one, would be glad to both buy and promote it.

    I think some things that would grab attention of the "new squonker" market:
    - Replace the spring. A few reonauts require "protection" but MOST vapers with a mech want near-zero voltage drop and are paying extra for silver contacts, etc.
    - smaller device. Doesn't have to be the smallest, just a bit smaller.
    - 24mm rda compatibility without overhang, minimum
    - have an 18650 version and a 21XXX version
    THINGS TO KEEP part of the Reo legacy:
    - Do NOT compromise on offering something basically indestructable
    - leak-free rock-solid tough-as-nails 510
    - trouble-free firing button
    - easy access to swap bottle and battery




     
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  10. gpjoe

    gpjoe Ultra Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Oct 30, 2013
    Motown
    Agree on all counts.
     
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  11. rob33

    rob33 Super Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Dec 20, 2009
    Concord, NC
    I would hate to see REO end up like Provape, business is business. REO is going to have to make some immediate improvements and I'm not taking about just a paint change. They are going to have do this and meet the price point of competition domestic or foreign. Are they going to rest on a 18650 mechanical only product, or they going to upgrade batteries and go regulated. I have a few REOs but they have nothing to sell me right now. As a lot of Provape customers did, I have changed my vaping style and moved on REO just failed to keep up.
     
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  12. gpjoe

    gpjoe Ultra Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Oct 30, 2013
    Motown
    And that is my concern.

    Up till recently, there was no competition. It was Reo or some higher priced boutique/made-to-order mod like a TMod or Pdib mod costing several hundred dollars, which made Reos seem like a bargain. The competition is getting much stiffer, and prices are falling.

    Being recently retired, I will not spend $200+ on any mod in the foreseeable future. I can still afford it, but my priorities have changed and I am much more careful and selective with my vape purchases. Without changing to appeal to a wider audience, I don't know if Reos Mods can rely on just it's niche of loyal followers to sustain their business.
     
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  13. Train2

    Train2 ECF Guru Verified Member ECF Veteran

    May 11, 2013
    CA, USA
    Well, there I must disagree.
    There's plenty of room for a maker of quality mechanical squonkers.

    There's dramatically increased demand for both regulated and unregulated squonk gear.
    More people vape regulated, but the mech squonk makers too, literally can't keep up.


     
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  14. SteamStack

    SteamStack Ultra Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Aug 7, 2014
    Macomb, MI, USA
    Would be nice if this thread was also on reosmods sub forums.
     
  15. Marc411

    Marc411 Vaping Master Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Mar 17, 2014
    Windy City
    A couple of thoughts...

    1. REO has virtually no marketing strategy, everything is word of mouth. Competitors are talking about or posting there products everywhere they can and getting others to do videos by offering free or reduced pricing for reviews. REO needs to work on their marketing and PR, this industry moves fast and you talk about your product or it gets lost.

    2. Variety, I look at the two LP's I own and believe that they are easy upgrade to a VW/TC regulated mod. The REO has one of the smallest footprints of all my mods. I attempted to design I sled/side panel that would screw onto the side of the REO to convert it. If you used a Evolv 75 or SX chip and designed a screw on side panel it could be converted. It could easily (maybe) be retrofitted to the button side of the mod, convert the switch and presto VW.

    Now I know it's not that simple, my printed design sucked and I moved onto other things but it could be done and the mod would remain small compared to most on the market. The market is now competitive and price point is driving sales, people seem to care less about quality or repairs. REO shouldn't compromise quality or the repair service but needs to find a way to reduce the price point.

    3. As was already mentioned, reduced cost. Would resin reduce the business expense for materials and labor? Competitors have a reduced price point and margin but make up for it in sales velocity. Margin may be less but revenue is higher.

    Let's face it, these new squonkers are mass produced in China with reduced labor cost. If you want to remain in the market you have to find a way to reduce cost and become competitive, you also have to remain innovative.

    There are hundreds if not thousands of LP's and Grands out there, how many would opt for a reasonably priced upgrade. If the SX chip was an option I have two that would be going back to the spa right now.
     
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  16. MsLoud

    MsLoud Ultra Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

    I have a 2 P67s and a Mini REO. When I looked at my next purchase - I wanted a "cute" setup - I looked around and found Vandy Vape Pulse - I bought all 4 models and all door colors and a handful of the color bottles....for around the same price as a P67.
    I love my REOs but wanted variety. Haven't ventured into regulated squonking yet but there are SO many inexpensive choices out there now for both camps.

    Sent from my 5049W using Tapatalk
     
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  17. pianoguy

    pianoguy Vaping Master Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Supporting member
    Nov 4, 2009
    Apple Valley, MN
    I imagine not too many budget squonkers would survive this:



    For mechs, I consider my REO's my "forever" mods. My cheapies tend to be backup spares kept in my golf bag, office desk drawer, glove compartment, etc.
     
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  18. gpjoe

    gpjoe Ultra Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Oct 30, 2013
    Motown
    Ooops. :)

    I didn't know that the Reo forum had re-opened. When did that happen?
     
  19. gpjoe

    gpjoe Ultra Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Oct 30, 2013
    Motown
    Yep. In one of my posts above I mentioned (and linked to) a guy that listed his top squonk mods. He rated the Reo dead last implying that it was not reliable or a good value, basically saying it was old and irrelevant. I commented on his list and posted a link to Super_X_drifter's video to show just how wrong he was in his assessment.

    Trouble is, when you search for "Best" or "Top" squonk mods - there he is, spreading a false perception. I don't think he's ever even used a Reo or held one in his hand.
     
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  20. ENAUD

    ENAUD everyone I know, goes away, in the end... Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Supporting member
    Let's talk about the elephant in the room...REOs mods is a US based company, and since the deeming, there can be No New Products brought to market without submission for approval by the FDA.

    I'd bet money that the bulk of REOs business is domestic. All these imported squonkers are marketed from outside the reach of the FDA's arm, until they are imported.

    Product registrations with the FDA are due in just a few weeks, nothing has changed on that front, so a lot will depend on what level of enforcement the FDA chooses to act upon.

    I don't see a rosy future from the current vantage point, but I hope I am wrong...
     
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