Max wattage for delta II 1.2 ohm rba coil?
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I have to disagree, wattage directly determines heat, regardless of the amount of wire used. More wattage equals more heat. The rest of your reply is pretty much spot on. When everything is a variable, that means every piece determines heat. The amount of wire, type of wire, the gauge, AND power applied (in this case wattage) all factor into the heat, as well as the atty design, airflow, coil placement, length of draw, etc.
Make some constants and you'll see the direct correlation. Say you have a 1.2ohm coil from 30g KA1, regardless of the ID 6 watts gives you a heat flux value of 178, one more watt and it's getting warm at 208, one more and it's hot at 237, take that to 10 watts and it's probably burning your cotton at almost 300. So, how does the power applied (wattage in our example) not determine the heat of the coil? If your resistance was variable (say the OP was asking for different build ideas to get a similar vape using higher/lower resistance keeping the heat flux similar) and your wattage constant (if they wanted to stay at 5 watts), than maybe I could see your point. But they made the resistance a constant at 1.2ohms, so the two variables to consider are wire type/gauge, and wattage required to reach the same heat flux as the stock coil (knowing the type/gauge of the stock coil will leave the only variable as the wattage).
Now compare your argument when using say 29 or 31awg...... The electrical properties (wattage, volts, ohms) will all be the same as with your 30awg. BUT the heat will be different. It is the wire and amount of wire that determines heat. Wattage is really just a result of volts running through a coil of x ohms. A 1.2ohm coil always delivers the same wattages regardless of gauge. But different gauges will deliver different amount of heat.
This is the problem with regulated devices, it teaches us the wrong thing about what is really going on. Aftrerall there really is NO such thing a variable wattage. All regulated devices regulate VOLTage. Variable wattage and even TC are just different ways of MEASURING the inputs and outputs of the regulated voltage.
Like I said, if all criteria are variable, each one has an effect on the heat output. However, make some constant, and the others will have to be varied to adjust heat. Wattage is simply a way of expressing electrical current, more current over a static curcuit (1.2ohm whatever gauge you settle on) wil increase the temperature of the coil. However, make the wattage static, and you are correct, you will have to adjust the coil properties to influence the heat.
And, variable voltage vs. variable wattage is very simple to explain. Yes, the volts applied to the coil are what is adjusted. But, since volts, ohms, and wattage are directly related... you cannot change one without changing the others. Variable wattage devices simply apply ohms law to calculate the final output (watts). Variable voltage devices care not what the final output is, and leave the calculations up to the end user.
It's all a very intertwined situation, and as such ALL properties (wire type, gauge, amount, resistance, power supplied, and total power output) directly effect the perceived heat.
I'm not saying you are wrong, just that wattage (as well as all other properties) does indeed effect heat.
wattage depends on what wire gauge you use.
try 28 gauge
use steam engine
Coil wrapping | Steam Engine | free vaping calculators
The coil is a fixed and constant value. I know of no variable rate coils, at least. Once wound and mounted it is what it is. VV vs VW vsTC are all different ways of calculating and regulating the VOLTs sent to that coil.
I feel we are running in a circle here. Until the coil is wrapped, it is also a variable to be taken into account when finding a desired heat. Besides volts are a measurement of power applied, and wattage a measure of the power output by the circuit.
So, amps tell you how much electricity is used, volts tell you the pressure/force of the electricity being applied, and watts tells you the amount of work the electricity does per second.
Certainly we ageee that variable devices just use different ways to adjust the power applied. But, that doesn't change the fact that increasing the watts invariably increases the voltage (on the same coil).
When planning a coil, all factors are variable until it is wrapped. Except with a mechanical mod, where you have a fixed voltage, and changing resistance and wire type/gauge are how one controls the power/heat being used/output. In a VV/VW device it matters not if you adjust volts or watts, as the direct correlation between the two means changing one changes the other. So, what difference does it make if someone asks how many watts or volts will be required to reach a certain temperature with a specific coil? The only other piece of information required to give an answer (since the OP included desired resistance) is the gauge/type of wire they plan on using. But, maybe they also need advice on that...
If the OP has a VV/VW device, they can likely use any wire to wrap that 1.2ohm coil and adjust the device (either volts or watts) to achieve the desired temperature.
For example, 30g @1.2ohm and 6 watts gives a heat flux of 178. 28g @1.2ohm and 12 watts also gives 178 heat flux. Sure the second requires twice the power, it also has twice the surface area. But wouldn't the perceived heat be the same (except the 28g has a longer ramp up)?
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Yes, it can be a chicken vs egg type argument..
BUT you were saying that more watts equals more heat. yet even in the example you give, the lower wattage coil is hotter.
For example, 30g @1.2ohm and 6 watts gives a heat flux of 178. 28g @1.2ohm and 12 watts also gives 178 heat flux. Sure the second requires twice the power, it also has twice the surface area. But wouldn't the perceived heat be the same (except the 28g has a longer ramp up)"
As I was saying it's the wire and amount of wire that determines temperature, it also determines the required amount of power to achieve the wattage output desired.
Yes it is all connected, this is why a HF of 178 while coolish on the range of heat flux, can be hot in one atty with one wire and cold in another or with different wire.
BUT you were saying that more watts equals more heat. yet even in the example you give, the lower wattage coil is hotter.
For example, 30g @1.2ohm and 6 watts gives a heat flux of 178. 28g @1.2ohm and 12 watts also gives 178 heat flux. Sure the second requires twice the power, it also has twice the surface area. But wouldn't the perceived heat be the same (except the 28g has a longer ramp up)"
As I was saying it's the wire and amount of wire that determines temperature, it also determines the required amount of power to achieve the wattage output desired.
Yes it is all connected, this is why a HF of 178 while coolish on the range of heat flux, can be hot in one atty with one wire and cold in another or with different wire.
heat flux is actually a measure of wire surface temperature.
specifically if you have one atty with one wire and another with a different wire , side by side, dry fired, they will be at the same temperature
that's why heat flux is used in steam engine calculator - it's a good approximation to temperature.
What I have been trying to say is that all other factors being equal (the OP is using one specific tank, one desired ohm range, etc) increasing the power output (wattage was the measurement the OP was asking about) increases the heat. Surely we agree on a lot more than our online conversation shows. To me, and I'm just speaking logically - I'm no electrical expert, twice the surface area with the same heat flux would feel just as hot. It would just be over a larger area. I mean, a larger ice cube isn't colder than a small one. If 178 heat flux doesn't always generate the same amount of heat, regardless of coil properties (again assuming all other variables are equal), than what does heat flux represent? I thought it represented the perceived heat of the coil, and as such 178 is 178 is 178, again this assumes that coil placement, airflow, etc. are equal in these scenarios. I definitely agree that across multiple attys (different airflow, chamber/chimney design, etc) that 178 will feel warmer on the atty with less airflow and cooler with more. However, I am fairly confident that if you measured the temp of the dry coil (infrared thermometer would do the trick) it would be equal. Unless I am completely mistaken about what heat flux represents.
Yet the heat flux is a measurement of coil surface temp. But NOT vapor temp.
178 heat flux doesn't generate the same amount of VAPOR heat all the time. Thats where heat capacity, and the affect of juice and air flows come in. The capacity tells you how long a coil will take to reach the HF and also how fast the juice and air will limit the heat of the vapor. A 200 plus HF on small wire or coil can be a colder vape than a 178HF with a bigger wire/coil.
Take your ice cube example. the ice will be approx 32 degrees, yes.. BUT sit on an ice cube, then sit on an ice BLOCK. Whick makes you colder. the larger piece of ice has more capacity for cooling than the smaller one. Just like a larger coil has more capacity for transmitting heat than a smaller coil even if they have the same surface temperature or Heat Flux.
178 heat flux doesn't generate the same amount of VAPOR heat all the time. Thats where heat capacity, and the affect of juice and air flows come in. The capacity tells you how long a coil will take to reach the HF and also how fast the juice and air will limit the heat of the vapor. A 200 plus HF on small wire or coil can be a colder vape than a 178HF with a bigger wire/coil.
Take your ice cube example. the ice will be approx 32 degrees, yes.. BUT sit on an ice cube, then sit on an ice BLOCK. Whick makes you colder. the larger piece of ice has more capacity for cooling than the smaller one. Just like a larger coil has more capacity for transmitting heat than a smaller coil even if they have the same surface temperature or Heat Flux.
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