Message to e-Liquid vendors: This is what we want from you!

Status
Not open for further replies.

Buggs5347

Ultra Member
ECF Veteran
Verified Member
Aug 12, 2012
2,450
3,143
Arizona
How'd ya'll like to receive a dripping, broken chernobyl package like this?

Notice this is a USPS mailer for flat documents, not liquids. :blink: It is unpadded. (My carrier was just ecstatic about this. NOT)
This is the kind of thing, IMHO, is what is going to one day soon, put the entire vaping community at risk in terms of our privileges.

(And, before you blame the Post Office, the item that leaked was not wrapped, bubbled or otherwise....it was just in there, flopping around)

I'll tell ya later about my lcleanup adventures, both down at my mailbox by the road, and then at my sink as I unpackaged.

Just interested in your thoughts---?

OMG!! I'd sure like to know what vendor shipped that?
 

Orobas

Equine Disrespect
ECF Veteran
Verified Member
Jun 3, 2012
7,766
6,264
39
Jarhead City
Yeah, I say it all the time and I'll say it again.

a few drops of the concentrations we vape can be fatal to a child or pet.

There is absolutely no excuse for this, because if it's a high concentrate that means that potentially everything that package has touched could be contaminated and harmful.
 

Racehorse

ECF Guru
ECF Veteran
Verified Member
Jul 12, 2012
11,230
28,272
USA midwest
I was just thinking holy crap, what is that is high concentrate stuff?

I posted here to gather other's thoughts and perspectives, as well as raise awareness, as the title of the topic suggests.

So let me play devils advocate. Maybe because it WASN'T concentrated nic juice, they felt justified in being rather un-careful with it?

First reponse I received was along the lines of USPS is usually more careful w/insured packages, and I should get a claim going.
Next response when I pushed the envelope a little----- was that the bottles are plastic, therefore not bubblewrapped, and up to now there haven't been any problems.

VG spilling on somebody is not going to hurt them, but I daresay, anything with a return address that has to do with vaping and has liquid leaking out is gonna be sort of a problem for all of us, isn't it? Does this sound like denial, or naivety......

I'm a measured person, mistakes happen in every business. I'm just trying to understand HOW to evaluate all this, and what the average man-in-the-street would say.

I've run few businesses. Customers never heard about our problems, we were too busy serving them. Excuses weren't given, just "what can we do to make this right?" Or at least, "we learned something from you. Time to reevaluate our methods....."
 

oldsoldier

Retired ECF Forum Manager
ECF Veteran
Verified Member
Dec 17, 2010
12,503
7,999
Lurking in the shadows
www.reboot-n.com
I posted here to gather other's thoughts and perspectives, as well as raise awareness, as the title of the topic suggests.

So let me play devils advocate. Maybe because it WASN'T concentrated nic juice, they felt justified in being rather un-careful with it?

First reponse I received was along the lines of USPS is usually more careful w/insured packages, and I should get a claim going.
Next response when I pushed the envelope a little----- was that the bottles are plastic, therefore not bubblewrapped, and up to now there haven't been any problems.

VG spilling on somebody is not going to hurt them, but I daresay, anything with a return address that has to do with Vaping and has liquid leaking out is gonna be sort of a problem for all of us, isn't it? Does this sound like denial, or naivety......

I'm a measured person, mistakes happen in every business. I'm just trying to understand HOW to evaluate all this, and what the average man-in-the-street would say.

I've run few businesses. Customers never heard about our problems, we were too busy serving them. Excuses weren't given, just "what can we do to make this right?" Or at least, "we learned something from you. Time to reevaluate our methods....."

My thoughts as forum manager:
ECF believes that proper packaging is an important aspect of doing business. Failure to properly package your products can have far reaching ramifications for the industry as a whole. Incidents that draw attention by the USPS are a bad thing, as an industry we really need to do things better and "more correctly" than the average bear.

My thoughts as "just another ECF member":
If I received an order in that condition with the obvious failure to properly package it I would go bat .... crazy on whoever sent it. There is absolutely no excuse to send an order improperly packaged. ESPECIALLY if it contains e-liquid. I'm sorry if this offends any suppliers but being a cheapo on packaging and shipping is simply bad business and brings disrepute on the industry as a whole. Bubble wrap and cellophane is cheap and easily acquired.
 

vsummer1

Vaping Master
ECF Veteran
Verified Member
Aug 3, 2012
9,142
19,335
California
My thoughts as forum manager:
ECF believes that proper packaging is an important aspect of doing business. Failure to properly package your products can have far reaching ramifications for the industry as a whole. Incidents that draw attention by the USPS are a bad thing, as an industry we really need to do things better and "more correctly" than the average bear.

My thoughts as "just another ECF member":
If I received an order in that condition with the obvious failure to properly package it I would go bat .... crazy on whoever sent it. There is absolutely no excuse to send an order improperly packaged. ESPECIALLY if it contains e-liquid. I'm sorry if this offends any suppliers but being a cheapo on packaging and shipping is simply bad business and brings disrepute on the industry as a whole. Bubble wrap and cellophane is cheap and easily acquired.

As is a simple ziplock bag. And the appropriate box can be acquired from the post office itself.
 

Janet H

Ultra Member
ECF Veteran
Verified Member
Sep 3, 2011
2,129
66,905
PA
Tasting is always good. I've discovered favorite vapes from samples, but I also have a bunch of samples I don't like and will pass them on to people to try. To me that benefits both the vendor for future sales and the customer who might just find something really like. I agree, it can be 0 nic, just a sample of the flavor.

Also, if it wouldn't cut into the vendors bottom line, there could be a place on the order form to choose what sample flavor they might like to try. It might be a good way to get rid of overstock or even to introduce a new flavor.
 

EleanorR

Vaping Master
ECF Veteran
Feb 9, 2011
7,619
22,002
Treasure Coast
No, they are different prices. "If it fits it ships." Different rates for different sizes.


This just in: if it fits it ships cats.jpg

Not a liquid, not flammable . . . perishable, OTOH . . . :p
 

Bukket5

Ultra Member
ECF Veteran
Verified Member
Apr 3, 2012
1,027
6,228
64
Anchorage
Vsummer, since there is a more formal area to neg a vendor, I didn't feel this was necessary here. I just wanted to get thoughts because, I remember when this happened to you, and you were {justifiably} very upset. I was very upset. But I decided to wait a few days, calm myself, and then give an objective account.

Since you had to do a similar cleanup, I do not have to tell you that I had to take a bucket of water down to my mailbox as it was pretty wet and sticky. After spending time doing that, I had to place the envelope into a garbage bag, carry it into the house, and start upacking slippery stuff piece by piece. Spent quite some time at the sink, during which time one bottle dropped out of my hand and broke so I lost all that juice.

TBinAZ, this is/was a top notch vendor. Or, so I thought. :)

vsummer, I did not feel that I had to whine too loudly to the vendor, once they saw the photos. :) Since they mix juice, it should have been obvious that this was not a good afternoon for me. (unfortunately, I now realize I should have flipped out....more on that later.....)

Mr. Mann, this was a $50+ juice order, w/a vendor I have spent approx $150 with in 1-1/2 months. The ejuice itself was bubble wrapped. (However, this still does not meet USPS requirements for mailing liquids.) What leaked was a large bottle of pure VG, which came in a large plastic bottle....that bottle was just thrown into the package unwrapped, and not sealed in any kind of liquid-proof baggie. The top flip spout was taped over with scotch tape/mailing tape, which as you know, once that hits gooey, slippery, greasy VG, is about as useful as nothin'.

I had also ordered a piece of hardware, which was also not wrapped, but thrown into that mailer, and of course, it arrived broken since it was knocking around against heavier items in an unpadded envelope.

Of note, I also did not hear directly from the owner of the company after I sent the photos. I heard from CS department who offered to re-send the plain VG and the hardware item that broke. I am still waiting for that since I did not receive tracking.

Since that bothered me, I wrote to the owner directly, merely inquiring if they saw the photos and knew of the situation. Apparently, yes. I received an "we're sorry, we haven't had that bottle leak before and I'm sending you a sample." As I said, I did not feel I had to explain to a juice mixer looking at those photos how much of my afternoon was wasted cleaning up this stuff. I did mention that since sink duty, all my labels were smeared, but there has been no offer to regenerate my order....or anything else. :(

And I'm sure your mailman also had to do some cleanup in his truck. Plus he didn't know he was handling nicotine. I'm impressed that it was even delivered to you. I would think they would have had the right to refuse to deliver it.

I'm sorry this happened to you. It's horrible having to clean up liquid spills and so much worse when it is through no fault of your own. Then to have broken hardware on top of it, just inexcusable. If I received a package in that condition I don't think I would even bother to clean it up. I would contact the vendor and ask for the whole order to be replaced. If they refused then I would post a negative review in the proper forum and demand a refund.

I did not know that you don't allow vendor bashing here. Nice to hear it.
 

Bronze

ECF Guru
Supporting Member
ECF Veteran
Verified Member
Aug 19, 2012
40,240
187,211
And I'm sure your mailman also had to do some cleanup in his truck. Plus he didn't know he was handling nicotine. I'm impressed that it was even delivered to you. I would think they would have had the right to refuse to deliver it.

I'm sorry this happened to you. It's horrible having to clean up liquid spills and so much worse when it is through no fault of your own. Then to have broken hardware on top of it, just inexcusable. If I received a package in that condition I don't think I would even bother to clean it up. I would contact the vendor and ask for the whole order to be replaced. If they refused then I would post a negative review in the proper forum and demand a refund.

I did not know that you don't allow vendor bashing here. Nice to hear it.

See post #489 on page 49.
 

Mr.Mann

ECF Guru
ECF Veteran
Verified Member
Dec 30, 2011
17,401
40,572
46
All over the place
I did not know that you don't allow vendor bashing here. Nice to hear it.

Bashing? NO! Informing? YES! The forum manager let us know that in a case this reprehensible, telling the vendors name would be, and should be considered a service to the rest of us. I always aired on the side of anonymity, but I gave quick re-thought to that approach. I will not, however, go back and rehash past issues just to out a vendor, but in the present and future, I will not hesitate to name names...of course, not in a bashing way, but an informative way.
 

Apptiger

Super Member
ECF Veteran
Aug 4, 2012
582
2,495
West Central Florida
I wish I had taken pictures of my last order from Wizard Labs. They would serve as an example of proper packaging for hazardous liquids. In fact I actually was slightly annoyed at how much work it took to get to the product :lol:

Ditto for Ahlusion. Most professional packaging in my somewhat limited vaping experience.
 

Racehorse

ECF Guru
ECF Veteran
Verified Member
Jul 12, 2012
11,230
28,272
USA midwest
And I'm sure your mailman also had to do some cleanup in his truck. Plus he didn't know he was handling nicotine.

I provided full disclosure that nicotine is not what leaked in the package. But that is really of no consequence {although I understand what you are saying ;)}.

USPS has strict regulations for shipping liquids, whether shampoo, gatorade, or patchouli oil. Part and parcel (no pun intended) of running a business that ships liquids is being competently aware of this, and ensuring that employees in your shipping department are intimately familiar with any and all regulations that apply to that task.

Because it directly affects how we receive (and hopefully continue to receive) vaping supplies.

At this juncture in the industry's lifecycle, anything less is akin to mixing juice in your kitchen sink, over chicken bones from last night's dinner.
 

Buggs5347

Ultra Member
ECF Veteran
Verified Member
Aug 12, 2012
2,450
3,143
Arizona
Not sure anyone has mentioned this. Email address/domain. For goodness sake get an email domain for your business. yourbus@gmail.com is not a good practice. customerserviceorsomething@yourbusiness.com is a good practice. And, be consistent. I received no less than 3 different email address domains from one vendor making my first purchase, between registration, confirmation of registration, order receipt & confirmation, shipping and shipping confirmation. Good thing I was checking my junk mail regularly at the time.
 

Racehorse

ECF Guru
ECF Veteran
Verified Member
Jul 12, 2012
11,230
28,272
USA midwest
it's a drag we have to buy insurance because the PO can't deliver pkgs correctly! maybe we should have a thread like this for them....... oh wait, they don't care! :facepalm:

They don't always get it right, but USPS processes approx. 600 million pieces of mail per day.
That is almost 200 billion pieces of mail per year.
They received "0" tax dollars for doing this, too.

Do you happen to know the percentage of that 200 billion which actually GETS DELIVERED? On time, and to your door?

I think it's become convenient and fashionable to blame USPS these days, which is too bad. Of course, vendors are free to use Fed Ex, UPS, and any other shipper they deem better. I know there are often options when you order for choosing another service on some checkouts.


I'm on a bookswap, and out of 400 pieces mailed, and another 300 mailed to me, only 2 didn't find their way over a 2 year time period.

Unless you are actually a business who ships and keeps track of these statistics, I think it is guess-work, at best, to make statements about the efficacy of USPS, JMHO.
 
Last edited:
Status
Not open for further replies.

Users who are viewing this thread