New vertical subtank occ coils

[jseah]

OK, now that I see how it's put together I know exactly how to take it apart without damaging the core components required for rebuilding it. You'll destroy the coil obviously, but since the plan is to rebuild it that shouldn't be a problem.

First, measure out the diameter of the round post Take a 2X4 piece of wood and drill a hole through it about 1/8th of an inch larger in diameter. Place the head assembly over the hole with the post in the hole. Then use a wooden dowel rod pushed through the top hole and upper o-ring and a hammer to tap out the post. Since it's only held in with friction this should knock the round post out without damaging the metal. It may be easier to do if you remove the bottom pin and use a pair of needle nose pliers to pull the coil and wicking out first.

Once you're done drill out a second hole in the wood the same diameter as the threaded part of the bottom section. This should allow you to place the bottom part into the hole and tap the square section back on using a plastic or rubber mallet without bending the bottom section. Using a small amount of juice as a lubricant may help make this part easier.


Now I'm interested in buying some of these coils just to see if I could rebuild one using nickel wire in the vertical coil configuration.

Yeah, I think I understand what you're getting at. A couple of things though.

1. The wooden dowel rod that you want to use to hammer down the top hole would need to fit perfectly inside, in order to catch the thin lip at the bottom to push out the core.

2. If that dowel is a tight fit in that top hole, you may damage the o-ring that is there to seal the chimney.

 

[Cloudmann]

OK, now that I see how it's put together I know exactly how to take it apart without damaging the core components required for rebuilding it. You'll destroy the coil obviously, but since the plan is to rebuild it that shouldn't be a problem.

First, measure out the diameter of the round post Take a 2X4 piece of wood and drill a hole through it about 1/8th of an inch larger in diameter. Place the head assembly over the hole with the post in the hole. Then use a wooden dowel rod pushed through the top hole and upper o-ring and a hammer to tap out the post. Since it's only held in with friction this should knock the round post out without damaging the metal. It may be easier to do if you remove the bottom pin and use a pair of needle nose pliers to pull the coil and wicking out first.

Once you're done drill out a second hole in the wood the same diameter as the threaded part of the bottom section. This should allow you to place the bottom part into the hole and tap the square section back on using a plastic or rubber mallet without bending the bottom section. Using a small amount of juice as a lubricant may help make this part easier.


Now I'm interested in buying some of these coils just to see if I could rebuild one using nickel wire in the vertical coil configuration.

Jumping back into this thread after a while... this process above is more or less what I did to rebuild...

As noted above, the heads are far easier to gut with the coil and wick removed. I pulled all of that out first. With all of that gone, the inner chamber doesn't have QUITE as much resistance pushing it against the outer chamber... notice that it's not a solid circle... those slots allow it to give a bit when the guts are removed. From there, I locked the head into some soft jaw vice grips and used a shaved dowel to push the inner chamber out, tapping it out with a hammer, gently. Rebuilding is pretty easy from here, so I won't get into recoiling and rewicking. Slide the chamber with rebuilt coil into the housing as far as it'll go by hand (not far at all, I'm afraid). Then I used soft jaw channel locks to ease it back in, working around the perimeter of the housing... takes a little while to do this. Then put your pin and grommet back in and trim your leads properly.

What a pain... but it's the only way I've been able to build ni200 vertical coils with these killer juice channels. None of my vertical builds in the older occ housings worked as well. I'm building down to 0.1 ohms for the nickel coils and they positively ROCK on my SX Mini M class at 520 degrees all day long. I've rebuilt kanthal coils at 0.3 ohms, too... quite nice.

 

[Completely Average]

Yeah, I think I understand what you're getting at. A couple of things though.

1. The wooden dowel rod that you want to use to hammer down the top hole would need to fit perfectly inside, in order to catch the thin lip at the bottom to push out the core.

2. If that dowel is a tight fit in that top hole, you may damage the o-ring that is there to seal the chimney.

Yes, I agree, it will definitely take some measuring and quite a bit of care to get it right without damaging that upper o-ring, but it can be done.

I thought about suggesting a metal punch to tap out the bottom section rather than a wooden dowel, but I'm not sure how soft the metal is and a metal punch may bend parts rather than remove the section, which we obviously don't want to do. However, if the metal is thick and strong enough working your way around that bottom ring with a metal punch would be safe for that top o-ring. It may be possible to drop a SS washer into the hole and lay it flat against the bottom to give you a wider surface to press against with the dowel. I would need to measure it though to see if the o-ring is wider than that bottom metal ring to know for sure though.

It looks to be a real PITA to rebuild, but it does look rebuildable.

 

[Cloudmann]

Yes, I agree, it will definitely take some measuring and quite a bit of care to get it right without damaging that upper o-ring, but it can be done.

I thought about suggesting a metal punch to tap out the bottom section rather than a wooden dowel, but I'm not sure how soft the metal is and a metal punch may bend parts rather than remove the section, which we obviously don't want to do. However, if the metal is thick and strong enough working your way around that bottom ring with a metal punch would be safe for that top o-ring. It may be possible to drop a SS washer into the hole and lay it flat against the bottom to give you a wider surface to press against with the dowel. I would need to measure it though to see if the o-ring is wider than that bottom metal ring to know for sure though.

It looks to be a real PITA to rebuild, but it does look rebuildable.

Right... I wasn't all that sure what a punch would do to the metal, so I chose to use a wooden dowel (oak, incidentally) instead and a little extra elbow grease. Once it's started, it comes out fairly easily... getting it started is the issue.

 

[KattMamma]

Well, it looks like rebuilding them is more trouble than it's worth.

I thought, well no biggie, if the coils are good and last a while, I'll be happy enough.

I just put the first one in my stm about 2-1/2 hrs ago. It is the nastiest thing I've ever tasted.

I keep hitting it and trying to not inhale it (impossible), thinking I'll work through the nasty taste, but it doesn't seem to be getting much better. I've got bad tasting coils from kanger before, but never any this bad. WTH?

I might try another one to see if it was a fluke. But I can guarantee if I buy another one and it tastes as bad as this one, I'm done. I'll never buy another kanger ANYTHING.

lol ok I feel better after the rant, but yeah, I'm still not happy about this foul taste. Has anyone else experienced this?

 

[Cloudmann]

Well, it looks like rebuilding them is more trouble than it's worth.

I thought, well no biggie, if the coils are good and last a while, I'll be happy enough.

I just put the first one in my stm about 2-1/2 hrs ago. It is the nastiest thing I've ever tasted.

I keep hitting it and trying to not inhale it (impossible), thinking I'll work through the nasty taste, but it doesn't seem to be getting much better. I've got bad tasting coils from kanger before, but never any this bad. WTH?

I might try another one to see if it was a fluke. But I can guarantee if I buy another one and it tastes as bad as this one, I'm done. I'll never buy another kanger ANYTHING.

lol ok I feel better after the rant, but yeah, I'm still not happy about this foul taste. Has anyone else experienced this?

Nope. My experience with the new coils has been completely positive... except for the whole rebuilding hassle. They ARE a bit tougher to prime and take a bit longer. Try priming the coil by dripping about 4 drops or so around the inner perimeter of the coil... do it intil you see the cotton channels getting wet and changing color. Then install it in a full tank and primer puff on the smallest air flow setting without firing the mod... maybe 5 to 10 hard, quick pulls. Then, let the tank sit upright for five minutes... attach it to a mod to make it easier.

Doing this (good advice for any tank and coil, btw), I've brought new life to the subtank... it wicks better and handles much thicker juices at higher wattage... somewhat better airflow and flavor, too.

Sounds like you had a burnt hit to me. Burn the cotton and that coil's done.

 

[KattMamma]

I primed it well...

So now it's been just over 4 hrs since I put this thing in and my juice is finally starting to taste like juice.

Since this didn't happen to you @Cloudmann I will assume it's not the norm. Hopefully I just got a bad one - a REALLY bad one.

 

[jseah]

I primed it well...

So now it's been just over 4 hrs since I put this thing in and my juice is finally starting to taste like juice.

Since this didn't happen to you @Cloudmann I will assume it's not the norm. Hopefully I just got a bad one - a REALLY bad one.

Sounds to me like the coil needed breaking in. I have noticed that from time to time. Yesterday I put in a new Atlantis nickel coil into my Triton and for the first 1/2 tank, the vape tasted metallic.

 

[KattMamma]

I've experience old-style coils that needed a bit of "break in" time. This wasn't like that.

I also got some foul tasting coils before, but never anything as foul as this. Well, maybe one... but I pulled it out and put another one in rather than trying to vape through it. I didn't have that luxury today - vape shop literally had 2 in stock the other day - I bought 'em both and gave one to hubby.

Probably a bad day at the plant, but it just sucks that it was my first experience with these.

I see rewicking some old coils in my near future lol.

 

[nyiddle]

I've experience old-style coils that needed a bit of "break in" time. This wasn't like that.

I also got some foul tasting coils before, but never anything as foul as this. Well, maybe one... but I pulled it out and put another one in rather than trying to vape through it. I didn't have that luxury today - vape shop literally had 2 in stock the other day - I bought 'em both and gave one to hubby.

Probably a bad day at the plant, but it just sucks that it was my first experience with these.

I see rewicking some old coils in my near future lol.

I think I know what you're talking about. I experienced some "papery taste" in a coil that took a solid refilling or two of the tank before it went away. Very odd, but I assume it has something to do with the type of cotton they're using.

They say it's Muji cotton.. Hopefully it's not some sketchy no-name substitute...

 

[KattMamma]

I think I know what you're talking about. I experienced some "papery taste" in a coil that took a solid refilling or two of the tank before it went away. Very odd, but I assume it has something to do with the type of cotton they're using.

They say it's Muji cotton.. Hopefully it's not some sketchy no-name substitute...

Well I've been vaping it about 8 hrs now. The nasty taste is pretty much gone, although I got a hint of it with my first vape this morning (when my taste buds are at their peak.)

I wish I knew what that taste comes from. It's so nasty it actually turns my stomach. If I'd had another coil to throw in the tank, I would have. It's only because it was my last coil that I fought through it.

I also feel like it's either something in the cotton, or the cotton itself. But that's just my speculation - it could have also been some contaminant on the metal.

Now I'm feeling like the juice taste is somewhat muted... I've had that happen during the "break in period" of some coils though, so we'll see if it improves.

I really hope this is a one-time experience with this foul taste, because these gigantic juice holes give me high hopes of trouble-free wicking of high vg juices. Right now I'm running something between 50-60vg because of all the wicking trouble I had with the old-style coils (and the higher pg definitely helped a lot!) I have some 70vg I plan to refill from, to see what happens.

 

[nyiddle]

Well I've been vaping it about 8 hrs now. The nasty taste is pretty much gone, although I got a hint of it with my first vape this morning (when my taste buds are at their peak.)

I wish I knew what that taste comes from. It's so nasty it actually turns my stomach. If I'd had another coil to throw in the tank, I would have. It's only because it was my last coil that I fought through it.

I also feel like it's either something in the cotton, or the cotton itself. But that's just my speculation - it could have also been some contaminant on the metal.

Now I'm feeling like the juice taste is somewhat muted... I've had that happen during the "break in period" of some coils though, so we'll see if it improves.

I really hope this is a one-time experience with this foul taste, because these gigantic juice holes give me high hopes of trouble-free wicking of high vg juices. Right now I'm running something between 50-60vg because of all the wicking trouble I had with the old-style coils (and the higher pg definitely helped a lot!) I have some 70vg I plan to refill from, to see what happens.

I've been keeping it 60VG-40PG or so (given my DIY eyeball measurements) and haven't had any troubles. I am not sure it'd keep up with a max VG juice to be completely honest. At the very least, you might need to take some primer hits in between actual hits.

 

[Scurvy Dog]

Hey there Y'all,
I'm new here, so the rules say I can't post a link.
I found a Youtube video where the guy gets a new Kanger OCC apart.
You can find it if you just Google "first look Kanger New Occ vertical coil rebuild LOOK". Its 5:04 long and the audio is TERRIBLE but you can see what he's doing. Which is using a hex key on the inside, grabbing the outside (with wire connector crimpers) and then hammering on the crimpers to push the larger body down and away from the base. The first size he tried was too small, and he went bigger (without saying what the next size was) but I tried it today using an M5 and it worked. I used the same wire crimpers and it did leave 2 round dents in the body. It might not matter, but I think you could minimize that with some channel locks and perhaps a thin rag. Also, the hex key was part of a fixed set, so the rest of the set made a base/platform, to hammer down/against)
Anyway, it came apart with no signs of damage.
I haven't built anything successfuly from scratch yet (other than to wick a coil on the RBA base), so I'm putting this info out so that I might be able to learn from experienced builders (what size of drill bit to coil on, etc).
Thanks for your contributions and insight.
SD

 

[Buddha~]

Hate to thread necro, but thought my photos from today might work well in this thread. I've gotten good at banging the new vert OCCs apart and putting them back together, but can't quite seem to get the wire type, gauge and twists right to hit below 1.0. Looks like 28agw, 7-8 wraps and is right on 14cm long, but that comes in around 1.8 ohms on kanthal A1.

 

[speedy_r6]

Hate to thread necro, but thought my photos from today might work well in this thread. I've gotten good at banging the new vert OCCs apart and putting them back together, but can't quite seem to get the wire type, gauge and twists right to hit below 1.0. Looks like 28agw, 7-8 wraps and is right on 14cm long, but that comes in around 1.8 ohms on kanthal A1. View attachment 500888 View attachment 500889
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You are probably having trouble with the correct wire because they are likely using NR-R-NR wire(non-resistance, resistance, non-resistance). Using NR-R-NR wire allows them to put in the amount of wire they need to be able to make the loops, but also only have as much resistance wire as they need to make the actual heating part of the coil. Essentially, the legs will be non-resistance wire, and the part of the coil that actually needs to heat up will be resistance wire. If you look at the wire you pulled out, you can see a distinctly different color in the middle. It is a different color exactly between where there are two "welds" in the wire. The shiny wire is the non-resistance. The darker wire is the resistance wire. The little blobs are the "weld" that fused the non-resistance wire on the ends to the resistance wire in the middle.

 

[Buddha~]

You are probably having trouble with the correct wire because they are likely using NR-R-NR wire(non-resistance, resistance, non-resistance).

Sweet hoppin hallelujah!! That would explain the two bumps I feel around a middle section of the wire. I even hooked it up on the RBA deck and dry fired the wire, and SAW that the center section only heated. I'm an idjit.

Thanks, speedy! I shall now stop searching for wire that is 1.2 ohms/ft and is sold with unicorns. How hard would it be to dupe that wire, I wonder? [edit: nvm, found the thread on here...]

 

[classwife]

Moved this to Clearomizers

 

[Sighlense]

Anyone know of a good place to purchase the older style with the pop off press fit? I would like to have the option to build the vertical style coil and not have a problem getting the cotton in.

 

[Buddha~]

Anyone know of a good place to purchase the older style with the pop off press fit? I would like to have the option to build the vertical style coil and not have a problem getting the cotton in.

The cotton is actually pretty simple to get into these new ones. Only thing holding me back is building some NR-R-NR wire so I don't burn up the rubber grommet insulator on the bottom.

Not sure if anyone is selling the old ones online. I was able to get a few from a local B&M.

 

[philbh]

Broke first one trying. Big thanks to all who helped figure this out.