FDA Public Health?

[Will273]

Really? Sorry...having a hard time getting past the FDA's concern about Public Health when cigarettes are sitting on store shelves making big money for big tobacco. I'd hold that to the FDA like a hot poker every time they mention public health and there's no need to go further than that...assuming that's what it's about.

As long as cigarettes are allowed and not banned the FDA has no right and no room to even mention public health...it's utter classic insanity and for the life of me can't understand how they can do what they're doing. It scares me to think this insanity can't be overcome...some how some way. It's madness...having that mentality controlling the public...the FDA and the government needs an overhaul. Bottom line is this is "NOT" about public health!

After thinking about it...it has to be BS...this can't be for real...the FDA has to blowing smoke for whatever reason and they can't really go through with this...even though they can and might. It can not be allowed...period! If it is then this country has bigger problems than vaping regulations.

 

[Rossum]

The FDA does not have the power to ban or even regulate any tobacco product that was on the market in February of 2007. The Tobacco Control Act (referred to by some as the Marlboro Protection Act) specifically prohibits them from doing so.

Bans are never the answer. Did Prohibition end alcohol consumption? Has the war on (some) drugs ended the use of those drugs? The only thing a ban will accomplish is to create a black market for the product in question, and that has many negative consequences.

 

[Will273]

Well I'm missing something then...so we're all home free and everything's good? You'll have to excuse me...I don't always dot my "i"'s and cross my "T"s and I'm not POLITICALLY CORRECT!!!

 

[dobroeutro]

Well, they do have the power to regulate "tobacco products"and unfortunately the way they're attempting to regulate vaping will likely equal a ban. Hopefully the lawsuits, HR 2058, Cole-Bishop Amendment or common sense will prevail, but I'm not optimistic that will be the case. Regardless, I've stocked up on everything likely to be affected for 15+ years & the gubmint can "kiss ol' rusty"...

 

[Will273]

Dobroeutro...I don't call what the FDA is doing "regulating"...it's closer to "rape". Also let's nip this in the bud real quick...there is no common sense involved...other than that I agree 100%. Yea the FDA can kiss my donkey too. Thanks man.

 

[retired1]

Let's back off the extreme language please. While we fully understand what you're saying, let's try to choose another word other than rape.

Thank you.

 

[Rossum]

Well, they do have the power to regulate "tobacco products"and unfortunately the way they're attempting to regulate vaping will likely equal a ban.

Again, the FDA only has the authority to regulate tobacco products that were not available in in February of 2007. Everything that was available on that magic date is "Grandfathered". Unfortunately, all modern vaping products were introduced after that date, which is why the FDA is able to "regulate" all vaping products currently on the market, but they cannot touch most cigarettes.

 

[Will273]

Seems the FDA would be able to get their hands all over cigarettes...seeing and knowing how "concerned" they are about public health.

 

[retired1]

Seems the FDA would be able to get their hands all over cigarettes...seeing and knowing how "concerned" they are about public health.

They can't. Congress specifically prohibited them from doing so.

 

[Will273]

Well how does Congress allow them to do what they're doing to e cigs and vaping yet cigarettes are perfectly legal...please don't mention any dates...cigarettes have been around longer and dates have nothing to do with them or public health.

All I can see is slapping a health and under age warning on vaping products and be done with it...anything more is insanity unless the same is applied to tobacco cigarettes. I mean this whole discussion is insane...it makes no sense and I'm not sure what I'm talking about half the time...e cigs are a health problem and real tobacco is not? Slice it dice it any way you want...wrap it up in anything but it doesn't change the facts or make cigarettes safer than vaping. This is something only fools would come up with and I don't understand how lawyers don't hold the FDA to it...put a hot poker to the FDA and force them to explain how cigarettes are better for public health than vaping and keep cigarettes off the market until they do explain...after all we're talking about public heath right?

Yea I know...I'm missing the point huh...I'm missing something somewhere....it's about public health...no it's not...yes it is...no it's not. They're coming to take me a way ha ha he he ho ho...to the funny farm where life is beautiful all the time....

 

[sofarsogood]

I use the term "public health" to refer to the people in that line of work. I use the term "public's health" to refer to our well being. I make that distinction because the two have nothng in common.

 

[DC2]

Well how does Congress allow them to do what they're doing to e cigs and vaping yet cigarettes are perfectly legal...please don't mention any dates...

It's a long story.

The FSPTCA was passed by Congress.
It prevents the FDA from getting rid of cigarettes or reducing nicotine content to zero.
This is because of money, and money, and because of money.

After that, electronic cigarettes came along.
And screwed everything up.

Now the powers that be are just playing catch-up with the changing tide.
Basically by trying to eliminate or take over that which threatens their money.

And there's so much more than the simple summary above.
But yeah, here we are.

 

[Will273]

DC2...Yea I know it's a long story...no it's not...yes it is but it's really not. It's simple and short but the FDA makes it long to confuse people and seem more complex than it really is...that's where the insanity comes in...should be obvious to everyone...the FDA needs to be stopped in their tracks when they try to complicate it further....that's when I'd stick 'em with the hot poker...every time they say something...they wouldn't say much around me and they'd be likely to just let everything go...depending on how much they like hot pokers. Thanks for the heads-up.

 

[DC2]

My hot poker has been sitting in the fireplace for a long time now.
But no FDA people ever show up around here.

 

[mcclintock]

If you're suggesting they ban smoking tobacco, you never learned the lessons of prohibition. But perhaps they think they can kill vaping before it gets too popular.

I'm not sure they're really trying to ban vaping as much as put it under their tight control. It's not that they think it doesn't have potential, only that it's no good if they don't have their hands in it. Meanwhile, people have become comfortable thinking about what's best for other people without concern for having any right to control others, so few ask the essential question of freedom.

 

[Deepjazz]

I think the main problem with vaping is how popular it is.. everyone is vaping.. when i say everyone people that never smoked are now vaping and hooked on nicotine.. you never seen this high growt in smokers in last 40-50 years as you have seen on vapers in just last 2 years.. people think it's 100% harmless so they think why not try it, problem with is once you get hooked on the nicotine there is no way back.. if you cant get eliquid u will end up buying cigarettes and it's truth.. we all talk about us previous smokers going off cigarettes but we totally forget the fact vaping is getting people that never smoked and would never ever smoked because they know it dangerous to start vaping because they read everywhere it's perfectly safe.

so now look at this from this side of view and tell me they dont need to make rules about this before everyone in the world will be vaping and hooked on nicotine because it's as safe as drinking water?

 

[nomore stinkies]

I think the main problem with vaping is how popular it is.. everyone is vaping.. when i say everyone people that never smoked are now vaping and hooked on nicotine.. you never seen this high growt in smokers in last 40-50 years as you have seen on vapers in just last 2 years.. people think it's 100% harmless so they think why not try it, problem with is once you get hooked on the nicotine there is no way back.. if you cant get eliquid u will end up buying cigarettes and it's truth.. we all talk about us
previous smokers going off cigarettes but we totally forget o now look at this from this side of view and tell me they dont need to make rules about this before everyone in the world will be vaping and hooked on nicotine because it's as safe as drinking water?

WHAT?? You really must stop reading Stanton's "scientific" studies.

 

[Whitewolf2014]

I think the main problem with vaping is how popular it is.. everyone is vaping.. when i say everyone people that never smoked are now vaping and hooked on nicotine.. you never seen this high growt in smokers in last 40-50 years as you have seen on vapers in just last 2 years.. people think it's 100% harmless so they think why not try it, problem with is once you get hooked on the nicotine there is no way back.. if you cant get eliquid u will end up buying cigarettes and it's truth.. we all talk about us previous smokers going off cigarettes but we totally forget the fact vaping is getting people that never smoked and would never ever smoked because they know it dangerous to start vaping because they read everywhere it's perfectly safe.

so now look at this from this side of view and tell me they dont need to make rules about this before everyone in the world will be vaping and hooked on nicotine because it's as safe as drinking water?

You might want to take a look at this.
The Great Nicotine Myth

Here is just one of the points from that link.

"Nicotine, by itself, has no observed potential for dependence. That is to say, pure nicotine administered to never-smokers or never-users of tobacco in clinical trials is not demonstrated to create dependence. Just to make this clear:
a) Not a single one of the many clinical trials of pure nicotine administered to never-smokers, for investigation of its potential benefits in multiple clinical areas, report that any subject ever exhibited any sign of reinforcement, dependence, withdrawal syndrome or continued use - despite subjects being given high doses for months.
b) Nicotine cannot be shown to create dependence; in every clinical trial published, no reinforcement or dependence was demonstrated.
c) Dependence on nicotine has never been demonstrated in those not exposed to tobacco use in some form.
d) There are no published clinical trials that report dependence is observed when nicotine is administered to never-smokers. All such trials for investigation of nicotine's nutritional and medical value report no observed measure of dependence, withdrawal symptoms, or continuation of use - no matter how much is administered or for how long."

 

[mcclintock]

I think the main problem with vaping is how popular it is.. everyone is vaping.. when i say everyone people that never smoked are now vaping and hooked on nicotine.. you never seen this high growt in smokers in last 40-50 years as you have seen on vapers in just last 2 years.. people think it's 100% harmless so they think why not try it, problem with is once you get hooked on the nicotine there is no way back.. if you cant get eliquid u will end up buying cigarettes and it's truth.. we all talk about us previous smokers going off cigarettes but we totally forget the fact vaping is getting people that never smoked and would never ever smoked because they know it dangerous to start vaping because they read everywhere it's perfectly safe.

so now look at this from this side of view and tell me they dont need to make rules about this before everyone in the world will be vaping and hooked on nicotine because it's as safe as drinking water?

I'm still seeing at least 20 people smoking for every time I see someone vaping. It's still high growth -- but only because it started at zero fairly recently.

Non smokers that try vaping often use no nicotine or very low nicotine. But all purified nicotine is less effective and far less addicting. Some critics are concerned that it will become more popular than smoking is now and they may be right, because it's a better product than cigarettes. If it becomes that popular, it won't be near as much because of its addictiveness, but for other reasons. Of course, many of said critics also seem to believe the end of smoking is near, which is a fantasy.

I had a friend stop vaping recently. He just noticed himself forgetting to vape.

I agree that SOME people will switch to smoking if they can't get anything to vape. Even one person is too many.

 

[skoony]

Yea I know...I'm missing the point huh...I'm missing something somewhere....it's about public health...no it's not...yes it is...no it's not. They're coming to take me a way ha ha he he ho ho...to the funny farm where life is beautiful all the time....

You won't be going alone. Move over I'm coming with.
Mike