The Muffin Man and The Milk Man - Company's response to Diacetyl, Acetoin or Acetyl Propionyl

[emolinare]

I've contacted One Hit Wonder (onehitwondereliquid.com) who makes the The Muffin Man and The Milk Man e-juice and asked them if these two products contain Diacetyl, Acetoin or Acetyl Propionyl. These compounds are known to cause deadly 'popcorn' lung disease and two of these products appear to be a one of the best selling brands nowadays.

This is the answer I've received from One Hit Wonder:
"Hello, thank you for contacting us. No we can assure you that our juice flavors do not contain any harmful chemicals when inhaled. We vape on our juice all day long and would not expose our customers to these chemicals. Thank you for your concern and let us know if we can help you further. Thank you."

I am going to follow up, asking them to send me a GC/MS Analysis of these products. Let's see if they can provide this to me. I'll keep you updated.

 

[emolinare]

Following is my response to their email:

----
Thank you for getting back to me so quickly.

While it is good to be re-assured, I'd like to see some sort of an analysis behind your claim, rather than just saying: 'We vape on our juice all day long and would not expose our customers to these chemicals.'

Please forward onto me the results of GC/MS Analysis for the The Muffin Man and The Milk Man e-liquid products.
If possible, I would expect to see something similar to Diacetyl and Acetyl Propionyl testing that was recently done on Suicide Bunny's (Sucker Punch and Mother's Milk):


Your response is eagerly awaited.

----

I'll keep you posted.

 

[Icemanxxxv]

Just ask them if they are members of AEMSA or go to AESMA web site and see what manufacturers are members.

 

[emolinare]

Just ask them if they are members of AEMSA or go to AESMA web site and see what manufacturers are members.

Doesn't seem like a standard yet, only handful of members are listed on their site: MEMBERS | AEMSA
But what a great idea!

 

[skoony]

I've contacted One Hit Wonder (onehitwondereliquid.com) who makes the The Muffin Man and The Milk Man e-juice and asked them if these two products contain Diacetyl, Acetoin or Acetyl Propionyl. These compounds are known to cause deadly 'popcorn' lung disease and two of these products appear to be a one of the best selling brands nowadays.

This is the answer I've received from One Hit Wonder:
"Hello, thank you for contacting us. No we can assure you that our juice flavors do not contain any harmful chemicals when inhaled. We vape on our juice all day long and would not expose our customers to these chemicals. Thank you for your concern and let us know if we can help you further. Thank you."

I am going to follow up, asking them to send me a GC/MS Analysis of these products. Let's see if they can provide this to me. I'll keep you updated.

if these things concern you so much get your own analysis.
diacetyl,aceoin and acetyl propionyl are not none to cause
popcorn lung. the are suspected of being linked
to popcorn lung.
with less than 30 cases of popcorn lung having been ever
reported except for 2 recent cases in Texas there hasn't
been a reported case since the early 2000's. all but
one is industry related. all industry workers had an extensive
smoking history. taken all together the cases are statistically
meaningless when compared to the total amount of workers
in the industry exposed to these chemicals,let alone when
compared to the total population.
so if you want to start another tempest in a teapot,
how about footing the bill yourself.
regards
mike

 

[Robino1]

You may paraphrase the response you get in the email but you cannot post the email on the forum.

Thanks!

 

[440BB]

if these things concern you so much get your own analysis.

Disapprove of someone even asking a vendor if they have any test results?

I think anybody who has this concern should just ask. The more information the better.

 

[skoony]

Disapprove of someone even asking a vendor if they have any test results?

I think anybody who has this concern should just ask. The more information the better.

i am not disapproving.
if you need to know just ask or test it yourself.
whats the point of this post?
i so no need to be informed one is contacting a vendor.
is the OP trying to invent a controversy?
there are plenty of vendors that are testing their
products and will gladly show you the results.
i for one would assume if is nothing on their website
indicating otherwise the chemicals in question are
probably being used and move on.
as the OP never indicated a desire to actually use
these products it appears to me he is off on a fishing
trip of some sort. i wonder what he is trying to catch.
its an odd post to say the least.
regards
mike

 

[440BB]

Assuming one vapes or wants to try a particular liquid or brand, I see asking as perfectly fine. If not, I agree it isn't necessary. At this point, most of the thousands of vendors probably would give a similar answer.

I am hopeful that those vendors that have tested their products show the results on their sites to save those concerned a lot of time having to ask. Even with disclaimers about uncertainty between batches, after steeping and all, it would be useful for some of us.

 

[serene.in.dallas]

Imo you came off as rude and demanding.

 

[sparkky1]

You can pretty much bank on the use of diketones in a ice cream / milk flavoring. please us your own judgement to make a risk assessment on whether or not you'd like to consume this molecule.

 

[xtwosm0kesx]

if these things concern you so much get your own analysis.
diacetyl,aceoin and acetyl propionyl are not none to cause
popcorn lung. the are suspected of being linked
to popcorn lung.
with less than 30 cases of popcorn lung having been ever
reported except for 2 recent cases in Texas there hasn't
been a reported case since the early 2000's. all but
one is industry related. all industry workers had an extensive
smoking history. taken all together the cases are statistically
meaningless when compared to the total amount of workers
in the industry exposed to these chemicals,let alone when
compared to the total population.
so if you want to start another tempest in a teapot,
how about footing the bill yourself.
regards
mike

i am not disapproving.
if you need to know just ask or test it yourself.
whats the point of this post?
i so no need to be informed one is contacting a vendor.
is the OP trying to invent a controversy?
there are plenty of vendors that are testing their
products and will gladly show you the results.
i for one would assume if is nothing on their website
indicating otherwise the chemicals in question are
probably being used and move on.
as the OP never indicated a desire to actually use
these products it appears to me he is off on a fishing
trip of some sort. i wonder what he is trying to catch.
its an odd post to say the least.
regards
mike

The onus is not on the consumer to prove a product is safe, that is the manufacturers responsibility.

The fact that you're attacking someone for asking for clarification of what's in a companie's juice is further proof how detached from reality you are. He is well within his rights to ask for the information.

"It's totally safe dude, we vape it all day!!!!!!" is not a legitimate answer regarding safety and never will be.

If you manufacture juice you should have the testing done, and the results should be made public. PERIOD.

Allowing vendors to exist behind a veil of secrecy will be the death of the e-liquid industry.

 

[skoony]

The onus is not on the consumer to prove a product is safe, that is the manufacturers responsibility.

The fact that you're attacking someone for asking for clarification of what's in a companie's juice is further proof how detached from reality you are. He is well within his rights to ask for the information.

"It's totally safe dude, we vape it all day!!!!!!" is not a legitimate answer regarding safety and never will be.

If you manufacture juice you should have the testing done, and the results should be made public. PERIOD.

Allowing vendors to exist behind a veil of secrecy will be the death of the e-liquid industry.

I am not attacking the OP.
where do you come up with that?
I am a little confused as to the point of
the OP´s post. he doesn't appear to be wanting
to make a purchase.
if he´s interested in similar flavors there are plenty
of vendors supplying test results to meet everyone's
needs.
I see no need at this time for all vendors to be
testing for anything as nothing about vaping has
been proven to cause harm as of yet.
if one is concerned there is no need to go
looking for perceived skulldugery.
there something for all us vapors.
regards
mike

 

[Mazinny]

I am not attacking the OP.
where do you come up with that?
I am a little confused as to the point of
the OP´s post. he doesn't appear to be wanting
to make a purchase.
if he´s interested in similar flavors there are plenty
of vendors supplying test results to meet everyone's
needs.
I see no need at this time for all vendors to be
testing for anything as nothing about vaping has
been proven to cause harm as of yet.
if one is concerned there is no need to go
looking for perceived skulldugery.
there something for all us vapors.
regards
mike

Is it possible that you are not confused at all, just pretending to be confused so you can repeat the same things over and over ? For someone who claims not be concerned about these compounds, you certainly seem obsessed about the topic judging by the number of posts you have made in these threads. Just ignore these threads and you will find a lot more free time to post in other threads or engage in other hobbies . Just a thought !

 

[Will P.C.]

Well if I was the owner of a juice company, I would test everything I sale. The main reason is that it is a major selling point these days. So to be able to post gc/ms results on my website and say I am XYZ free would be worth the cost. Such a no brainer. Frankly, I am surprised more companies do not test. Makes me wonder how amateur some of these premium companies really are.

 

[Mazinny]

Well if I was the owner of a juice company, I would test everything I sale. The main reason is that it is a major selling point these days. So to be able to post gc/ms results on my website and say I am XYZ free would be worth the cost. Such a no brainer. Frankly, I am surprised more companies do not test. Makes me wonder how amateur some of these premium companies really are.

As it was proven in Five Pawns case, i suspect a lot of vendors have actually done the testing and did not deem the results fit for publication. Fact is lots of consumers love the taste of these compounds. Another fact is that the majority of consumers are not aware of the issue and it's not good for the bottom line of vendors who use these types of flavorings to publish test results or even do the testing.

Many vendors and many ECF members do not like discussion on this topic for various reasons.

 

[skoony]

Is it possible that you are not confused at all, just pretending to be confused so you can repeat the same things over and over ? For someone who claims not be concerned about these compounds, you certainly seem obsessed about the topic judging by the number of posts you have made in these threads. Just ignore these threads and you will find a lot more free time to post in other threads or engage in other hobbies . Just a thought !

obsessed?
I am not obsessed any more than anyone else.
why do you assume I am obsessed but,others with
an obsession for their personal quest for safety whom
deem it necessary to force their standards on every
thing e-cig related?
why must this forum be a party to what appears to
be the start of another which hunt when there are
more than enough choices to make everyone happy?
regards
mike

 

[Mazinny]

obsessed?
I am not obsessed any more than anyone else.
why do you assume I am obsessed but,others with
an obsession for their personal quest for safety whom
deem it necessary to force their standards on every
thing e-cig related?
why must this forum be a party to what appears to
be the start of another which hunt when there are
more than enough choices to make everyone happy?
regards
mike

Maybe because you have made numerous posts in numerous threads repeating some variation of you your first post in this thread ? And all on an issue that according to you is a non-issue. Common sense really.

 

[skoony]

Maybe because you have made numerous posts in numerous threads repeating some variation of you your first post in this thread ? And all on an issue that according to you is a non-issue. Common sense really.

and the others that have a different opinion have not?
a non-issue? that depends on your definition.
apparently your missing my issue here.
my issue concerning this post is its no longer
necessary to go fishing for another witch hunt
when there are sufficient resources available for
everyone to be happy.
in summation what you are saying is everyone
but me gets to toot their horn
regards
mike

 

[Mazinny]

and the others that have a different opinion have not?
a non-issue? that depends on your definition.
apparently your missing my issue here.
my issue concerning this post is its no longer
necessary to go fishing for another witch hunt
when there are sufficient resources available for
everyone to be happy.
in summation what you are saying is everyone
but me gets to toot their horn
regards
mike

Where's the witch hunt ? The op asked a vendor if their product contains DA/AP. Vendor responded that their product doesn't contain any harmful ingredients, not responding directly to the question. The op followed up with an email asking if they have test results. Where is the harm in that ?
Why are you stating that the op is senseless ? Just laugh it off if you think diketones in e liquid is a non-issue.

Clearly you are pretending not to understand my point again ! We have gone through this on the VS thread that you repeatedly derailed until i was forced to close it. Remember ?

If i don't care whether a product contains lead for example, i wouldn't constantly post in a thread discussing lead in various products and repeatedly downplay the 'supposed' danger of lead. I would just let the people who care have their discussion and i would go to a thread that discusses my concerns. That is unless my interests where allied to the lead vendors interest for example, or i had another agenda.

Just saying !

And clearly you know that i'm not saying what you re-stated my argument as . You are a lot smarter than you pretend to be.