I feel like crying. This is absolutely horrifying and maddening. I have a feeling that the FDA has been sitting and watching to see how this plays out. When the dust settles, then they will show their hand.
This world is so screwed....
EU TPD vote: Europe has fallen - Big Money has triumphed
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I feel like crying. This is absolutely horrifying and maddening. I have a feeling that the FDA has been sitting and watching to see how this plays out. When the dust settles, then they will show their hand.
This world is so screwed....
Liquid nic sales will be taking a huge jump I bet. May be a lot of running out soon so better stock up folks.
It its most fundamental form, this is nothing more than other human beings TELLING YOU how to live your life. Think of it in those terms and tell me how this squares with human rights.
"Human rights" is just a tag line used as an excuse to invade an oil rich region that can be bullied. Freedom is a nicely wrapped lie that pacifies the masses. The nannies know better than us, just watch the news and they'll tell you so.
Yes that is pretty much what it comes down to at the end of the day. I have to say that firstly, I have read up a lot on potential e-cig regulation but my knowledge is still limited compared to some others. However, I was not particularly surprised by today's ruling, I was pretty much expecting it. Not because I was being defeatist but because another fundamental truth is that almost by definition legal processes will generally work to the advantage of the establishment that controls them. That point is especially true when it comes to law making. We all know that the establishment as a whole favours tobacco and nicotine cessation over tobacco harm-control. Its also pretty much a given that they will listen to and accommodate the interests of multi-billion pound tobacco corporations and pharmaceutical companies over consumers and far smaller businesses in the e-cig trade.
I hope that there is some way to defeat this legislation in the courts and I'm not saying its impossible just that such things are generally very difficult. I think public protests and raising awareness would go along way as I'm sure a lot of people that use e-cigs don't understand how this will affect them if they are even aware of it at all. I went into a local B&M shop recently and the bloke that ran the shop was actually in favour of the legislation because of safety! I only discussed the regulation of e-liquid with him but I don't think he had a clue about how this could potentially affect his business.
This sent chills up my spine
"The new Directive includes strong measures against illicit trade of tobacco products to ensure that only products complying with the Directive are sold in the EU. It introduces an EU-wide tracking and tracing system for the legal supply chain and visible and invisible security features (e.g. holograms) which should facilitate law enforcement and help authorities and consumers detect illicit products. The measures foreseen in the new Directive will help to redirect tobacco trade to legal channels, and may also help Member States restore lost revenue."
Yup. All about the revenue.
"The new Directive includes strong measures against illicit trade of tobacco products to ensure that only products complying with the Directive are sold in the EU. It introduces an EU-wide tracking and tracing system for the legal supply chain and visible and invisible security features (e.g. holograms) which should facilitate law enforcement and help authorities and consumers detect illicit products. The measures foreseen in the new Directive will help to redirect tobacco trade to legal channels, and may also help Member States restore lost revenue."
Yup. All about the revenue.
The sad and true fact.
Europe has fallen indeed but, we don't surrender.
Payback time!
I will start in next EU elections.
Keep strong and vape on!
I just got on the internet for the first time today. Of course, my first stop was ecf...and I find this. A depressing start to the day.
At least the European Parliament admitted that "they (e-cigarettes) may have a role to play in smoking cessation or reduction".
We are looking into it.
Especially when the time comes for the EU member states to incorporate this drivel into national law.
I'm a little confused about three things. [ This thread sought to at least ask some of those Qs, but it didn't appear to go anywhere http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...would-ban-flavor-labeling-ecigs-e-liquid.html ]
Refillable cartridges containing nicotine of up to 2ml will be allowed (allegedly, unless a member state decides on a more restrictive rule), but this doesn't appear to affect devices, right? As long as a device like a tankomizer (etc.) is sold w/o being filled, it's not explicitly banned by the TPD?
Will unflavored 2% e-juice sales still be allowed (effectively nic. juice right)?
Finally (and this is a broader Q of EU governance that I don't really understand) ... what happens if a member state just decides that it won't enforce the rules? After all, it's not as if Maastrict made much of a diffo., as far as I can tell - just as one ex. Although that was a long time ago.
Refillable cartridges containing nicotine of up to 2ml will be allowed (allegedly, unless a member state decides on a more restrictive rule), but this doesn't appear to affect devices, right? As long as a device like a tankomizer (etc.) is sold w/o being filled, it's not explicitly banned by the TPD?
Will unflavored 2% e-juice sales still be allowed (effectively nic. juice right)?
Finally (and this is a broader Q of EU governance that I don't really understand) ... what happens if a member state just decides that it won't enforce the rules? After all, it's not as if Maastrict made much of a diffo., as far as I can tell - just as one ex. Although that was a long time ago.
No its the actual volume of the device that's restricted (presumably its volume in relation to e-liquid and not empty space):
Updated info post: TPD provisions relating to e-cigarettes « The counterfactual
Can't see why it wouldn't be allowed if its no more than 20mg/ml / 2%.
No idea
So the bottom line is that an empty cartomizer, tankomizer, etc. is an "e-cigarette" for purposes of Art 18. In fact anything that can vaporize a liquid and which can be hand-held would be considered that? (As long as it wasn't a medical device?) Even a kit that the customer can use to build a MOD themselves? Can they ban batteries, too? (Etc.)
This is where I'm confused, because I thought that to be subject to 18, something had to contain nicotine as sold by the manufacturer. Am I wrong about that?
You are correct, Roger_Lafayette:
They have defined each and every part of an e-cig to be an "e-cigarette" to be covered under this unspeakable directive.
Well, they cannot ban batteries. But cartomizers, atomizers, anything.
It is like saying a wheel is banned because it is a "car".
They have defined each and every part of an e-cig to be an "e-cigarette" to be covered under this unspeakable directive.
Well, they cannot ban batteries. But cartomizers, atomizers, anything.
It is like saying a wheel is banned because it is a "car".
Ya know, if they made atomizers and mods that used existing connector technology, like maybe those commonly used in flashlights...
So yeah basically I think all parts of the e-cig are covered by the term for the purpose of the directive. The only thing that I think escapes it is nic free liquid. (EDIT: sorry didn't see your last post Anjaffm)
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Been off the boards and twitter for awhile due in part to just how depressing it is to watch those put in positions to protect the citizens become the ones we need protection from. This is a bad day but not the last day. Vapers need support those that support them oppose those that attack and inform those still willing to listen but under no circumstances except this.
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