vanilla extract?

Discussion in 'DIY E-Liquid' started by raggedclaws, Apr 13, 2009.

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  1. raggedclaws

    raggedclaws Full Member

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    I've been reading the posts by SunVapor and others here about the difficulty in creating a DIY vanilla e-juice. I don't think I saw anyone mention trying pure vanilla extract (the stuff you find in the baking section of a grocery store). I'm sure there must be a reason nobody uses this stuff. I'm just wondering why not.

    Kim
     
  2. cosican

    cosican Super Member ECF Veteran

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    Hey KIm All I know is!!! NO!! tried it!! about 3 months back, and I still can smell it!! Plus the smell on the atomizer, never went away
    Unless I did not mix correctly, I also attempted a coconut extract flavoring and that was worse
    Good luck
     
  3. Sun Vaporer

    Sun Vaporer Moved On ECF Veteran

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    Kim--I have tryed from the cheapest to the best money can but (burbon bean vanilla extract---all to no avail as there either is very little vanilla taste or there is way to strong an alcohol taste that takes away from any flavor (36%)--Yicks!! So the quest goes on!!! If you have any ideas, let us know!!! I would love to know what the manufacutes are using!!! Thanks, Sun
     
  4. pagn8or

    pagn8or Full Member

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    I like my vanilla extract just fine. I use the Wilton (or Walton?, I don't have it with me) clear vanilla extract. Picked it because it didn't have a long ingredient list or obvious sugars (wouldn't be surprised if it has some in the "natural flavorings" though).

    I'm sure others have used it, so I guess my tastes just differ. I've been getting CaSh Cola 24mg and cutting it in half with glycerine, then adding a dash of vanilla. Mmm. Vanilla Coke.
     
  5. kinabaloo

    kinabaloo Vaping Master ECF Veteran

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    I find the grocery store vanilla extract (Dr Oetker/Supercook) to have a great flavor. It's not especially strong though.

    The artificial vanilla flavor (often referred to as vanillin) is a benzaldehyde which some feel presents a health hazard, although there is debate on the matter. Safety (MSDS) data for vanillin
     
  6. raggedclaws

    raggedclaws Full Member

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    Was that Wilton extract the same stuff you find on grocery store shelves, or is it a specialty flavoring for e-juice? I definitely don't want to "pollute" my atomizer so I'll refrain from using this stuff until some others post with favorable experience. Thanks for the heads-up and info you guys.

    Kim
     
  7. pagn8or

    pagn8or Full Member

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    I found the Wilton in a craft store near the bakery stuff, so yeah, grocery store. From what I've been reading, even the LorAnns that many people use is just cooking flavoring. The key seems to be to find stuff that won't clog the atomizer, and the clear extract seemed like a good idea. And it's Kosher - woo hoo - eh... whatever.

    After checking out a post today that showed a bunch of different e-juices that had been cooked on a spoon to show what was left after it vaporized I've decided I'm going to give that a try with the extract when I get home. If it looks like it leaves a lot of residue, or it's particularly sticky or something, I may look for something new.
     
  8. analog2digital

    analog2digital Full Member ECF Veteran

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    I have been using McCormick French Vanilla Blend from Walmart. the #2 ingredient is Propylene Glycol, and Alcohol (16%). I like the strong vanilla flavor and have preferred this so far, although, the only commercial product I have tried yet is Johnson Creek Vanilla Ice Cream. The F Vanilla extract is so good my mouth is watering, which, is much more than I can say for the JC.

    I have been using this in my DSE901 and Joye510. Honestly, I am not sure of the recipe, as it has been ad-hoc. I have had best results with the Totally Wicked 11mg Mnethol with the vanilla extract, but, I just add the vanilla until I get the desired taste, and have not really measured it out yet.
     
  9. cosican

    cosican Super Member ECF Veteran

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    Allow me to stay on this "blend" for a moment
    Is the Walmart blend an IMITATION extract?? or?? pure extract
    I see the imitations have PG alcohol and water, so that appears to be able to work I wonder if the pure extracts are not as suitable for us
     
  10. analog2digital

    analog2digital Full Member ECF Veteran

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    I assume it uses some artificial, as others say 'extract'. I will put what the label has on it:

    "French Vanilla Blend with other natural Flavors.
    INGREDIENTS: Water, Propylene Glycol, Alcohol (16%), Vanilla Extract, Vanillin, Caramel Color, and Natural Flavors."

    I assume the Vanillin would be the artificial stuff. I have been using this about a month and have not had any problems, but I have cleaned my atomizers in boiling water a couple of times.

    I don't know if it is good or bad, but I prefer the flavor so far. Hope this helps.
     
  11. analog2digital

    analog2digital Full Member ECF Veteran

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    btw, the McCormick is the brand name. I just happened to purchase it at Walmart.
     
  12. cosican

    cosican Super Member ECF Veteran

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    You are great w/ your respones, thank you
    If the bottle does not say Imitation, on it, then it is not considered imitation
    It does seem to make a diff in flavor, atleast for me, but also, I think it smells, like it is burning, which I know aint right
    So, I am off to the store AGAIN
     
  13. blueeyekelly

    blueeyekelly Super Member ECF Veteran

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    Vanilla extract has to be at lest 10% alcohol, that's the law because the vanilla is alcohol soluble and not water. There is no such thing as a clear vanilla extract. The brown color of vanilla is actually a natural color from the extraction process... if you have a nice vanilla extract and some vanilla beans you can make a nice double strength extract... Ok I'll shut up now....
     
  14. jbbishop

    jbbishop Senior Member ECF Veteran

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    PURE VANILLIN CRYSTALS

    Ethyl vanillin is actually what is used in the manufacture of our commercial e-liquids often in combination with some other form of a vanilla extractive.

    If anyone considers trying the vanillin crystals let me know. If it's in the pure crystal form it seems to me that you can't get any stronger vanilla taste than that. The smell is intoxicating. It occurs to me that if you need to mix a vanilla absolute with alcohol as a carrier as has been suggested with the tobacco absolute that might be defeating the purpose, so maybe a vanilla absolute is not the way to go and perhaps better is a 2x or 4x extract of vanilla.

    While vanillin as commercially produced is artificial, manufactured from guaiacol or lignin, it is considered nature identical. It exists in nature as the most concentrated form of the vanilla flavor in vanilla beans:

    "One of the main flavor components in Bourbon vanilla is vanillin, which imparts the bean with its distinctive vanilla flavor. Our bulk gourmet Madagascar vanilla beans are so rich in vanillin that the vanillin often crystallizes out to the surface of the vanilla bean as shown in the picture of vanilla beans below."

    Vanillin Crystals - Bourbon Vanilla Beans

    According to one report, and I don't know what to make of it: Krinos Vanillin is a white or yellowish crystalline compound extracted from vanilla beans. It is mostly used as a fragrance in perfumes and for flavoring baked goods.

    Here are some links where you can buy the Krinos brand Vanillin for as little as $1.49 --

    http://persiangrocer.com/usersection...&img=1&catid=9
    http://www.christosmarket.com/Produc...ductCode=BAK03
    http://www.shamra.com/food/foodsearc...0and%20Essence
    http://javafoods.com/store/product.p...15&page=1&js=n
    http://www.greekinternetmarket.com/1101-09001.html
    Parthenon Foods - Vanilla Flavoring (Krinos) 17g

    There's about 3 Greek markets nearby where I might be able to purchase this locally.

    This is, more specifically, what the commercial e-liquid manufacturers are using and if you can find a supplier for the small quantities we would use, please post on here:

    "Ethyl Vanillin is an important Aroma chemical with a stronger more intense vanilla-like aroma than vanillin. Its major applications are in the manufacture of fragrances, toiletries, detergents and food/beverages. Aromatic ethyl vanillin is manufactured through a synthetic process with raw materials derived from fossil hydrocarbons. Aromatic is delivered in crystalline form. Due to its more intense flavour and fragrance profile, Aromatic ethyl vanillin is between 2 and 4 times stronger than normal vanillin grades."

    Somebody posted somewhere on the forum (without knowing what they were even talking about):

    "The artificial vanilla flavor (often referred to as vanillin) is a benzaldehyde which some feel presents a health hazard, although there is debate on the matter. Safety (MSDS) data for vanillin"

    The reason for the confusion is that what they were actually referring to is
    ETHYL VANILLIN (3-ETHOXY-4-HYDROXY-BENZALDEHYDE). Once again, this is actually the stuff that the commercial e-liquid manufacturers really are using, often in combination with some other vanilla extractive.

    This is the smallest quantity of ethyl vanillin I can find at the moment to purchase:

    Ethyl Vanillin, NF
    3-Ethoxy-4-hydroxybenzaldehyde
    N.F. Functional Use: Flavor; Perfume
    125 GM $53.58

    ArtChemicals.com - Chemistry for the Imagination
     
  15. pagn8or

    pagn8or Full Member

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    There is. It's just artificial.
     

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  16. jcoppers

    jcoppers Full Member ECF Veteran

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    I tried my first juice making last night with this stuff. WOW, vanilla vapor out the wazoo, good hit and nice smell. Yesterday I couldn't spell chemist and today I are one. Not sure what the stuff will do to the atty, but it works fine. Also the teabag idea is the bomb.
     
  17. Drewsworld

    Drewsworld Resting In Peace

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    Hey JB...Ive been reading your posts and Im curious if you ever got any further with your nicotine experiments?
     
  18. blueeyekelly

    blueeyekelly Super Member ECF Veteran

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    LMAO that is what I ment....:D there is no such thing as clear vanilla extract because it is artificial and not an extract from the vanilla bean.
     
  19. Sun Vaporer

    Sun Vaporer Moved On ECF Veteran

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    Yes--It is my understanding that the use of Vanillin is no good--is this supported or is this speculation? Ahh the hunt for the Holy Grail of Vanilla? -----------Sun
     
  20. kinabaloo

    kinabaloo Vaping Master ECF Veteran

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    jbbishop - I said "some people say", and that "it is debatable". It is a real pity a forum where people wish to discuss issues should be dragged into the mud by this type of personal insult. Goodbye!
     
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