What's everyones thoughts on freezing flavoring

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dannyv45

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There has never been serious talk on the topic of freezing flavoring so I'd like to here everyones thoughts.

My thoughts are that I don't see much of an issue freezing chemically derived synthetic flavoring but there may be an issue with naturally derived flavoring or flavoring with Net or natural tobacco essence added. I myself store my larger bulk quantity synthetic flavoring in the refrigerator and never had an issue but I never tried freezing it.

So what are your thoughts................Go!
 
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MR. Mad

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while not an answer for freezing exactly this is a response supposedly from TFA on storing flavors in general,

SHELF LIFE FLAVOR INFORMATION TFA's reply

Concentrated flavors do not spoil, or go rancid, like fruit juices can. But under certain conditions they can change. In other words, you will notice that a "fresh" bottle might seem different from an older bottle. Basically, what my flavor manufacturer tells me is that the flavors have a shelflife of at least three to six months , when they are not continuously opened and are stored in glass. It is not necessary to store them in the refrigerator, but I don't think that this would hurt them. But sometimes refrigeration can cause re-crystallization of flavors that have a lot of the crystals like ethyl maltol in them. Here's some background. Every concentrated flavor is a mixture of raw materials, and every flavor blend can act differently. For example flavors that have a vanilla characteristic are going to have slightly different storage capabilities than fruit flavors. Here's the reason. Vanilla and caramel flavors are mostly made of large molecules like vanillin, ethyl vanillin , etc. These molecules are not very volatile, and tend not to escape the bottle when you open it. They will be fairly stable. Fruit flavors, on the other hand, are made of much smaller molecules in general. Whenever you open a bottle, it's the lightest and smallest molecules that escape and reach your nose quickly. Over time when you open a bottle over and over again more and more proportion of these lighter molecules leave the bottle and eventually the character of the flavor will be changed. This doesn't mean the flavors spoiled, it's just different. So this is one piece of advice, if you are going to store a flavor for a long period of time, transfer the flavor to smaller bottles that will you will not have to open over and over again. also, when a flavor is warm, like if it's a hot day, when you open the bottle even more of the volatile molecules will escape, much more will escape than if the flavor was cool. This is true for all liquids, when liquids are heated the molecules are much more easily converted to their gaseous state. So in general it is a good idea to keep the flavor cool though I don't think refrigeration is necessary. Also, in general, it is best not to store these flavors long-term in plastic. The plastic that we ship our larger sizes in ( 4 ounces and above), is HDPE plastic, which is very resistant to interaction with the flavors. but even with HDPE plastic, I really wouldn't recommend storing them for longer than a month or so.. It's much better to store things long-term in glass. also, it is not a good idea at all to store the flavors with the plastic eyedropper caps on the bottles. The rubber that's used with the eyedropper's is extremely soft and interacts with a great many materials. If you try to store your flavors with these rubber dropper caps attached you will most likely ruin both the caps and the flavors. i hope this helps, linda
 

GaryInTexas

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I did a short 1 week test on a small bottle of HS USA Red last week. I did not see any changes to it after bringing it back to room temp. I know a one week test is not of significant value but I mainly wanted to determine if I saw any separation or any obvious reaction. With the looming regs coming in effect I suspect some of our flavors may become difficult to source so I plan on adding a few of my favorite HS Essences to my freezer stockpile along with my nic.
 

dannyv45

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while not an answer for freezing exactly this is a response supposedly from TFA on storing flavors in general,

SHELF LIFE FLAVOR INFORMATION TFA's reply

Concentrated flavors do not spoil, or go rancid, like fruit juices can. But under certain conditions they can change. In other words, you will notice that a "fresh" bottle might seem different from an older bottle. Basically, what my flavor manufacturer tells me is that the flavors have a shelflife of at least three to six months , when they are not continuously opened and are stored in glass. It is not necessary to store them in the refrigerator, but I don't think that this would hurt them. But sometimes refrigeration can cause re-crystallization of flavors that have a lot of the crystals like ethyl maltol in them. Here's some background. Every concentrated flavor is a mixture of raw materials, and every flavor blend can act differently. For example flavors that have a vanilla characteristic are going to have slightly different storage capabilities than fruit flavors. Here's the reason. Vanilla and caramel flavors are mostly made of large molecules like vanillin, ethyl vanillin , etc. These molecules are not very volatile, and tend not to escape the bottle when you open it. They will be fairly stable. Fruit flavors, on the other hand, are made of much smaller molecules in general. Whenever you open a bottle, it's the lightest and smallest molecules that escape and reach your nose quickly. Over time when you open a bottle over and over again more and more proportion of these lighter molecules leave the bottle and eventually the character of the flavor will be changed. This doesn't mean the flavors spoiled, it's just different. So this is one piece of advice, if you are going to store a flavor for a long period of time, transfer the flavor to smaller bottles that will you will not have to open over and over again. also, when a flavor is warm, like if it's a hot day, when you open the bottle even more of the volatile molecules will escape, much more will escape than if the flavor was cool. This is true for all liquids, when liquids are heated the molecules are much more easily converted to their gaseous state. So in general it is a good idea to keep the flavor cool though I don't think refrigeration is necessary. Also, in general, it is best not to store these flavors long-term in plastic. The plastic that we ship our larger sizes in ( 4 ounces and above), is HDPE plastic, which is very resistant to interaction with the flavors. but even with HDPE plastic, I really wouldn't recommend storing them for longer than a month or so.. It's much better to store things long-term in glass. also, it is not a good idea at all to store the flavors with the plastic eyedropper caps on the bottles. The rubber that's used with the eyedropper's is extremely soft and interacts with a great many materials. If you try to store your flavors with these rubber dropper caps attached you will most likely ruin both the caps and the flavors. i hope this helps, linda

Excellent information. I was going to suggest storing the flavorings in dropper bottles to reduce air flow until I read the part about the rubber dropper tip will interact with the flavor in a less then positive way.
 
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dannyv45

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I did a short 1 week test on a small bottle of HS USA Red last week. I did not see any changes to it after bringing it back to room temp. I know a one week test is not of significant value but I mainly wanted to determine if I saw any separation or any obvious reaction. With the looming regs coming in effect I suspect some of our flavors may become difficult to source so I plan on adding a few of my favorite HS Essences to my freezer stockpile along with my nic.

I was thinking the same thing myself. There are some flavorings I have that I don't much care for that would make great test candidates.
 

Jdurand

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I've had some flavorings for over 6 months stored in the plastic bottles they came in. I have not noticed any change in the flavor. I also bought a whole bunch of Cap VC1 when I thought it was going to disappear and I just opened my second of several 4 oz bottles. Still exactly the same. I'm not sure flavors are as delicate as nic is to ageing.
 

dannyv45

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I've had some flavorings for over 6 months stored in the plastic bottles they came in. I have not noticed any change in the flavor. I also bought a whole bunch of Cap VC1 when I thought it was going to disappear and I just opened my second of several 4 oz bottles. Still exactly the same. I'm not sure flavors are as delicate as nic is to ageing.

Are you storing them at room temps, freezing or refrigerating?
I myself have flavorings well over 3 years old stored at room temps in dark containers that are still fine. But the question I pose is will they be better off stored frozen.
 

GaryInTexas

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I've had some flavorings for over 6 months stored in the plastic bottles they came in. I have not noticed any change in the flavor. I also bought a whole bunch of Cap VC1 when I thought it was going to disappear and I just opened my second of several 4 oz bottles. Still exactly the same. I'm not sure flavors are as delicate as nic is to ageing.

I too have had some flavors that seem to age very well in room temp original bottles but I've also had some go flat in about a year. Seems it is going to be different on each type of flavoring as to it's life expectancy.
My experience is that flavors that are in a alcohol base last the least amount of time and those in PG or VG last longer.
 

dannyv45

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Now being as cold slows every method of degeneration known to man, it only adds up that keeping anything cold will be better for long term storage. That is, IF, separation doesn't become an issue.

I tend to agree with you that cold slows molecular movement thus preserves freshness. I've also read that some believe that cold changes the molecular structure of the compounds used to make up the flavoring thus changing the taste over time. This I always found to be an unproven but interesting statement nun the less.
 

dannyv45

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I assume oxidation is the culprit in flavor killing. Would using sealed syringe type caps, the rubber ones you pierce with a syringe for dispensing, be overkill? keeping flavors away from open air would seal in the volatile compounds.

I don't think oxidation would play a part with flavoring in regards to long term store of flavoring as the oxidation component is only introduced when adding Nicotine.
 

dannyv45

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My experience is that flavors that are in a alcohol base last the least amount of time and those in PG or VG last longer.

I would assume that to be true if the alcohol breaks down the solid components of flavoring faster then lets say PG but in my experience I found that as the alcohol evaporated over time the flavor only got more potent.

On a side note I am loving where this thread is going. We are getting some very important information here so lets keep going with these discussions.
 
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Jdurand

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In another thread, it was noted that some pre-mix juices last in the refrigerator for close to a year. This was reported by one of the mods who buys in bulk. If storing raw flavors is worrisome, how about mixing large batches or your favorite juice and freeze/refrigerate that?
 
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dannyv45

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In another thread, it was noted that some pre-mix juices last in the refrigerator for close to a year. This was reported by one of the mods who buys in bulk. If storing raw flavors is worrisome, how about mixing large batches or your favorite juice and freeze/refrigerate that?

That's a good short term solution but my concern is FDA regulation and if flavoring will be readily available in the future. I'm thinking in terms of decades and not years. Sure marketing stratigies can change to get around FDA regulation but I for see a far poorer selection of flavorings such as inawera or hangsen in the future. But for this topic I'd like to keep FDA out of it for now I don't want this to turn into a discussion on FDA regulation.
 
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MR. Mad

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the one thing to keep in mind when freezing anything is to not freeze and thaw repeatedly or open and close repeatedly . The process of thawing will introduce water through condensation and opening and closing will introduce air. best bet would be to store in small glass containers filled to the top so very little air is introduced making sure to store bottles upright.
 

dannyv45

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the one thing to keep in mind when freezing anything is to not freeze and thaw repeatedly or open and close repeatedly . The process of thawing will introduce water through condensation and opening and closing will introduce air. best bet would be to store in small glass containers filled to the top so very little air is introduced making sure to store bottles upright.

You are absolutely correct. Treat freezing flavoring like you would treat freezing Nicotine.
 
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