Why doesn't BT jump on board?

[Eskie]

Fontem did acquire a 50% stake in von erl, so it's kinda pretty much a BT product, no?

At least the other half is not BT.

No matter what happens with regulations in the US, EU, or elsewhere, BT will continue to enter the e cig market faced with declining cigarette sales in the US and EU. Yes, there are countries with far more smokers per capita, but not many companies would think that will help them all that much down the road. There would still be declining revenue as BT is in those other markets already, and I can't imagine them recruiting enough new smokers in those markets to fill the gap 10 or 20 years from now.

Products like Blu have already been on the market for several years. Vuse has significant penetration into the gas station e cig market. If anything, it's quite forward looking to see Fontem taking a stake in von erl, recognizing there will be stratification in the market, with low end and "premium" e cigs, each having distinct targeting of consumers.

There are business plans and pivots that BT already prepared, and have started implementing, regarding e cigs. With their financial resources I don't see any consumer movement preventing that to occur.

 

[Layzee Vaper]

The developing situation in Europe should tell us a bit about how things might pan out.
The big vaping hardware manufacturers (Aspire, Eleaf, Joyetech, Smok etc.) are getting their products successfully through the regulations. If the map was re-drawn (new legislation) to allow only closed systems and those were predictably mostly made by tobacco companies, then the Chinese co.s aren't going to roll over. If BT tried to buy all the intellectual rights to hardware or even the companies themselves (not going to happen, this is China after all) they would still bounce back with new innovations. Unless BT can purchase the entire 'concept' (patents) of an electronic delivery device that covers all the various methods we understand and new ones yet to be discovered, then BT cannot own vaping entirely. They can 'own' vaping though with their marketing and take the lions share of all the sales, but vapers should tell new vapers and other vapers the truth. Most people who I meet using Blu pens are shocked to hear they are giving their money again to a tobacco company. The problem is the marketing is so blurred and people just want to buy and use products. Getting people to be all moral about who they buy from is almost impossible. That's the problem.

I live in the UK, so fall under the TPD. So far we have only seen round one.
They have already restricted juice, you can only legally buy it in 10ml bottles @ a maximum nic 20mg.
Many countries within the EU are pushing for either an outright ban or closed systems, ie non refillable cartridges that will only work with the mod they are designed for.

My guess is that BT have been pushing hard for this kind of mod. It would suit them very nicely indeed. Repeat daily or weekly customers, just like cigs.

There are already a few studies showing problems (nasty by products) with some flavours, and some with PG and VG especially at higher temps.

Remember BT have convinced governments across the world to allow them to continue to sell a proven deadly product through pretty much every petrol station and convenience store world wide.

Next to that convincing governments and the general public that closed systems are a safer and better option will be child's play.

It really won't matter how good or how many mods china or anywhere else can produce if we can't buy juice, they just become redundant.

It sucks but the writings on the wall.

 

[djsvapour]

It sucks but the writings on the wall.

There won't be a round two should/when we Brexit. So there is hope.
The UK government is far less anti-ecig than the EU government so for the time being the wall is built in a manageable place. The UK is also winning the battle against smoking, gradually, and understands the potential of e-cigs.

Zandera (E-Lites) was bought by Japan tobacco. E-Lites are close to the end, thank goodness.
Logic (E-lites, reinvented) is trying, thanks to the greed of Morrisons and Sainsburys.
Vype intended to hit the market hard with their product... they are barely making a dent.
Blu pick up some decent business, but once you have a Blu eGo in your hand, soon enough another vaper will explain you are paying too much for re-branded China product.
Nicolites/Nicocig/Mesh are barely scraping along the bottom.
VIP have resorted to pound shops and bargain basement 'tat' stores. (Not BT, but outdated junk for the most part)

How are BT products doing in the UK? Not very well.
What are most people vaping on? Really down to earth modest refillable clearos on eGos or iSticks.
(Yes.. not fat box mods and subohm tanks)
Totally Wicked are doing OK. Most towns have some sort of e-cig shop, they don't sell Vype and Vuse and E-Lites and Von Earl.

BT is not winning in the UK.

The community is stronger than BT. People just need to keep the faith and stop giving any overt support to any vaping product with even the faintest whiff of burning tobacco leaves.

 

[AXIOM_1]

BT is not winning in the UK.

I want to move to England

 

[Eskie]

I want to move to England

There is always a London vacation that can be used for shopping. It's not like those little 2 ml tanks will take up much room in your luggage.

 

[AXIOM_1]

yeah, escaping our dysfunctional Gvt. and BT for a spell would make a great vacation

 

[Eskie]

yeah, escaping our dysfunctional Gvt. and BT for a spell would make a great vacation

Dysfunctional? IMO that's giving them far too much credit.

 

[AXIOM_1]

Dysfunctional? IMO that's giving them far too much credit.

lol .... yeah well you know, I try to be a kind person once in awhile

 

[djsvapour]

There is always a London vacation that can be used for shopping. It's not like those little 2 ml tanks will take up much room in your luggage.

That's ironically LOL...

 

[stols001]

lol .... yeah well you know, I try to be a kind person once in awhile

I think the word you want is sociopathic...

You know, I visited the doomsday clock posted earlier in this thread... And, it was comforting, sorta. I mean, I was like... So, sorta a year before all BT implementations start getting accomodated. I was like, "Wow, so many days before vacopalypse," which was a sad, yet truthful realization. When we start mesuring our freedom in days, that's a bit terrifying. Sigh. Though I won't be traveling to England, probably. I have what I need. Maybe next year.

Anna

 

[AXIOM_1]

When we start mesuring our freedom in days, that's a bit terrifying.

Yeah since I am an "older" type person, I have watched our Gvt. turn into something I don't much care for compared to how it used to be....... I am not a proponent of socialism but our Country is rapidly heading in that direction, which means you can expect to have even less freedom in the near future.

 

[stols001]

I think it's Marxism, actually. I blame Saw Lewinsky. The rules for radicals manifesto? I am seriously in love with manifestos, so I *tried* to read it, but every time I turned the page this sort of glowing miasma of tragic Marxism strategies and how to infiltrate the goverment gave me the dry heaves. So poorly written, too.

I've lived in socialistic countries and liked them (several decades ago) but even here, I'm a libretarian, to a point. Americans are way too noisy and difficult to corral, that even with mighty efforts by the governmen, the people realize that socialism just sucks. And the kids trying to get us there are starting to realize (I hope) that their efforts aren't going too well.

It's pretty sad when a failed businessman got elected when Obama ignored or worsened the plight of American workers for a long time.... I am a full believer that over dependence on socialism causes a significant plight, and people will be willing to vote for DJT. I am a full beliver that every last Clinton (including and especially Hillary) should be locked up. My mom would get frustrated and say, "Vote for Hillary, Anna. Think about your retirement!" "My retirement Mom? I'm not retired. Bit of a pronoun issue there, isn't there? And I'm so sorry, but I can't vote for a creature who breathes out psychosis, and has the shiny eyes of a lesser, but important demon. Just can't. Sorry." But yeah, I think the election results kinda proved that if it comes to Socialism, at least that kind, this country will be extending a giant hand in the air, with one finger up. I just wnt raeasonble safety nets and enough, but not too much, regulation of giant corporations.... Like, BT.

Look at this video, which is my single favorite video of the Occupy movement.... The dude excitedly demonstrating it is adorably goofy.... But, I wouldn't trust him to run the goverment. Even a tourist rock shop. Not even that, he's more of a dishwasher/barista. I about died laughing, however.



Le sigh. Will probably get a downtwinkles for this post, but it IS important and no less off-topic in a politically oriented thread than anyone else. I think. Downtwinkles, though. Hahhaha. Gotta cheer meself up these days.

Anna

 

[AXIOM_1]

I think it's Marxism, actually. I blame Saw Lewinsky. The rules for radicals manifesto? I am seriously in love with manifestos, so I *tried* to read it, but every time I turned the page this sort of glowing miasma of tragic Marxism strategies and how to infiltrate the goverment gave me the dry heaves. So poorly written, too.

I think you meant to say "Sol Lewinsky".... and YES his book is the playbook that many of the folks in power are using to reshape America........ In short, I agree wholeheartedly with everything you said.

 

[ENAUD]

I think the word you want is sociopathic...

You know, I visited the doomsday clock posted earlier in this thread... And, it was comforting, sorta. I mean, I was like... So, sorta a year before all BT implementations start getting accomodated. I was like, "Wow, so many days before vacopalypse," which was a sad, yet truthful realization. When we start mesuring our freedom in days, that's a bit terrifying. Sigh. Though I won't be traveling to England, probably. I have what I need. Maybe next year.

Anna

Timeline - FDA Regulations for Vapor Products and Vapers

check out the timeline of copliance dates in the link, scroll down to Aug 8, 2017 and beyond...the clock is regarding the big hammer, how many manufacturors do you really believe will succeed or bother with the dates before then? I don't have a clue, but my gut tells me many will be gone long before Aug 8, 2018...

 

[DeAnna2112]

Alot of interesting views!! i am not sure what to think but you all have given me alot to consider in answering my question. It's not always easy to know the motives of BT, but one thing is for sure it's never good. It just burns me that the powers that be allow cigs to remain on the market but vaping is evil must be stopped. We know so much about cigs it's scary, yet vaping is being shut down before it even has a chance.

 

[AXIOM_1]

It's not always easy to know the motives of BT, but one thing is for sure it's never good.

well said and very true

 

[zoiDman]

Alot of interesting views!! i am not sure what to think but you all have given me alot to consider in answering my question. It's not always easy to know the motives of BT, but one thing is for sure it's never good. It just burns me that the powers that be allow cigs to remain on the market but vaping is evil must be stopped. We know so much about cigs it's scary, yet vaping is being shut down before it even has a chance.

 

[DeAnna2112]

LOL can always count on you for a good laugh and common sense