Why don't more vapers use TC?

[KenD]

I found that the TC on the DNA40's was to erratic. I prefer to use a high end mod (Provari) with good voltage control (USA made circuit board) and a Kanthal wire that has some resistance built into the wire. Reliability, consistancy and it is safer.

dna boards are US made, and no less safee than the Provari. Neither is Kanthal safer than for example stainless steel.

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[r055co]

Hmmm... I have a sigelei and a Vaperflask and I have had voltage regulation problems with both of them. The Kanthal wire has a built in resistance (very reliable) so I am not dependent upon a circuit board to prevent a dead short to the battery (that's the safety margin). I definitely prefer not using a zero resistance wire like SS.

Never heard of "zero resistance" wire and SS certainly has a resistance, if it did it wouldn't heat up

That said SS is wonderful, very responsive, easy to work with plus a cleaner/crisper taste.

 

[Cheallaigh]

Are you sure TC runs the battery down fastser? It doesn't seem that way to me. I do 400 degrees and 30 max watts in TC mode. 30 watts happens for a fraction of a second then it backs off to a few watts to maintain the temperature. At my moderate settings a 3,000 mAH LG HG2 goes for 1,000-1,100 seconds of puff time which usually gets me through an entire day. My guess is TC is more energy efficient than power mode.

for my kbox mini it does... i haven't checked on the 160w DB

 

[KenD]

Hmmm... I have a Sigelei and a Vaperflask and I have had voltage regulation problems with both of them. The Kanthal wire has a built in resistance (very reliable) so I am not dependent upon a circuit board to prevent a dead short to the battery (that's the safety margin). I definitely prefer not using a zero resistance wire like SS.

As r055co says, no wire has zero resistance. Even "no resistance" ni200 has resistance, though very low. And "prebuilt resistance" makes no sense. Resistance is a characteristic of a material, nothing "prebuilt". Ss316 has about half the resistance of kanthal a1, and the resistance increases with heat. In addition the choice of material does in no way protect you from dead shorts. A dead short is a dead short, with kanthal and ss wires alike. You really should read up on these things.

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[r055co]

I really do wish people would get to know the difference between an opinion and fact. Their IQ would rise dramatically. You don't know what you are talking about. You are speaking out of the wrong orifice.
Kanthal is a different kind of wire from all the rest - it is engineered specifically to have a predictable resistance to electron flow at any particular length. It has a "pre-built" physical/electrical property. It is "heating wire".
I have indeed done my reading - in fact, as I am a licensed control electrician and actually have been to school with 40 years experience working on electrical and heating control equipment.
FYI:
Kanthal A-1 is a ferritic iron-chromium-aluminium alloy (FeCrAl alloy) for use at temperatures up to 1400°C (2550°F). The alloy is characterized by high resistivity and very good oxidation resistance.
Electrical resistivity at 20°C Ω mm2/m 1.45

Typical applications for Kanthal A-1 are electrical heating elements in high-temperature furnaces for heat treatment, ceramics, glass, steel, and electronics industries (including vaping atomizers).

The moral is: "Vaping Masters do not an electrician make". Do not believe every self-proclaimed "expert" you run into in vaping forums.

So please tell me Mr. Expert how SS can heat up if it doesn't have any resistance?
I'm all ears.........

 

[sofarsogood]

I really do wish people would get to know the difference between an opinion and fact. Their IQ would rise dramatically. You don't know what you are talking about. You are speaking out of the wrong orifice.
Kanthal is a different kind of wire from all the rest - it is engineered specifically to have a predictable resistance to electron flow at any particular length. It has a "pre-built" physical/electrical property. It is "heating wire".
I have indeed done my reading - in fact, as I am a licensed control electrician and actually have been to school with 40 years experience working on electrical and heating control equipment.
FYI:
Kanthal A-1 is a ferritic iron-chromium-aluminium alloy (FeCrAl alloy) for use at temperatures up to 1400°C (2550°F). The alloy is characterized by high resistivity and very good oxidation resistance.
Electrical resistivity at 20°C Ω mm2/m 1.45

Typical applications for Kanthal A-1 are electrical heating elements in high-temperature furnaces for heat treatment, ceramics, glass, steel, and electronics industries (including vaping atomizers).

The moral is: "Vaping Masters do not an electrician make". Do not believe every self-proclaimed "expert" you run into in vaping forums.

Welcome, thanks for chiming in. I hope you'll let us pick your brain a bit. May be you have an idea about this one. Most temp control mods are regulated so they won't fire a coil in temp control mode that reads above 1.5 ohm in it's resting state. Do you have any idea why they might need that cap? I'd build to 1.6 ohm or more for TC mode if I could. Here's another one, is the metalurgy invollved easy enough that someday may be alloys will be made specifically for vaping wire and could there be advantages over any of the wire available to us so far?

 

[zoiDman]

... I definitely prefer not using a zero resistance wire like SS.

If you can make a Zero Resistance Metallic Alloy for the Temperatures that we use in an e-Cigarette, I think they will give you one of these.

 

[zoiDman]

So please tell me Mr. Expert how SS can heat up if it doesn't have any resistance?
I'm all ears.........

That would seem to Violate the Law of Conservation of Energy.

 

[sofarsogood]

If you can make a Zero Resistance Metallic Alloy for the Temperatures that we use in an e-Cigarette, I think they will give you one of these.

Perhaps boiler guy will chime in on this. My understanding is when you are transporting electricity to power a light or motor you want the lowest resistance possible so the power is used to run the device and not wasted as heat. Copper is good for that. If the purpose of the electricity is to make heat then you want the wire to be inefficient, a poor conductor. You want the power "wasted" as heat. A room temperature super conductor would be a revolution but it wouldn't apply to vaping.

 

[zoiDman]

Perhaps bioler guy will chime in on this. My understanding is when you are transporting electricity to power a light or motor you want the lowest resistance possible so the power is used to run the device and not wasted as heat. Copper is good for that. If the purpose of the electricity is to make heat then you want the wire to be inefficient, a poor conductor. You want the power "wasted" as heat. A room temperature super conductor would be a revolution but it wouldn't apply to vaping.

Low Resistance is One Thing. "Zero" Resistance is quiet Another.

If BoilerGuy believes that SS Wire has Zero Resistance at Vaping Temperatures, that's Cool...

Hmmm... I have a Sigelei and a Vaperflask and I have had voltage regulation problems with both of them. The Kanthal wire has a built in resistance (very reliable) so I am not dependent upon a circuit board to prevent a dead short to the battery (that's the safety margin). I definitely prefer not using a zero resistance wire like SS.

... I just Wonder what they are Teaching at these Schools he says he has Attended?

 

[BobC]

Me thinks you chased the 'Boiler Guy' away

I miss him

He seems to have vast amounts of boiler knowledge, very helpful for vapers

 

[r055co]

Me thinks you chased the 'Boiler Guy' away

I miss him

He seems to have vast amounts of boiler knowledge, very helpful for vapers

He's applying for the Nobel

 

[celticluvr]

Wow, my brain hurts now...

 

[Foggy Road]

Anyone still wondering why TC has been relegated to permanent pointless status for me?

 

[Bad Ninja]

I only use tc, and have so for most of this year. All my mechs ate stoved away. Ss316 is my wire of choice, and I don't need to do any fiddling with any of my mods (one DNA200 and the rest are Joyetech/Wismec/Eleaf mods) - and I'm certainly no master builder or wicker. It's no more difficult than vw, and doesn't give an anemic vape. I can't understand how difficult tc seems to be to some people.

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It isnt that TC is difficult.
Its that for some, the time eating fiddling isnt worth the minimal rewards.
Especially for vapers that can use a mechanical mod effectively.

 

[sofarsogood]

It isnt that TC is difficult.
Its that for some, the time eating fiddling isnt worth the minimal rewards.
Especially for vapers that can use a mechanical mod effectively.

I'm strictly MTL. I stopped using a Nautilus mini because I wanted to rebuild and the vape was a bit cooler than I wanted. I found that I prefered my rda to a rebuildable tank. At 20 watts in power mode my vape was still cooler than I wanted. Increasing power to 30 watts solved that but then I had to drip too often to keep the coil from over heating. If I use 30 max watts with temp control at 400 degrees I get the warmer vape without needing to drip so often or scorching the wick. The power I need is low because resistance is on the high side, about 1.35 ohm but the same princciple would apply with lower resistance builds that need more watts. When my 1.35 ohm stainless coil gets up to temp it's resistance has risen to about 1.6, right where I was with N mini coils but the vape is warmer than the N mini. And I like to rewick every couple of days which is not practical with the N mini. I don't have any problems with TC builds if the coils are spaced.

 

[Cheallaigh]

so just to confirm... yes TC is draining my batteries faster.

two of the top tank mini v4 RBA (both with 28g SS316L round wire 5/2.5 coming out to .5 ohms)
pair of top tank mini's so approx 3.5 ml of juice per tank
same 3 mg 70/30 VG/PG juice Double Trouble
pair of kbox 75w minis (one set at 23w the other at SS 420f/75w)
a married pair of VTC4's(from my 160w dripbox, i bought them 3rd week in nov they're fairly new, so they would match as best as possible)
i did not change my typical DtL 3-7s puffs alternating with my usual chaining quick 2s puffs.

i went until each hit the last bar on the power, going by juice amount left... with TC i got 3/4 of a tank, with watts i finished the tank and almost 1/3rd more.

so while i can see the value of TC with what it does, and i will use it on occasion, wattage will still be my prefered when out and about for keeping my batteries lasting longer.

 

[GeorgeS]

I would suspect that for a test to be fair, the same wattage needs to be used in both the VW and TC modes.

• In VW mode the same wattage will be used from start to finish
• In TC mode it might start at the same wattage but will throttle back as the coil reaches the set point

I think that big short burst of 75W at the start of a vape in TC mode is wreaking havoc on the battery capacity.

 

[Cheallaigh]

I would suspect that for a test to be fair, the same wattage needs to be used in both the VW and TC modes.

• In VW mode the same wattage will be used from start to finish
• In TC mode it might start at the same wattage but will throttle back as the coil reaches the set point

I think that big short burst of 75W at the start of a vape in TC mode is wreaking havoc on the battery capacity.

true somewhat... i can't set wattage while in TC with those mods, but it does show me what wattage they are using and they are using 19-24w, which is why i matched it as best i could with the other one. the question i was asked earlier was in regards to the kbox minis, so i compared them in both modes. it's a fair test for them.

 

[TheotherSteveS]

I really do wish people would get to know the difference between an opinion and fact. Their IQ would rise dramatically. You don't know what you are talking about. You are speaking out of the wrong orifice.
Kanthal is a different kind of wire from all the rest - it is engineered specifically to have a predictable resistance to electron flow at any particular length. It has a "pre-built" physical/electrical property. It is "heating wire".
I have indeed done my reading - in fact, as I am a licensed control electrician and actually have been to school with 40 years experience working on electrical and heating control equipment.
FYI:
Kanthal A-1 is a ferritic iron-chromium-aluminium alloy (FeCrAl alloy) for use at temperatures up to 1400°C (2550°F). The alloy is characterized by high resistivity and very good oxidation resistance.
Electrical resistivity at 20°C Ω mm2/m 1.45

Typical applications for Kanthal A-1 are electrical heating elements in high-temperature furnaces for heat treatment, ceramics, glass, steel, and electronics industries (including vaping atomizers).

The moral is: "Vaping Masters do not an electrician make". Do not believe every self-proclaimed "expert" you run into in vaping forums.

bit late to chime in here but if that is what 40 years of training has taught you, God help your customers. Your info about kanthal is, of course, correct; your opinion about SS wire and pretty much everything else is utter nonsense....