Thanks for the reply while I haven't used the newer clearos I agree the ce2s were/are much better flavor and vapor then cartos when they are working properly. I just gave up on them because they weren't as convienant as a carto. They cracked, kind of a pain to clean and of course the dreaded burnt taste. Im gonna try the ce4+ its just for 5 bucks id rather get 15mls of juice lol take care thanks again!