0mg Juice

[sjoat]

Does having 0mg nic content change anything besides maybe TH of the juice? Does it depend on the juice? Can it change texture/feel?

I ask because I think I want to start vaping 0mg but I wouldn't want to compromise any goodness. I've only just started and have only tried 8mg and 16mg.

Also, with regards to texture/feel, are juices different from vendor to vendor? I mean is it just the flavour that is different or can some juices feel different? If I ordered say Apple flavour from two different vendors that use exactly the same PG/VG levels, could the juice feel different?

 

[Mindfield]

It pretty much depends entirely upon the ratio of VG to PG.

PG won't change much. It is the best carrier of flavour (and throat hit, but that's irrelevant in 0-nic juice) but lacks in the vapor production department.

VG is thicker and can change the texture/mouthfeel of the juice by producing thicker, more copious amounts of vapor. Furthermore, VG tends to mute the flavour some (and throat hit, though again, irrelevant here) and can also impart a bit of a sweet taste, as VG by itself has a natural, almost saccharine sweetness to it. (It's much more apparent if you taste a drop of it, though vaping it naturally tones that sweetness down significantly, and mixing with PG will further dilute the sweetness.)

The ingredients in the flavourings, along with any additives (such as TH boosters) can also change the texture of vapor depending on what they use for a base and any other extra ingredients that might be used.

All else being equal, a vendor that uses the same apple flavouring and the same PG and VG should taste the same. If one changes the PG/VG ratio it can alter things slightly. However the same flavouring from different flavouring companies can taste different, and that can further change if the vendor uses any extra additives to alter flavouring (i.e. MTS Vape Wizard, Bitter Wizard, sweetener, menthol crystals, ethyl maltol, etc.)

 

[sjoat]

Mindfield, I've read your answer twice but it's pretty ambiguous. I know the differences between PG and VG.

Let me simplify my first question with another scenario:

Same vendor, same flavour: 0mg vs 12mg - what will the differences be?

 

[Mindfield]

Mindfield, I've read your answer twice but it's pretty ambiguous. I know the differences between PG and VG.

Let me simplify my first question with another scenario:

Same vendor, same flavour: 0mg vs 12mg - what will the differences be?

Assuming same PG/VG ratios, largely just throat hit, which necessarily does alter texture/mouthfeel a bit. The perception of flavour may be a little different too -- not that the flavour will necessarily change, just how you perceive it with and without the throat hit. It may not, either. Taste, as always, is subjective, as is how extraneous stimulus causes you to perceive it. For what it's worth I've made both a 0mg and 12mg spearmint with the same flavouring and same PG/VG ratio and the flavour is largely the same, but the throat hit of the 12mg one does cause me to perceive the spearmint as having a bit more bold (or less smooth, if you prefer) flavour.

 

[sjoat]

Ok, so very much a YMMV thing

Thanks.

I noticed that the sample packs at certain vendors are only available in medium/high nic. Interesting.

 

[Mindfield]

Ok, so very much a YMMV thing

Thanks.

I noticed that the sample packs at certain vendors are only available in medium/high nic. Interesting.

Yeah, very much a YMMV thing -- depends on how sensitive you are to changes in taste and texture, really. Sampler packs also vary all over the place by vendor as well. Some may limit the size/strength/flavours available for sample packs because it's what they pre-mix the most of. Some have incredible variety in their sample packs (eg. Juicy Vapor, who have sample packs available in any flavour, any strength, sizes of 3, 6, 12, 18 and 30ml, in packs of 3, 5 or 10). Just depends on how much work the vendor wants or is able to go to in order to satisfy their customer base.

 

[mistinthewoods]

I have been using 0 nic for a few months now. I mix my own, which made tapering the nic back gradually a lot easier.
The big difference I noticed was a reduction in TH. I did it real slowly over a year and a half and I had no trouble with any kind of withdrawal or anything.
Good luck.

 

[donnah]

I know this isn't exactly pertaining to your question but recently I've started running pure PG through my attys and found that I like the taste and vapor. I've heard that this was a good way to sorta "flush" the other juice out of it and maybe keep it running longer. I vape no higher than 9.5 to 12 anymore.

 

[emus]

Can get TH w/ PGA, black pepper and nic.
Don't know which is safest long term.

 

[Mindfield]

Can get TH w/ PGA, black pepper and nic.
Don't know which is safest long term.

The current, apparently popular method of boosting throat hit is with capsaicin. Vapor Pros have their own proprietary capsicum blend that is also used in their 0-nic alternative juices, and Totally Wicked sell two variatinos on the same thing: Diablo Poco and Diablo Loco. Poco is a straight up 4000SHU dilution to be added sparingly to juice. Loco is mother of all TH boosters, and is 500,000SHU (think police-grade pepper spray, Red Savina peppers, and just a few hairs below Blair's 2AM Reserve). Obviously, Loco is meant to be further diluted (as in, dulite the hell out of it) and used sparingly as that dilution.

Then there's Flash from FlavourArt. I have no idea what's in that stuff as they don't list ingredients, but I'm betting capsaicin is in there somewhere.

I have all 3 on the way so I'll be testing them in 0 and low nic solutions when they all get here.

 

[emus]

The current, apparently popular method of boosting throat hit is with capsaicin. Vapor Pros have their own proprietary capsicum blend that is also used in their 0-nic alternative juices, and Totally Wicked sell two variatinos on the same thing: Diablo Poco and Diablo Loco. Poco is a straight up 4000SHU dilution to be added sparingly to juice. Loco is mother of all TH boosters, and is 500,000SHU (think police-grade pepper spray, Red Savina peppers, and just a few hairs below Blair's 2AM Reserve). Obviously, Loco is meant to be further diluted (as in, dulite the hell out of it) and used sparingly as that dilution.

Then there's Flash from FlavourArt. I have no idea what's in that stuff as they don't list ingredients, but I'm betting capsaicin is in there somewhere.

I have all 3 on the way so I'll be testing them in 0 and low nic solutions when they all get here.

My throat develops a tolerance for capsaicin and PGA.
I find myself increasing dosage of capsaicin and PGA but not nic.

 

[Morgythekilla]

My throat develops a tolerance for capsaicin and PGA.
I find myself increasing dosage of capsaicin and PGA but not nic.

I never knew any of that!!! I will for sure try it! Flavour art is recommended?, was afraid to buy from a (Greek or Italian) co. (But wanted to).

 

[emus]

I never knew any of that!!! I will for sure try it! Flavour art is recommended?, was afraid to buy from a (Greek or Italian) co. (But wanted to).

I just steep ground pepper in PGA or PG overnight.
Does not foul atty/carto.
Very strong.
Black pepper + orange dream bar is my favorite Clinton style jazz pipe vape.
One trick is to inhale w/ mouth closed if mixed strong.

 

[Mindfield]

My throat develops a tolerance for capsaicin and PGA.
I find myself increasing dosage of capsaicin and PGA but not nic.

Interesting. I'll have to see if that happens to me. Out of curiosity, does using black pepper add a peppery flavour to the juices? I don't know the source of the capsaicin additives I'm getting but I'd bet it's from straight capsaicin crystals, so it shouldn't impart and flavour. At least, I'm hoping not.

 

[emus]

Interesting. I'll have to see if that happens to me. Out of curiosity, does using black pepper add a peppery flavour to the juices? I don't know the source of the capsaicin additives I'm getting but I'd bet it's from straight capsaicin crystals, so it shouldn't impart and flavour. At least, I'm hoping not.

Steeped Black pepper forms a rich complex array of peppery flavors in addition to TH.

 

[Mindfield]

Steeped Black pepper forms a rich complex array of peppery flavors in addition to TH.

So, probably only suitable for certain flavours, I'm guessing? Do you just steep and strain in a coffee filter or something? What's the concentration like? (i.e. how much do you add to an E-liquid to give it a nice hit?)

 

[emus]

So, probably only suitable for certain flavours, I'm guessing? Do you just steep and strain in a coffee filter or something? What's the concentration like? (i.e. how much do you add to an E-liquid to give it a nice hit?)

No filter required because solids settle when steeped in PGA.

I don't filter when steeped in PG either.
PG steeped liquid is cloudy but it does not foul my carto.

Collect liquid w/ dropper or pipette.

Complements some flavors.

Concentration very user dependent. PGA version is stronger than PG steep. Could start w/ 1% PGA steeped black pepper and work your way up.

 

[Mindfield]

So, I steeped some fresh ground pepper in some PG overnight (about 20 hours). Oddly, mine came out cloudy. I don't know if that's because I shook it after adding the PG or what, but I don't suppose it matters much. I strained it through a cotton ball in a 5ml syringe because there were a lot of pepper bits still floating in it.

At any rate, I added it to some DIY butterscotch (yeah, a little weird) just to try it out. I figure it hasn't had a full day so I added it at about 8% to the juice, which I had also diluted to 6mg with some PG/VG.

I have to say, it does give a throat hit of a sort, but it's different from the nicotine hit. The black pepper gives a short sharp hit with just a touch of peppery flavour and warmth. It definitely kicks the overall impact of a 6mg juice up a notch, but it's also very definitely a different kind of throat hit that I'm not entirely sure I like. I think maybe I have to play with the ratio a bit, probably reduce the pepper so it blends in better with the nicotine's hit.

 

[emus]

So, I steeped some fresh ground pepper in some PG overnight (about 20 hours). Oddly, mine came out cloudy. I don't know if that's because I shook it after adding the PG or what, but I don't suppose it matters much. I strained it through a cotton ball in a 5ml syringe because there were a lot of pepper bits still floating in it.

At any rate, I added it to some DIY butterscotch (yeah, a little weird) just to try it out. I figure it hasn't had a full day so I added it at about 8% to the juice, which I had also diluted to 6mg with some PG/VG.

I have to say, it does give a throat hit of a sort, but it's different from the nicotine hit. The black pepper gives a short sharp hit with just a touch of peppery flavour and warmth. It definitely kicks the overall impact of a 6mg juice up a notch, but it's also very definitely a different kind of throat hit that I'm not entirely sure I like. I think maybe I have to play with the ratio a bit, probably reduce the pepper so it blends in better with the nicotine's hit.

Yes, PG steeped is cloudy and PGA steeped is clear; both work and neither foul my carto.

TH effect changes w/ time; scratchy at first but my throat adjusted.

I sometimes vape the PG steeped black pepper straight w/o inhale. It complements some flavors nicely.

 

[Morgythekilla]

I wonder if inhaling spices is safe? I would think it would inflame our airways?? No clue.!!