Ahlusion E-juice

[peraspera]

I believe that it was EleanorR who pointed out the risks of diacetyl substitutes such as acetoin and acetyl propionyl but it was Cherie Pie who posted a response from Clark (with permission) confirming that Nicoticket custards acetyl propionyl (2,3 pentanedione) and acetoin (acetyl methyl carbinol). Yet this disclaimer continues to appear on the Nicoticket site:

"FEMA & GRAS approved, diacetyl free, natural and artificial flavoring"

Unless something has changed very recently it is my understanding that it is not possible to make custard vapes that avoid all risk of exposure to diacetyl. While I tend to favor a libertarian view on what adults put in their bodies I am not a fan of any vendor who sells custard vapes and chooses not to prominently disclose this information to their customers.

From The Perfumer's Apprentice, aka The Flavor Apprentice (TFA), site

I have been doing more research, and i discovered that the molecule Acetoin can under certain circumstances "catalyze" into containing minute traces of the molecule Diacetyl.
...
I then had a sample of Acetoin purchased from Vigon International analyzed by GC/MS and yes, it did have trace amounts of Diacetyl! When I looked at the online specification sheet that Vigon posts, it does show that the purity of that particular product is 93-100%. Nearly every molecule that is commercially sold is somewhere in this range for purity, and this seems to be an acceptable industry standard. (Vigon is a very reputable company!)
...
But for customers wanting to avoid even trace amounts of Diacetyl, this means that any flavor that contains the ingredient Acetoin can potentially also contain trace amounts of Diacetyl, even though Diacetyl itself was never added to the blend as an ingredient.
...
Of course, if only a small amount of acetoin is in a flavor, then the potential likelihood of there also being diacetyl is very very small.

Short of it being possible for custard vapes to be made without risk of diacetyl exposure or other known nasties I'm not holding my breath waiting for any Ahlusion custard vapes.

Before I knew of the risk of diacetyl exposure from replacement ingredients I tried quite a few custard vapes. They all had a chemical taste to me, including Nicoticket's custard and crème brûlée.

 

[ambientech]

I think I need to clarify my statement. This is common among many vendors. They will openly deny using diacetyl, but refuse to openly address if they use the substitutes or avoid the topic.

I read in one of the old diacetyl threads here on ECF that if you taste custard or a buttery flavor it has diacetyl or one of the substitutes in it. It is unknown to me if there is a substitute out there that does not somehow potentially turn into diacetyl at some point in the vaping process. I have not been able to nail this info down in any clear or decisive manner. If someone has I would love to hear about it because I am one of the small population that had a very bad reaction to Vanilla Custard eliquids.

It is so common that I do not believe the claim anymore. This claim from Good Life Vapor is much better indicator but still just their word. "We do not use any flavorings with Diacetyl properties".

 

[Mr.Mann]

It is so common that I do not believe the claim anymore. This claim from Good Life Vapor is much better indicator but still just their word. "We do not use any flavorings with Diacetyl properties".

Another situation that is on the peripheries of the forum is this notion that all tobacco extracts are made from simple soaks (not true) and that certain vendors don't use that sort of thing in their tobaccos. But what I find to be interesting is that many of those same vendors still use flavorings that use tobacco absolute, or they flat-out use tobacco absolute. So if and when they claim that they don't touch NETs (meaning tobacco extracts for flavoring), or that their tobaccos are somehow "synthetic," I find a similar slithering dishonesty that only serves to trick folk into believing something that ain't so. I am not saying that TA is just as possibly problematic as soaks (and I ain't saying it's safe for inhalation either), but it is in fact a tobacco extract that falls into one of the various ways vendors impart tobacco flavoring into a liquid.

 

[Coldrake]

Clark has verified he uses diacetyl substitutes, which really may be just as bad. That would be the same for any vendor, I don't think a custard flavor could be made without diacetyl or one of the substitutes. Some people totally avoid substitutes, which is very understandable. I don't run away, but sure wouldn't vape them on a regular basis.

I understand that, I just didn't want anyone reading the post that I quoted to think Nicoticket uses diacetyl when they do not.

Don't forget that vanilla-custardy type flavors aren't the only flavors that use diacetyl substitutes. If you think you are avoiding those substitutes by not vaping custards, most likely you're not.

 

[Jerms]

I understand that, I just didn't want anyone reading the post that I quoted to think Nicoticket uses diacetyl when they do not.

Don't forget that vanilla-custardy type flavors aren't the only flavors that use diacetyl substitutes. If you think you are avoiding those substitutes by not vaping custards, most likely you're not.

Yeah, the usual suspects are custard and buttery flavorings, but a caramel flavoring has been found to contain diacetyl and who knows what else will turn up. Also, a vendor stating diacetyl free usually just means that the flavorings a vendor uses is said to be that way by the company they get the flavorings from, which turns out may not be the case when more sensitive testing is done. Throw in that the substitutes are possibly just as bad, the whole situation is obviously a mess. Only way to truly avoid these chemicals is to vape unflavored.

Personally, this issue doesn't concern me in respects to my own safety, I continue to vape whatever. A big reason for that is I vape such a wide variety, and rarely have more than a single bottle of anything. But I have learned a lot about the issue recently and it's quite a complex and tough situation.

 

[EleanorR]

Everything I know about diacetyl and its substitutes I learned from Mr. Mann.

I am fairly certain we will not see a "custard" being offered by Ahlusion, simply because it cannot be done without flunking the Mass Spec test. Wlad submits all his flavorings/juices to extensive chemical testing; that's why I trust my lungs to him!

Besides, who needs custard when you can have Boba Tea? Although I would love to see if Wlad could make a Vanilla Boba Tea . . .


I got my New Year's Eve order in today: Banana Creme Pie, Orange Creamsicle, and Mango Colada. They smell heavenly!! And while they now begin the Big Steep, I am now allowing myself a rare pre-bedtime vape of Boba Tea Coffee. Yummmmmmmmmmm . . . . .

 

[Jerms]

Besides, who needs custard when you can have Boba Tea? Although I would love to see if Wlad could make a Vanilla Boba Tea . . .

Lol, when I was writing about how custard is a good creamy and pleasant flavor but lacks complexity, Boba Tea entered my mind as an example of similar good qualities plus an added depth. Boba Tea trumps the 2 custard vapes I have from NT by a long shot for my preference. THAT'S a flavor I can get excited about.

Vanilla BT.. yes yes yes. Brilliant. I want that more than I want Wlad to come up with vanilla custard.

 

[rock_lobsterrr]

Question about Smooth Criminal. I noticed the default VG/PG ratio is 90/10. That seems quite thick to me. I'm usually at either 30/70 VG/PG or 50/50.

Is it recommend at that ratio provided?

 

[Jerms]

Question about Smooth Criminal. I noticed the default VG/PG ratio is 90/10. That seems quite thick to me. I'm usually at either 30/70 VG/PG or 50/50.

Is it recommend at that ratio provided?

No, the ratio default is the one on top, and the menu starts with the highest vg listed. The suggested ratio is mentioned in the description; 70PG or 50/50 I think for Smooth Crim.

 

[Mia11]

Oooo! BnJ's a gamer too? That's hot! I've got several days off so I can spend all weekend on the Beta test of an upcoming MMO that may or may not be related to Morrowind & Skyrim.

I've been thinking about trying Zing! because I love lemons but I'm not sure if I want the sweet or sour version. Anyone have any experience with this juice? I have been known to occasionally peel and eat lemons like one would do with an orange.

I am jealous! Huge Elder Scrolls fan here. Let me know what it's like, please? I just discovered Mass Effect and I love it. (Yes, I know it's an old game and I'm behind the times.) Funny I can 1-shot dragons with a bow and arrow, but these geth things are kicking my .....

 

[Mr.Mann]

Question about Smooth Criminal. I noticed the default VG/PG ratio is 90/10. That seems quite thick to me. I'm usually at either 30/70 VG/PG or 50/50.

Is it recommend at that ratio provided?

No. Don't think the "default" (meaning suggested ratio) is what pops up--it should say in the notes that they recommend and even split. The pop-up ratio is, from what I can tell, not based on anything. (see below)

Change that, apparently it no longer suggest anything on that liquid. Even still, I can pretty muich guarantee you that 90% VG is not the recommended ratio. I'd say go for 50/50 or 70 PG.

 

[Mr.Mann]

Form the Vanilla Wild Wood page (and many others): As with all our tobaccos (non-Aromatic, Aromatic and English Pipe blends) we recommend a 50/50 VG/PG or 30/70 VG/PG blend.

Also, I just noticed that Sahara Blend is automatcially at 100% VG becasue it can come that way, SC on the other hand, doesn't come in all VG. From what I can tell, they list the highest VG first--that's all.

 

[papabogart]

Form the Vanilla Wild Wood page (and many others): As with all our tobaccos (non-Aromatic, Aromatic and English Pipe blends) we recommend a 50/50 VG/PG or 30/70 VG/PG blend.

Also, I just noticed that Sahara Blend is automatcially at 100% VG becasue it can come that way, SC on the other hand, doesn't come in all VG. From what I can tell, they list the highest VG first--that's all.

Crap! This is my first A+, I always like to initially try juices at the recommended ratios and I assumed that the default was the recommended ratio like many other sites. I THOUGHT 90 was awful high, but Boba is 100 VG... Crap, crap, crap, CRAP!!!

 

[Apptiger]

Vecchio is a good straight vanilla with no other flavors

My in transit order has Vecchio in it. I have been resisting for a while but your comments, RP's reviews and feedback from some others finally got me to go for it.

On the poll, With the apparent stack/ campaign for NT, I was surprised and pleased that A+ took first in one category and second and or third in several others. I have some Kent's coming in the in transit order too.

 

[Jerms]

Crap! This is my first A+, I always like to initially try juices at the recommended ratios and I assumed that the default was the recommended ratio like many other sites. I THOUGHT 90 was awful high, but Boba is 100 VG... Crap, crap, crap, CRAP!!!

That sucks. Other than possibly needing longer to steep though, you'll be fine. Their juices are just as good at high vg.

 

[Mia11]

That's a shame, then. I would really love to try Ahlusion, but the lack of sample sizes makes it hard.

I feel you. Every single Xpress line sample size was unavailable! That kind of takes the wind out of my sails, since I wanted to try a variety in smaller sizes first. I'll have to form a "plan B", much more limited. This does make it hard for people like us who are trying to be new customers.

 

[papabogart]

Thanks Jerms, even if you are just trying to make me feel better.

 

[Jerms]

Thanks Jerms, even if you are just trying to make me feel better.

Lol, ok maybe a little.. but I've had high and all vg Ahl liquids sent to me from people here that were still very good. Maybe you'll like them better that way.. happy accident.. maybe?

 

[Mack813]

could you guys recommend me some fruit flavors?

 

[Mr.Mann]

Thanks Jerms, even if you are just trying to make me feel better.

Damn, papa. Well, if it's any consolation, I won't try to make you feel better! Sucks indeed. All I can say is that if the flavor strikes you as decent enough, buy it again but in a reverse ratio as to equal out at 50/50. Still sucks though, but with a couple free samples, maybe it won't have to break the bank. But...wait a minute..how much did you order???