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Any flavor RDA's that can take big fused clapton coils?

Discussion in 'RDA' started by Hoggy, Nov 21, 2018.

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  1. Hoggy

    Hoggy Super Member ECF Veteran

    Aug 6, 2013
    WI, USA
    As also posted on that 'other' forum...
    Can be single or dual coil.

    I like the Hadaly and Entheon for flavor, but the coil thickness is somewhat limited.

    I think I like velocity decks so far, as the hex grubs screws can dig in pretty deep on the claptons. This is with the Derringer, but I only have ~3 Derringers - and they don't seem to make the clones at FT anymore.
     
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  2. bombastinator

    bombastinator ECF Guru Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Sep 12, 2010
    MN USA
    Well the derringers whole thing was it was the smallest atty you can get, so little space is no surprise. I would say any RDA with bar clamps, and there are a lot of them, should work
     
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  3. Tonee N

    Tonee N Vaping Master Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Mar 24, 2017
    Nevada
    Goon 1.5

    Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk
     
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  4. Hoggy

    Hoggy Super Member ECF Veteran

    Aug 6, 2013
    WI, USA
    But don't you think bar clamps are worse for connections with claptons, since it connects to the outside clapton wrap wire? As opposed to velocity type decks using hex screws that dig in nicely.. Although they do seem to work fine with clamp decks like the Hadaly and Entheon (kinda to my surprise, actually).

    I was trying to get a big coil into an O-atty clone and the screw broke before the clapton seemed stable in its clamps. Of course, it could also be due to the fact that I was using an inferior clone - on top of trying to squeeze in a [too-big] monster coil (like (4x twisted 32g) * 2, fused with 40g - IIRC).
     
  5. Hoggy

    Hoggy Super Member ECF Veteran

    Aug 6, 2013
    WI, USA
    Hmm.. I've heard some others say that too, but when I tried it, I don't remember being impressed by the flavor. But that was earlier in my vaping career/hobby... And before I discovered the magic of fused claptons on top of using rayon. I think maybe I ought to try it again soon - god knows I made up enough slews of fused clapton after getting my Daedalus. :D
     
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  6. dc99

    dc99 Ultra Member Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Aug 17, 2014
    earth
    Flavor RDA's are designed for just that-flavor. Big multi core fused claptons arent really what I would call a flavor coil. The best flavor I get is with a hadlay with simple 24ga SS wire. You dont really have to choose flavor or cloud but you do have to choose which is most important and be prepared to give up a little of one of those with your choice.The goon,drop are good examples. Plenty of vapor and decent flavor but they are not the flavor you get from a hadlay.
     
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  7. mimöschen

    mimöschen Ultra Member ECF Veteran

    Jul 15, 2016
    For flavor and massive coils the Twisted Messes 24 Pro is very nice.
     
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  8. bombastinator

    bombastinator ECF Guru Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Sep 12, 2010
    MN USA
    Electricity follows the easiest path. In this case it’s through the wrap wire to the core wire and across
     
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  9. Hoggy

    Hoggy Super Member ECF Veteran

    Aug 6, 2013
    WI, USA
    I've recently come to wholeheartedly disagree with that assessment between fused and simple-round, for flavor. It's true that I didn't notice anything different between the twisteds I was already using and single-core claptons - but that changed big time when I started doing fused claptons with the Daedalus. So fused claptons are where it's really at as far as flavor is concerned - and flavor is all that matters to me. I still think anything beyond fused though, is pretty much coil-porn/build-enjoyment territory to me.

    I had a bunch of twisteds I had premade, and after discovering the magic of fused claptons, I knew I was never going back to ever use those twisteds again - so they would've just collected dust. So I did the next best thing and cut two halves and fused them with 40g wrap. Even though I used 40g wrap, many of those are still quite beefy since some were 4x32g twisted SS304.
     
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  10. Violetti Usva

    Violetti Usva Senior Member ECF Veteran

    Dec 1, 2017
    I agree with you to an extent but on mechanical mods the ramp up characteristics and width of different coils come into play. Straight forward clapton-ing has more wire mass than a staple fused clapton using the same wires and will come to the same resistance. On regulated devices I don't notice the difference between different types of complex coils. I do think that simple round wire just doesn't provide the flavour complex coils do and don't understand why some people are so vehement that there's no difference.

    EDIT: and thats not even mentioning the fact that complex coils wick much, much more efficiently than round wire.
     
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  11. Eskie

    Eskie ECF Guru Verified Member ECF Veteran

    May 6, 2016
    NY
    Cloud is easy. Flavor is much tougher as there are not only lots of variables, but different juices with different flavorings that will behave differently on different setups. Add the subjective nature of flavor, and in truth you can call just about any setup as perfect for you that will suck for me.

    Generally, smaller chamber moderate airflow RDAs will give the "best" flavor. Now you can play single wire different builds to optimize it. Once you want a large chamber with support for beefy dual coils you're also going to need lots of airflow to keep the whole thing from overheating. At that point trying for flavor as your primary endpoint will be challenging.

    Clamps are great for complex coils, especially several core fused Claptons that are essentially flat anyway. Conductivity is just fine.
     
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  12. Don29palms

    Don29palms Ultra Member ECF Veteran

    Sep 12, 2014
    joshua tree, ca
    Take a look at the Smoant Battlestar or Desire Mad Dog.
     
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  13. mimöschen

    mimöschen Ultra Member ECF Veteran

    Jul 15, 2016
    The MadDog is a nice flavorbanger that's still in my rotation.
    But you have to pull the coils as far out as possible directly over the airflow slots for the best flavor performance.
    That means with quad core fused claptons for example you might not have enough space to fit enough wraps in there. So it might be better to build larger than 3mm ID coils.
     
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  14. Letitia

    Letitia Citrus Junkie ECF Veteran

    Supporting member
    Apr 2, 2017
    West Frankfort, IL
    Personally I would look fora single coil deck that can accommodate the larger legs. Single coil allows for a smaller chamber which increases flavor. I went with a hermetic for dripping and the Recurve for squonking. The hermetic is a clamp style and can hold beefy coils, plenty of room.
     
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  15. Punk In Drublic

    Punk In Drublic Vaping Master ECF Veteran

    Aug 28, 2018
    Toronto, ON
    Not debating your claim, just don’t understand it. Perhaps you can elaborate.
     
  16. Hoggy

    Hoggy Super Member ECF Veteran

    Aug 6, 2013
    WI, USA
    Part of the reason could be that they're comparing simple round to single-core clapton.. To which I agree that I couldn't tell any difference. If it would come between simple round and fused, then possibly they don't want to think the added expense of buying pre-made coils would be worth it to them - so they don't think they notice anything. But the Daedalus puts claptoning within the reach of people that would otherwise have trouble with 'manually' claptoning, like by way of eyesight/disability reasons. Which puts them into the affordable arena.

    It's interesting you mention that complex coils wick faster - as I initially put that into the category of not being important since I use rayon due to its faster wicking. I would have thought there would be no difference since rayon wicks as fast as the coil demands liquid anyways.. And that could possibly explain why I noticed no difference between twisteds (which I always did for enjoyment), and single-core claptons. But I think the juice channels within fused claptons is what causes them to be special. Sort of like the rayon wicks as fast as the juice channels demand more liquid.
     
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  17. Violetti Usva

    Violetti Usva Senior Member ECF Veteran

    Dec 1, 2017
    I only realised when you quoted it that I said staple-fused rather than staggered fused, my apologies. I'm going to blame that on the sunshine, moonlight, good times and the boogie...

    To elaborate on why staggered claptons ramp up faster - the outer wire has very little influence on the overall resistance as electricity travels via the easiest path. Making staggered coils means there's more space between the wraps of the outer wire and thus less wire overall for the same length of finished wire. Therefore the finished wire would have less mass and the same resistance. I personally can't tell the difference in flavour on a regulated device but on a mechanical mod the difference in ramp up does seem to influence the flavour.

    Wow, if rayon really is that much better I can't wait to run out of cotton and try it. Probably going to be a few years still...
     
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  18. Punk In Drublic

    Punk In Drublic Vaping Master ECF Veteran

    Aug 28, 2018
    Toronto, ON
    Thank you. I understand that current will take the path of least resistance but that is not what I was inquiring about.

    Now bare with me, it’s early and I do sometimes get confused over the many different types of coils – alien’s, juggernauts, fused, stapled etc. But a Clapton coil by definition is a single lower gauge core with a single higher gauge wrap. What these gauge’s are is up to the designer of the coil and are not bound to any specifics.

    My understanding is that a Staggered Fused Clapton is essentially 2 cores of lower gauge wire that are wrapped each in a staggered fashion with a higher gauge. They are then fused in parallel with another higher gauge wrap that is also staggered.

    You claim this type of wire should be of a similar resistance as the same Clapton coil but with a lower mass. This I do not understand. Within the limitations of a vaping coil should we use the same metal, say Kanthal, and the same dimensions of coil, say 3mm ID with 5 wraps, you will never achieve the same resistance between the 2 types of coils…it’s impossible. Should we use the same gauge, say 26 awg for the cores and 36 awg for the wraps, plus same coil dimensions of 3mm ID and 5 wraps, the Staggered Fused coil will always be of lower resistance and of higher mass.

    Ramp up time is dependent on the Specific Heat Capacity of the metal used, the mass of the metal and the resistance of the metal. If using the same metal, again say Kanthal, then the Specific Heat Capacity will remain the same. However, changing the mass will always change the resistance to which both will affect the ramp up time.

    When dealing with complex coils, such as a Staggered Fused Clapton there is no easy equation that states it will always ramp up quicker than just a regular Clapton of the same dimensions. I am open to the fact that one could design a Staggered Fused Clapton that performs in such a manor by using specific gauges, but that would require some extreme attention to the design.
     
  19. Violetti Usva

    Violetti Usva Senior Member ECF Veteran

    Dec 1, 2017
    The outer wrap doesn't particularly affect the resistance of the coil as electricity follows the path of the least resistance, its just there to provide nooks and crannies for juice to get trapped in. Sure, if you for some reason wrapped 40 guage wire with 10 guage wire or something then the outer wire may be the path of least resistance but there's no benefit to doing that. The result is that staggered fused claptons ramp up faster on mechanical mods (which may or may not be what one wants)
     
  20. Skunk!

    Skunk! Vaping Master ECF Veteran

    Jan 25, 2014
    Las Vegas
    20181117_114306.jpg
    Hex core Clapton in the Advken Gorge
     
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