Anyone see last nights NBC News story on e-cigs?(video link)

[CheekyChica]

So last night I was watching the NBC Nightly News and the last story on was about e-cigs. It was mostly positive but says "Big tobacco" companies are investing in e-cigs. So can e-cigs win the battle and become mainstream? Then why do so many legislatures in states and cities fight it? Loads of questions, but none the less an intresting video to see! What do ya'll think?

 

[Coastal Cowboy]

I am amazed. That was actually a fair segment.

 

[bikerbeagle]

If the FDA is successful in banning menthol from tobacco cigarettes, you can virtually guarantee that juice flavoring will be next on their chopping block using the same argument. If you are a vaper, you should be following the menthol case very closely. Attempting to pull a popular product from widespread use (and there are many more menthol cigarette users than vapers) is practically an unprecedented move since prohibition. My guess is, even if the FDA wins the argument, Congress will step in and block the actual banning and removal from stores - they won't allow this to happen to, literally, millions of voters - but, the downside is, this will allow the FDA to come after us and I doubt Congress will be so willing to step up to the same plate for our cause.

 

[EddardinWinter]

If the FDA is successful in banning menthol from tobacco cigarettes, you can virtually guarantee that juice flavoring will be next on their chopping block using the same argument. If you are a vaper, you should be following the menthol case very closely. Attempting to pull a popular product from widespread use (and there are many more menthol cigarette users than vapers) is practically an unprecedented move since prohibition. My guess is, even if the FDA wins the argument, Congress will step in and block the actual banning and removal from stores - they won't allow this to happen to, literally, millions of voters - but, the downside is, this will allow the FDA to come after us and I doubt Congress will be so willing to step up to the same plate for our cause.

I am mixed on this issue. On the one hand, anything that creates tension between the FDA and BT is a good thing. I have been concerned about them working together.

On the other hand, you are right, e-liquid menthol is certainly next on the chopping block. We must help to prevent this precedent. I know CASAA is up to speed on the issue, and will formulate a winning strategy to fight this effectively. We have to support smokers rights, too, IMHO.

 

[Penn]

If menthol cigarettes were all that was available, I may not have ever smoked. I can't stand those things. So did this "study" account for people like me?

 

[Coastal Cowboy]

If the FDA is successful in banning menthol from tobacco cigarettes, you can virtually guarantee that juice flavoring will be next on their chopping block using the same argument. If you are a vaper, you should be following the menthol case very closely. Attempting to pull a popular product from widespread use (and there are many more menthol cigarette users than vapers) is practically an unprecedented move since prohibition. My guess is, even if the FDA wins the argument, Congress will step in and block the actual banning and removal from stores - they won't allow this to happen to, literally, millions of voters - but, the downside is, this will allow the FDA to come after us and I doubt Congress will be so willing to step up to the same plate for our cause.

Such a move wouldn't survive an equal protection challenge in federal court. You cannot treat two tobacco product manufacturers differently without a compelling reason to do so, so banning flavored nicotine liquid while continuing to allow menthol cigarettes constitutes discrimination against the liquid manufacturers.

Even if it did survive the challenge, the ban would be unenforceable. What's to prevent liquid manufacturers from selling the liquid and "flavor ingredients" separately? One bottle holds the unflavored nic juice, the other bottle contains the flavoring mixtures at the proper concentration and volume to create the desired flavor.

Vendor ships the products. Buyer mixes the juice, steeps it, and vapes.

 

[Bob Chill]

I saw the piece and though it was really fair considering it's a major network news piece.

The thing I can't quite wrap my head around is the banning of flavored juice. Yea, it goes along the same lines as flavored cigs but not really. Don't you have to scientifically determine vaping is harmful and has dire consequences first?

My 16 year old can buy alcohol free drink mixes in the grocery store but would have trouble getting a bottle of vodka to go with it (how much trouble it would actually be is another discussion. lol).

It would be near impossible to ban the flavorings themselves. Maybe there is a separation of nic and flavor? But then again, I can go to a liquor store and buy ready to go mixed drinks.

I think a couple of things would have to be proven first. #1, vaping would need to be proven to be a gateway to cigarettes. #2, vaping would have to be proven to have dire health consequences. I'm not sure either one is even on the table. At least not on the table if the truth is presented. Lies and bad science can accomplish anything though.

 

[Penn]

I think a couple of things would have to be proven first. #1, vaping would need to be proven to be a gateway to cigarettes. #2, vaping would have to be proven to have dire health consequences. I'm not sure either one is even on the table. At least not on the table if the truth is presented. Lies and bad science can accomplish anything though.

FDA is an arm of the government. We are living in a time when many people worship government as their god. God has no need to prove anything in a scientific way, just enough to convince gullible people.

 

[Absintheur]

Can't help but notice they really worked at showing the youngest looking people they could find a few times in there.

 

[Bob Chill]

FDA is an arm of the government. We are living in a time when many people worship government as their god. God has no need to prove anything in a scientific way, just enough to convince gullible people.

True, but in this case BT will lead the charge with the science part. If the science part shakes out as we all expect it to, it's likely that the FDA's hand will be turned regardless of what they "want" to do. We may all despise BT but we need them on this fight.

 

[XeniaMike]

FDA is an arm of the government. We are living in a time when many people worship government as their god. God has no need to prove anything in a scientific way, just enough to convince gullible people.

Yes, its sad when every day you wonder how your government is going to screw you this time. It wasn't enough they raked in the money on cigarette taxes from me for 30 years of my life, now let's mess with vaping. Thieves I tell ya!

 

[soba1]

I am mixed on this issue. On the one hand, anything that creates tension between the FDA and BT is a good thing. I have been concerned about them working together.

On the other hand, you are right, e-liquid menthol is certainly next on the chopping block. We must help to prevent this precedent. I know CASAA is up to speed on the issue, and will formulate a winning strategy to fight this effectively. We have to support smokers rights, too, IMHO.

I do agree with you who;e heartedly on that..................
Out of control regulation.

 

[soba1]

I am amazed. That was actually a fair segment.

Thats why never loose hope always believe in miracles.................................
I have said it before but I will say it again. Its all a part of the
shift in conciousness.
Just enjoy the journey

 

[VapHer]

The segment was fair, I agree, but I'm also mixed on how I feel about the segment. They showed a lot younger people, which I feel biased the vaping population, and I think they focused on it being more of a 'trend' than anything (which I understand is part of sensationalizing to viewers.) Overall the segment was alright, but I'd be interested in seeing a more in depth segment.

It did worry me about the FDA and big tobacco companies hopping on the PV sales

 

[V4Vendetta]

E cigs are surprisingly not legal in some countries in Asia. I think it has more to do with 1) how the government can get tax money on the equipment and ejuice and 2) tobacco companies not wanting any competition.

 

[Talyon]

A very interesting piece indeed, however I disagree with the analogy that we don't know what's in the Eliquids, we do know and have known for several years now, however I suggest that with today's technology we even know the longer term effects.

What we don't know is the exact amount of pg/vg nic and flavoring in each bottle we buy, which to me is no big deal but I can understand many waning to know. However do we know exactly what is in everything we consume, inhale drink etc etc. Nope.

 

[Robino1]

And the FDA brings up the children issue again. That really is the only thing that they keep doing to alarm parents. I started with menthol cigs, not because I liked them but just because that's what my mother smoked at the time.

Arggggggggg the FDA and ANTZ really get me angry and frustrated.

 

[Bob Chill]

I was instructed to start drinking coffee when I was 15 years old by my parents and vice principal. I guess sleeping in class is frowned upon. Nice little boost from a naturally occurring stimulant fixed the problem. And here I am 30 years later drinking 2 cups of coffee every single day and I'm no worse for it.

Nic in itself isn't a devil. We consume it all the time. It's simply not a big deal. Kids drinking 8 monster energy drinks and freaking out is far worse imo. Remove the combustion or destruction of mouth tissue by dipping and all we are left with is nic. This is a very multi-faceted issue and quite complicated but it's simple in some respects as well.

The miracle that soba suggests does exist. Nic simply needs to be put on the same level as caffeine. If this happens then it becomes a household consumable that nobody worries about. I wouldn't wager on that even with 10-1 odds but who knows. Maybe this time our gov serves us instead of failing us.

 

[soba1]

Always expect miracles. Most here in this forum have already experienced one big one, giving up the stinkies...

 

[CheekyChica]

The segment was fair, I agree, but I'm also mixed on how I feel about the segment. They showed a lot younger people, which I feel biased the vaping population, and I think they focused on it being more of a 'trend' than anything (which I understand is part of sensationalizing to viewers.) Overall the segment was alright, but I'd be interested in seeing a more in depth segment.

It did worry me about the FDA and big tobacco companies hopping on the PV sales

My exact thought as well, its because we're Texans lol

What about those flavored cigarallos like Black N' Mild's? Why are they, seems to me never mentioned? Thats more appealing imo to youth than menthol flavor. Thats what all the kids want, that cool Vick's vapor rub taste.

Also the whole time they were saying," We don't really know whats in this so called 'water vapor'?" Well I know whats in mine! I'm DIY all the way! So are ALOT of people.

.....and I like the girl at the end, shes all like," Yeah, like umm, like thats good...uhhuh....like, does it come in bling and hot pink?" I'm joking and exagerating, she didnt say that but thats what I'd think she say... actually that sounds alot like what I'd say...wait a minute! rofl